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OfflineEllis Dee
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US: Government to use military for domestic LE.
    #765138 - 07/21/02 06:07 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Ridge: Terror threat to force government to use military for domestic law enforcement
U.S. Mulls Military's Domestic Role
Sun Jul 21, 4:44 PM ET
By SCOTT LINDLAW, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) - Homeland security chief Tom Ridge says the threat of terrorism may force government planners to consider using the military for domestic law enforcement, now largely prohibited by federal law.

President Bush ( news - web sites) has called on Congress to thoroughly review the law that bans the Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines from participating in arrests, searches, seizure of evidence and other police-type activity on U.S. soil. The Coast Guard and National Guard troops under the control of state governors are excluded from the Reconstruction-era law, known as the "Posse Comitatus Act."

Ridge said Sunday that it "goes against our instincts as a country to empower the military with the ability to arrest," and called the prospect "very unlikely."

But he said the government is wise to examine the law.

"We need to be talking about military assets, in anticipation of a crisis event," Ridge said on "Fox News Sunday." "And clearly, if you're talking about using the military, then you should have a discussion about posse comitatus."

Two influential Democratic senators agreed with Bush and Ridge that the law ought to be reviewed, but expressed no interest in granting the military new powers to arrest American citizens.

Sen. Carl Levin ( news, bio, voting record), chairman Senate Armed Services Committee ( news - web sites), said posse comitatus "has served us well for a long time."

"It's kept the military out of law enforcement, out of arresting people except in the most unusual emergency situations like a riot or after some kind of a disaster where they have to protect against looting," Levin, D-Mich., said on CNN's "Late Edition."

However, he said: "I don't fear looking at it to see whether or not our military can be more helpful in a very supportive and assisting role even than they have been up to now ? providing equipment, providing training, those kind of things which do not involve arresting people."

Sen. Joe Biden, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, said he favors expanding the military's role in responding to major catastrophes such as an attack by a weapon of mass destruction.

The law "has to be amended, but we're not talking about general police power," Biden, D-Del., said on "Fox News Sunday."

Air Force Gen. Ralph E. Eberhart, who heads the new military command charged with defending American territory, told The New York Times he favors changing the law to grant greater domestic powers to the military to protect against terror attacks. He offered no specific changes he favored.

Congress is racing to approve legislation by the end of its session this fall that would make Bush's proposed Department of Homeland Security a reality.

In the Senate, a version of the measure by Governmental Affairs Committee Chairman Joseph Lieberman, D-Conn., tracks closely with Bush's plan. It also would augment the agency's ability to gather and analyze intelligence from the FBI ( news - web sites), CIA ( news - web sites) and others.

That bill is to be considered by the Senate committee Wednesday.

House Majority Leader Dick Armey said on NBC's "Meet the Press" there was a strong possibility Congress will resolve its differences and send Bush a bill enacting the sweeping government reorganization by Sept. 11.

Some lawmakers have expressed concern about rushing decisions on far-reaching changes in the bureaucracy, but Armey said: "It's time to move forward with this. The president's got a good plan."

Bush planned to give a speech Monday about his proposed new department and view demonstrations of high-technology devices for combatting terrorism that are being developed at the Argonne National Laboratory in Illinois.



--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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Offlinemr freedom
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Re: US: Government to use military for domestic LE. [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #768747 - 07/22/02 08:46 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

"CHECK MATE!!!! First, you position your pieces, then, when the time is right, you strike."

So much for the "pussy communist" act.


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Anonymous

Re: US: Government to use military for domestic LE. [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #768760 - 07/22/02 08:50 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Should I be buying more .308 & .223 ammo?


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: US: Government to use military for domestic LE. [Re: mr freedom]
    #768916 - 07/22/02 09:43 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Mr Freedom, I agree, if Caesar crosses the Rubicon, it's check, and mate! That's how Rome's republic died.

Evolving, 308 and 223 are expensive. I'de say don't go overboard and spend the money on ammo if you're not going to shoot it when you might save it and still have it. When I had my AR-15 I only kept about 40 rounds on hand between range trips. If it makes you feel good, then sure, stock up. I've never felt the need. Only thing I keep a lot of around is .38 special and that's just because lately I've got some extremely good deals and stocked up for later.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


Edited by Ellis Dee (07/22/02 09:45 PM)


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Offlinemr freedom
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Registered: 02/26/01
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Re: US: Government to use military for domestic LE. [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #776331 - 07/25/02 04:28 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

This is why I use 223. I also reccomend that one not dismiss the .22 for it's excellent flexibility and usefulness as a training weapon and small game rifle.

By Birddog

There has been much debate on what is the best way for long term storage of ammo, and while I cant say its wrong to place your ammo in a bucket and suck out all the air and replace it with nitrogen I can say it is a waste of valuable resources. O.K. if you plan being cryogenically frozen for hundreds of years then maybe. The rest of us just need to know what is the best way to properly store ammo so that it doesn’t degrade over a period of time and that it functions as designed when put into use. Now I need to give you some background on how and for what condition ammo is built. Military cartridges are designed so that they can withstand storage temperatures from minus 65 degrees F. to 122 F. So as long as you don’t keep them in a oven your fine. There made for soldiers to use in battlefield conditions under the most horrible conditions conceivable and still function. The manufactures (OLIN, Winchester, Remington Etc.) know this and they also know they will lose a big fat Govt contract if they don’t pass this criteria. Here is one for you, the same folks that make 5.56mm make the exact same cartridge and call it a 223 change the label and sell it civilian. Same with 308 (7.62 NATO). So now you know that there is hardly any difference between civilian and military ammunition manufacturing. Lets get down to storage.

Shelf life refers to how long an item can remain in storage and still be functional. Well all military small arms have an indefinite shelf life. This means as long as it is properly stored it will never go bad.

Service life refers to how long a item can remain in a operating configuration and still be functional. Small arms should be good from anywhere from 6 months to 18 months before you need inspect it. If the ammo has some corrosion on it take some copper wool or steel wool and take it off then its good to go unless it is to the stage of pitting then get rid of it. Now most ammo comes in a wooden outer container with metal inner packs that holds the ammo. We store it on at least two inches of dunnage to keep off the floor. It is inspected every five years and then only ten percent is checked for defects and then thrown back into storage for another 5 yrs. (if nothing is wrong). So now what can you do as a civilian to store your ammo? Your number one enemy is moisture, as long as you have a waterproof container you are fine. I use empty 20mm ammunition containers that you can get from any surplus store although PVC pipe will do. Try and keep the cartridges in the original packing and try and keep away from metal to metal contact. To ensure that the ammo has no moisture I throw in a couple of dehumidifier packages. This is strictly optional as we don’t even do that in the military. Whether its military ammo you got at a gun show or 22 shells from K-mart its all the same. Before you store it make sure its clean, dry( and wiped off if you touched it) and that’s it! Wow almost too simple. You don’t need to vacuum seal it, and you don’t need to store it at any particular temperature just keep it dry and out of the elements and leave it alone. I have been working with munitions for over 11 years, and this is what they have trained me. I hope this sheds some understanding on storage.



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