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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Karma
    #6291329 -

Has one ever considered an act that one has engaged in to be the universe's way of distributing due karma?

For example, the other day I was on my way home from lunch, and was behind another vehicle. We had the right-a-way, but some moron tried pulling out in front of the vehicle in front of me. I laid on my horn and they both stopped, and then the car in front of me started driving again. As I passed the other vehicle at the intersection, I flipped them off in a passive yet firm manner. :lol:

Apparently this upset them, the fact that another individual would say "hey, fuck you for endangering our driving experience", so they made the decision to continue being a moron by turning onto our street and stepping on it, apparently to act all tough, like "Hey, look at me, I am going to speed up on you and act all tough", or something.

When I became aware of this via my rearview mirror, I slammed on my brakes. Clearly, the moron was not capable of exercising a degree of control over his vehicle, as he slammed his vehicle into my truck, not being able to react to the conditions on the road.

I drove off with a dented-in bumper and a subtle headache. I wonder what the moron told the police officer that I saw talking to him when I drove back by in my car. :lol: I don't think there is any way to describe a situation in which your front-end has collided with some other object to portray oneself as not being liable. :smirk:

Do you think that I might have conveyed a lesson for him to learn? Perhaps something that I should have learned from this? I suspect that I could probably take a hammer to my bumper and fix it. My actions could possibly be seen as "trolling", but the fact remains that flipping someone else off when they do not obey the rules and laws of the road, in place due to safety risks inherent, would seem valid, and also that using one's brakes is not going to cause someone behind you to collide with your vehicle. Clearly, they got what they deserved, and I was merely, slightly inconvienced.

The only thing that I think I should have done differently is that I should have stayed to speak with the police. They should have paid for my bumper, and I would have enjoyed the opportunity to express to the police in a calm and matter-of-fact manner that the vehicle in front of me began to slow down, and so I started deaccelerating, when, suddenly, the vehicle that almost pulled out in front of the vehicle in front of me struck my vehicle. :lol:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291360 -

Shouldn't that be spelled "CARma"?  :smirk:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291426 -

If the person had half a brain (I suspect they did because they slammed on there brakes before hitting the car in front of you.) they probably realized they were in the wrong immediately. Maybe even got a wake up call to pay more attention to the road. Flipping them off probably wasn't necessary. Your negative response to a foolish action resulted in another negative response (them pulling out behind you) and yet another negative response by you (slamming on the brakes)

I guess my point and opinion is that karma had nothing to do with this situation. It was just a series of foolish incidents.

But hey, I don't even believe in karma. It's B.S.

I used to strongly believe my actions good and bad (+ -)were all basically added together and the result would effect the results of anything in my life left to chance.

A friend of my father is one of the nicest people I have ever met. And if you bring up his name in any group of people you get the same reply "nice guy". I don't know a person who has had more terrible things happen to them in there life time. I once brought up the topic of karma with him...his words exactly.

SHIT HAPPENS


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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291470 -

Or from another point of view:

There was almost an accident, but one guy in a car honked his horn to alert the drivers. As he passed by the car that almost caused the accident, he felt justified in expressing his dissatisfaction by giving him the finger. Because of this, anger arose in him. Unable to control his mind, he was engulfed in anger and chose to go after the guy who just flipped him off.

He was following the guy when the guy in front noticed and slammed on the breaks, probably not out of compassion, but probably motivated by some form of pride or anger. Mind clouded, the guy in the rear couldn't react in time and so crashed into the first guy. Thus causing him a fair amount of suffering and dismay and even more anger, and causing the guy in front some suffering and perhaps a sense of self-righteousness.


I don't think that individuals should be in the business of handing out justice as they see fit, or there would be tremendous levels of suffering. Instead, if one was motivated by compassion, then there is a much greater chance of eliminating suffering for all involved.

:heart:


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: Karma [Re: dblaney]
    #6291478 -

An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind.


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Re: Karma [Re: musher_420]
    #6291480 -

Quote:
But hey, I don't even believe in karma. It's B.S.

I used to strongly believe my actions good and bad (+ -)were all basically added together and the result would effect the results of anything in my life left to chance.

A friend of my father is one of the nicest people I have ever met. And if you bring up his name in any group of people you get the same reply "nice guy". I don't know a person who has had more terrible things happen to them in there life time. I once brought up the topic of karma with him...his words exactly.

SHIT HAPPENS



Indeed, shit does happen. But the appropriate question for your father's friend would have been whether he was happy or whether he suffered a lot.

Karma, as I understand it, means that positive causes have positive results, and negative causes lead to negative results.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: Karma [Re: dblaney]
    #6291483 -

Good point. It was definitely a power play. :smirk:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291496 -

:smirk:



:smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk::smirk:


:grin:

That smiley always gets to me.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: Karma [Re: dblaney]
    #6291503 -

Also, it wasn't as though I instantly slammed on my brakes. It was gradual, but clearly not as gradual as simply letting go of the gas.

As for the eye for an eye comment, I do not understand how it pertains to this discussion in the least.

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291515 -

So, am I right in understanding that you intentionally slammed on your brakes to make the guy slam into you?  The way I see it, the flip off was in between deserved and not.  The dude getting behind you [and i am assuming he was tailgating you severely... ] was wrong in intention only, but you slamming your brakes was totally uncalled for.  His initial mistake did not, thankfully, cause any physical damage.  Karma or no, the way I see it you are the one who ended up being in the wrong.

:2cents:


--------------------
Don't dream it;be it
===================================

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291525 -

Quick question: Is the person who creates a math test a troll due to the nature of the test being such that an individual could fail it?

For instance, one could speculate on the intentions of both myself and the other driver, and yet, all speculative judgements aside, the fact remains that I personally did not almost run my truck into another vehicle, nor did I smash my truck into the rear-end of another vehicle. The notion that perhaps I should not have slown down due to the fact that another person was intent on driving too close to my vehicle is not a reasonable one, and it lies at odds with the concept of driving and the act thereof.

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291564 -

Quote:
For instance, one could speculate on the intentions of both myself and the other driver, and yet, all speculative judgements aside, the fact remains that I personally did not almost run my truck into another vehicle, nor did I smash my truck into the rear-end of another vehicle.



This may be true.

Quote:
The notion that perhaps I should not have slown down due to the fact that another person was intent on driving too close to my vehicle is not a reasonable one, and it lies at odds with the concept of driving and the act thereof.



On the contrary, I think it is a perfectly reasonable one. Maybe he did want to drive really close to you in order to provoke an emotional reaction on your part. And actually, it sounds like he succeeded! It was completely within your power to ignore him and just let it go. Instead, you chose to try to show him the error of his ways by putting on the breaks, knowing full well that doing so had the potential to cause harm.

Regardless of whether or not he was in the wrong, it seems to me like you were also in the wrong.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: Karma [Re: musher_420]
    #6291586 -

musher_420 said:
If the person had half a brain (I suspect they did because they slammed on there brakes before hitting the car in front of you.) they probably realized they were in the wrong immediately.  Maybe even got a wake up call to pay more attention to the road.  Flipping them off probably wasn't necessary.  Your negative response to a foolish action resulted in another negative response (them pulling out behind you) and yet another negative response by you (slamming on the brakes)

I guess my point and opinion is that karma had nothing to do with this situation.  It was just a series of incidents.





To me, Karma is the divine law of cause and effect and like he said, the chain reaction of cause and effect leading up to your smashed bumper is laid out to witness.

If you had anything to learn from it, it would be to stop flipping people off.

I've heard stories of people being chased and having their tires shot at because they flipped someone off on the road. Not worth it. Use your horn to wake up a sleepy driver who isn't paying attention and then move along.

Though I am terribly sorry for your bumper damage, and glad no one got hurt, the story is sort of funny.

Be safe FG!

:heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.

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Re: Karma [Re: younikrawn]
    #6291604 -

younikrawn said:
The dude getting behind you [and i am assuming he was tailgating you severely... ] was wrong in intention only, but you slamming your brakes was totally uncalled for.



Uncalled for? How so? As a driver, I am interested in the safety of myself and of others on the road, not to mention the condition of my vehicle, as well as others. If using my brakes to slow my vehicle down is uncalled for, due to the fact that a presumably emotionally imbalanced individual has made the unwise decision to accelerate to a speed over the limit in order to ride my ass (both illegal and dangerous), then I guess what would be more reasonable is the thought that I should have maintained a speed at which more damage would likely occur.

Quote:
  His initial mistake did not, thankfully, cause any physical damage.  Karma or no, the way I see it you are the one who ended up being in the wrong.




As far as the road is concerned, I was able to control my vehicle and the other individual was not. I personally violated no rule, whereas the other individual neglected the right-of-way, drove over the speed limit, and then tailgated another vehicle to the point at which they were unable to use their brake without being struck from behind. Perhaps if they had braked, they wouldn't have hit me. The lesson of allowing all vehicles room to deaccelerate, including their own, was hopefully not lost on them. :lol:

Your conclusion that I was in the wrong seems severely distorted. :shrug:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #6291669 -

gettinjiggywithit said:
To me, Karma is the divine law of cause and effect and like he said, the chain reaction of cause and effect leading up to your smashed bumper is laid out to witness.



This is a great point, and the concept of "Karma" as a chain reaction of cause and effect is congruent with the manner in which I am referring to it. Ultimately, I proposed the story because the nature of the actions within the situation (karma/cause and effect) convey reality and an opportunity to learn. Also, as your last comment refers to, the situation was simply hilarious. :lol:

Quote:
If you had anything to learn from it, it would be to stop flipping people off.



Perhaps that is something I should learn. I've only flipped people off when they disobey the rules of the road, thus interupting the flow of traffic and pose a threat to the well-being of other drivers, their property, and, if nothing else, their convience (who wants to be stuck behind a pile up because someone cannot focus on the present moment they are immersed in?). In such a situation, the window of opportunity to express one's view on the matter is extremely limited, and the form in which one can express themselves is just as limited, and flipping someone off seems to naturally protrude from that. :grin:

Quote:
I've heard stories of people being chased and having their tires shot at because they flipped someone off on the road. Not worth it. Use your horn to wake up a sleepy driver who isn't paying attention and then move along.



The only reason that I typically would not use a horn to say "hey, dumbfuck, stop threatening us" is because, in the confusion of the interruption of the flow, others might think I am honking at them (say, for instance, the person in front of me, who had to brake quickly to avoid the collision), and the misinterpreted message might aggravate them. Flipping them off ensures that there is no unintentional misperception. :grin:

Someone pulls a gun and starts shooting at my vehicle and they'll have entered into a world of pain. :evil:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291733 -

fireworks_god said:
Apparently this upset them, the fact that another individual would say "hey, fuck you for endangering our driving experience", so they made the decision to continue being a moron by turning onto our street and stepping on it, apparently to act all tough, like "Hey, look at me, I am going to speed up on you and act all tough", or something.

When I became aware of this via my rearview mirror, I slammed on my brakes. Clearly, the moron was not capable of exercising a degree of control over his vehicle, as he slammed his vehicle into my truck, not being able to react to the conditions on the road.




No where in your original post did you state a reason for your slamming on the brakes, so was I wrong in assuming that there was not a need to slam on your brakes? If there was a legitimate reason for you to slam on your brakes after you knew that this guy was tailgating you, then it isn't anyone's fault but his as he made the poor judgment to follow too closely in the first place. If there wasn't a legitimate reason for your brake-age, then you are in the wrong.

Unless there are details of the situation that you left out of your post, I understand where you are coming from. But I don't see how you can say my judgment of the situation could be distorted.

In either case... driving away from the scene of an accident? A bad call in any case


--------------------
Don't dream it;be it
===================================

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Re: Karma [Re: younikrawn]
    #6291802 -

As far as driving away from the scene of an accident goes, the only concern is a legal one. Might've made life a bit more difficult for the police and the insurance company, I guess. :shrug: I guess I should have stuck around to get my bumper paid for. :smirk:

The legitimate reason for using my brake is the simple fact that I have a brake and that I felt that I needed to slow my vehicle down. Perhaps it would have been more reasonable to accelerate in order to restore a safe driving distance between myself and their vehicle? :lol:

Clearly, I did not personally create an unsafe driving environment for anyone. I wasn't running after someone with a knife aimed at their back.

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291845 -

A lot of people tend to view karma as a sort of moral bank account. I think this perception is deceptive. The way I see it, karma is more about the energy one puts out. If you give off positive vibes, then you will attract similar vibes around you. So too with negative vibes. It's not so much about action as it is about intention.


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Re: Karma [Re: Silversoul]
    #6291849 -

I think that part of it is perception, as well.  IOW, pessimists tend to look at the world through shit-colored glasses.  :grin:

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Re: Karma [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6291875 -

I'm unclear as to whether after seeing the car behind you you braked unnecessarily hard or if he was following closely enough to slam into you with a normal brake  :confused:

ANYhoo, if you are concerned about Karma, only you know your intentions, and only you can know if you are in the wrong or not.


--------------------
Don't dream it;be it
===================================

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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