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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic)
    #615150 - 04/22/02 01:49 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Well I think I've been doing this since September but since every one of my projects has gone to shit Im gonna ask a newbie question. I have had these at 82-85 degrees and 96+ humidity for a week now and I dont see any growth at all. Each one got a pint jar of rye. I had a little spot of white mold and a little spot of what I think was cobweb, both got a shot of alcohol and havent returned. Should it be taking this long? How might I improve things? This is the last of my colonized jars so its my last chace. Sorry to bait you in with the pic.



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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615151 - 04/22/02 01:51 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Oh yeah, the lights and the pump have been off.


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InvisibleJoshua
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615234 - 04/22/02 04:42 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I have found that mixing a higher ratio of spawn to substrate improves substrate colonisation time. Please explain what you have in those trays and how they were inoculated. You should at least see some growth by now assuming you mixed in you colonised cake. If you layered it, it could take longer.

Joshua


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Joshua]
    #615365 - 04/22/02 10:19 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I crubled a pint size rye cake in each and layerd with manure/peat/lime. Im just paranoid because I have had such bad luck in the past and I have all my eggs in 3 trays so to speak.


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OfflineXAZIA
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615392 - 04/22/02 10:53 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

first, manure is typically used as a substrate, not a casing layer. and...
what did you put alcohol on!!?? your substrate?


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: XAZIA]
    #615402 - 04/22/02 11:08 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I intend for this to be a substrate. I didnt know whether or not to layer or mix so I layered. When and if this colonizes I plan on casing with coir. I used a fine streem to squirt a little alcohol on the two places where I saw contams. They were small little patches so it wasnt much and was only one tray. I just saw a tiny spot of cobweb so I am going to hit that with peroxide. I know I dont need air exchange at this stage but should I turn the pumps on every once in a while to cut down on contams?


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615412 - 04/22/02 11:18 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

You should mix the spawn with the substrate and also cover those trays loosely with aluminium foil or plastics, so the CO2 level rises a bit. CO2 at this stage stimulates mycelium growth and is beneficial.


Edited by Anno (04/22/02 11:20 AM)


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Anno]
    #615784 - 04/22/02 10:19 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Thanks, I have just one problem with that though. I recently spoted a small patch of white (?) fuzz. I cant tell if it is mycelium or cobweb. I know from experience how quickly cobweb can overun a tray and I am afraid to not keep my eye on it. If I cover with foil I will have to open the tank frequently to check up on this spot and I dont want to keep exposing to possible contaminants. Damn I hate making decisions, they usualy turn out wrong.


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Anonymous

Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615867 - 04/23/02 12:16 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Peatmoss is a lousy substrate component.

Sounds like an overly nutritious casing soil being spawned.
Try spawning just the manure(sterilized or pasteurized) and cover that with tinfoil until colonized completely. Then CASE that with the peat and the lime, or the coir and the lime.



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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: ]
    #615907 - 04/23/02 01:05 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I mixed it up in a ratio that bluhoney posted. It seems from reading her posts in the past that she realy knows her shit. I realy should have mixed it together though instead of just putting the manure on top.


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Offlinerootkey
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #615923 - 04/23/02 01:24 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Im no professional, but im pretty sure using alcohol (i am assuming rubbing alcohol) will murcilessly burn the poor mycelium to death. Use h2o2 its much safer.


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: rootkey]
    #616291 - 04/23/02 01:13 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I dont have experiece with white mold and what kills it, so yes I did burn mycelium to death but ony on a tiny section of the tray.


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Fucked over by the world and now by fungus [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #617253 - 04/24/02 12:12 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

WHAT THE FUCK, I just looked at my trays a little over 1 day after I lightly layed foil over them and I had what looked like blueberry snow covering every single one. I have been trying this for 8 fucking months and I have gotten nothing more than a small handfull of aborts. I follow the advise given to me by the pros and my work still fucks up. This is my 4th attempt at birthing and its just making me sick. I look everyday at these kids who pull out huge handfulls off of their first attempts in conditions that arent nearly as steril as those I try to keep. People who dont put anywhere near as much money and time as I do into projects keep coming back with successful posts. My projects ALWAYS fall apart. Does increased CO2 promote mold or mildu as well as mycelium? In this case I didnt see any of that shit until after I added the foil. I like this hobby but like everything else I like right now it keeps turning around and kicking me in the balls. I have prints and some clean syringes and thats as close to having mushrooms as I am right now. I should have had them layed out on the scale months ago. I swear if it wasnt my house Id be putting my fist through the wall right now.


Edited by Chemical_Smile (04/24/02 12:16 PM)


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #617302 - 04/24/02 01:28 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

It isn't working because you aren't doing things by the book. First, after making those pans you should cover them with foil and put it incubating again at 80+F for 5-6 days, at that time you should see the mycellium poking the top layer, then you take out the foil, bring down the temp to near 72-75F for pin formation anf keep a constant 85Rh (cakes need higher Rh). If you live the pans opened inside a terrarium like you did, you're inviting contams to colonize the top layer, wich wouldn't happen it the pans were covered with foil, besides the fact you're using a semi-nutrient top layer wich adds probability to have contams.
I have a few quest.
What is white mold ? Mycellium is white but it isn't mold.
How deep is your casing layer ?

BTW, the mix you used as a casing layer it's ok to apply, not the best solution but... anyway, do not mix this top layer with the substrate, peat moss is a bad colonizer, it's just needed to add humidity.

Peace,
MAIA


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
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Re: Fucked over by the world and now by fungus [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #617313 - 04/24/02 01:45 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Dude first off, Don't give up! Back up and shake it off.
You are so close it isn't even funny. If you can colonize a jar
of rye, then you're ahead of me.
I don't know everything so I can't say "Here's what you did
wrong" but I can tell you here's what I would have done
differently (right or wrong).
1) were there drain holes in the trays? If not, I would advise
some, covered with foil so light doesn't come in.
2)When starting casing, go verm only. thick underneath and
thin on top.
3)Nothing but colonized substrate in between (at least until
you have some success behind you)
4)When you make your casing, go back to the incubator, in
the dark, 84 deg, covered in foil loosley or with holes poked
in it.
5) Don't worry about raising the humidity or air exchange in
the incubator.
6) start checking it for mycelia to show in about 48 hrs. when
it shows up, birth it. it will increase how much is there for like
another day after you take it out.
7)Move it to the terrarium at room temp (70's) with light high
humidity, and lots of fresh air.
8) just my opinion but it looks like your setup would produce
ideal humidity but I don't think that tubing is sufficient for
enough air exchange. I use 7/16 tubing hooked to an ultrasonic.
But that setup should still do fine with a little fanning.
9)After pinning, the perlite will be enough for humidity by itself.
I realize my way probably isn't the best way. And the best
way may be in the next post. But my way will work.
If there's anything I can do to help. PM me.
Hope that helps.
:peace:
Free Spore Ring
 


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The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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Offlineseattlekid
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #617617 - 04/24/02 07:30 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

You're so damn close don't stop now. Heres a few pointers i've learned from a friend who recently has just tried casing and has been pretty succesful. He uses quart jars with rye cased in hawks 50/50+ (15 cups peatmoss, 15 cups verm, 4 1/2 cups crushed oyster shells, 1 1/2 cups hydrated lime). He layers about 1/2 inch 50/50+ plus on the bottom of his tray. Then around 2 inches of collonized rye. Then around 1 inch of 50/50+ on the top. Now he just takes it and stickes it in his terrium which is a rubbermaid tub with a cool mist on it. He runs the cool mist 24/7 and 8 hours of light. I don't know much about the whole covering first with tin foil...it seems like a good idea but my friend hasn't had any major problems doing it his way. Hope this helps you!! PM me if you need anything else.


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: seattlekid]
    #617735 - 04/24/02 10:17 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Well I know from experience that straigt rye cakes dont work. I also learned that you should mix up your spawn and substrate not just lay one on top of the other.
I think I will start fresh with some hawaiian prints I recieved and try to forget all my terrible experiences with Eq's. I am going to try 1 tank of pasteurized straw spawned with rye and cased with verm. The other tank will just be rye and verm. After I get a enough surplus to last me a while I can start experimenting again.
Thanks alot to all of those who helped me. You guys make falling on my face seem almost worthwhile. I realy appreciate that.
Almost forgot, W.U.L what do you mean about the drain holes having foil to keep out light? Are the drain holes on the bottom of the pan or on the sides near the bottom? Also what is their major function since you have verm on the bottom to soak up moisture?


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: Chemical_Smile]
    #617866 - 04/25/02 12:58 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

The drain holes are on the bottom or near the bottom. The
verm acts like a sponge and holds water for the substrate.
But you don't want it standing in water. So you mist it, and
don't know how much is under there, if there's already too
much, it just drains out, thus killing by accidently overspraying
is eliminated.
Now let's say you overspray a couple of times, never
realizing it, and a little tunnel erodes in the verm. A tiny bit of
light reflects in and up to the bottom of the mycelia. And a
mushroom forms and grows under the bottom without you
knowing it. If it's not picked, it will rot, and contaminate your
casing. I've seen mushrooms grow out of the drain holes that
had to reach an inch through verm to get to a hole smaller
than a pencil lead. Tells you a little about how much light you
really need to grow. I can't remember where I read it but I read
once that if you can see in your terratium, that's enough light.
Probably PF Tek or MMGG.
Hope that helps.
:peace:
Free Spore Ring
 


--------------------
The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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OfflineParticleMan
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #618009 - 04/25/02 04:17 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

the only thing i could offer would be to hold up with the straw and bulk methods if you still havent got your first fruits yet. just take your rye and case it with verm....mushrooms will visit you.


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OfflineChemical_Smile
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Re: Cow manure/ peat moss/ hydrated lime (pic) [Re: ParticleMan]
    #618053 - 04/25/02 05:40 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Im doing about 2 dozen pint jars and each will hopefully live to make 2 quarts my straw work depends on how many of these jars make it to maturity.


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Coir, Oyster Shell, Peat, Perlite, Rye Grain, Scales, Vermiculite

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