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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Effect of outside control on the human psyche
    #9774815 -

human consciousness has an innate thirst for knowledge of the outside world.  eventually, humans are mature enough and plenty capable of doing the "right" thing and on deciding what the "right" thing is.  however, due to government interference, humans are babied.  it is assumed that they do not know or do not think about what is "decent" behavior.

if people took the time to truly consider their actions, they would realize how selfish they act, even those who aren't criminals.  humans have a subconscious instinct to rebel against authority and to figure things out for themselves, and due to this shadowy, controlling body of regulation, humans often find themselves "rebelling(they do not realize they are rebelling)" when they are truly acting like barbarians or idiots. 

by resisting outside attempts at control, the facet of human nature that causes us to rebel tends to create rebellion with no discernible goal.  this is "rebellion" inside the system.  it is not expanding or destroying, but a form of ego masturbation.  people find themselves doing drugs, subconsciously thinking that they are cool or rebellious for doing so.  however, this subconscious occupation with rebellion does not find its way outside of the "system" without the necessary awareness. 

people take drugs while feeling outside of the system and 'cool' and 'rebellious', when really, they are engaging in child-like, irrational resistance.  in comparison, children often fight and resist their parents. however, once the child realizes that everything the parent does is out of love, the child has an expanded awareness and accepts and appreciates the parents attempts of helpfulness. 

however, our unnatural body of control, the government, does not have its citizens best interests in concern as genuinely as parents do.  this creates a subconscious filled irrationalities and resistance in people who feel under the control of this unintentionally harmful, controlling body of authority.



sorry, that this is unorganized and not proof-read but i wanted to get it out in a quick train of thought...

Edit: I wanted to quickly add that this post is based solely off of my speculations about my experiences.  I will respond tomorrow when I have more time.

Edited by NastyDHL (02/10/09 11:26 PM)

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: NastyDHL]
    #9775949 -

"...however, due to government interference, humans are babied.  it is assumed that they do not know or do not think about what is "decent" behavior."

Can you give us an example where this is true?


"if people took the time to truly consider their actions, they would realize how selfish they act, even those who aren't criminals."

Once somebody has been a certain way for some time, it is hard for them to change. I'm sure many people have already come to the realization of how selfish they act, and consequently have accepted that it is much easier to remain being that way than to change.


"humans have a subconscious instinct to rebel against authority and to figure things out for themselves, and due to this shadowy, controlling body of regulation, humans often find themselves "rebelling(they do not realize they are rebelling)" when they are truly acting like barbarians or idiots."

Sources?
I'm not sure if rebelling against authority is an instinct as much as it is an attitude that develops through logical reasoning.

Quote:
humans often find themselves "rebelling(they do not realize they are rebelling)" when they are truly acting like barbarians or idiots


Can you clarify this quote?


"by resisting outside attempts at control, the facet of human nature that causes us to rebel tends to create rebellion with no discernible goal.  this is "rebellion" inside the system."

Maybe there's no discernible goal, but there sure is a discernible intent; the intent of not letting anybody control your life for you.


"it is not expanding or destroying, but a form of ego masturbation."

Expanding or destroying what?


people find themselves doing drugs, subconsciously thinking that they are cool or rebellious for doing so.

This isn't absolutely true. Many people, like myself, won't use a drug until they've properly researched it. I didn't decide to use drugs to be cool or rebellious; I used them because of the things I learned about them, which interested me very much.


"however, this subconscious occupation with rebellion does not find its way outside of the "system" without the necessary awareness."

What do you mean by "...find(ing) its way outside of the "system"..."? Necessary awareness of what?


"people take drugs while feeling outside of the system and 'cool' and 'rebellious', when really, they are engaging in child-like, irrational resistance.  in comparison, children often fight and resist their parents."

Again, although this may be true for many people, it is not true for all. Are you positing that drug use is necessarily immature?


"however, once the child realizes that everything the parent does is out of love, the child has an expanded awareness and accepts and appreciates the parents attempts of helpfulness."

I think this is mostly true, however, not every parent is perfect, therefore, not everything a parent does is helpful. This realization by children may partially explain why they sometimes resist their parents.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: NastyDHL]
    #9776357 -

The Government controls us, Wall Street controls us, Madison Ave. controls us.  We rarely have a minute where we are not controlled and manipulated.  It appears that it's human nature to easily give up control, and in most cases not to rebel.  Humans seem to need the comfort of having some one in charge, some one to take the weight of responsibility off of their backs. The fault is not with them, it's with us!

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: C.M. Mann]
    #9777440 -

It's not your fault. You were born into captivity. But it is your choice to try and change and IMO to some extent it can be done.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: Icelander]
    #9778112 -

Quote:
Meanwhile back in the year One --- when you belonged to no-one ---
you didn't stand a chance son, if your pants were undone.
`Cause you were bred for humanity and sold to society ---
one day you'll wake up in the Present Day ---
a million generations removed from expectations
of being who you really want to be.

Skating away ---
skating away ---
skating away on the thin ice of the New Day.




--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #9778770 -

JT

BTW that last voyage seems to have had quite a beneficial effect on me.:lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: NastyDHL]
    #9779203 -

Still there are people, who 'hope' that their outside world or the change of it will change their  psyche, like being in any addiction.
I think it has to be done vice versa.

Ice, wb :thumbup:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: Icelander]
    #9780729 -

Icelander said:
It's not your fault. You were born into captivity. But it is your choice to try and change and IMO to some extent it can be done.


You're back!  :whoo:


To what extent would you say this change is possible?


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #9783886 -

I think you are correct. But a helpful environment that supports change is a mighty big carrot.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Effect of outside control on the human psyche [Re: Icelander]
    #9784591 -

In every way, yes. But on the other hand one should never rely (too much) on it, especially if it's 'made of'(wd?) people :grin:

edit:you know, I know a girl who wants to settle away only because she wants to get away from her relation. That's ridiculous, I think.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

Edited by BlueCoyote (02/12/09 01:48 PM)

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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