soulcircus said:

to all those that disagreed with what i said, i consider body building to be sculpting your body purely for aesthetic reasons, lifting weights for other health related reasons is a different matter

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And why exactly is sculpting one's body purely for aesthetic reasons a negative thing, dare I ask?


Peace.

soulcircus said:

i beleive that the reasons which motivate people to body build are negativly influeced because i think they stem from insecurities (such as attention, feel of dominance, being to short/thin etc etc) and won't trully allow you to follow a spiritual path effectivly until you have stopped this.

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i think to take a more effective step down the spiritual path requires accepting how you already are, and not being too obsessed about your body

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Accepting how one already is does not mean that one is not completely free to change oneself, especially considering the fact that we all exist in a state of constant change. I also do not comprehend how "obsession about your body" necessarily applies to bodybuilding, either. I work one job that sometimes consumes far more than eight hours of almost every day - am I obsessed? I live with the same woman and the same animals every single day - am I obsessed with them?


Peace.

LunarEclipse said:

...Plus that freakin techno music at high volume has been known to cause Roid Rage.

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soulcircus said:

I'll have to disagree on this one.

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Although this sounds feasable i don't beleive it could possibly be the case.

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i know i havn't put up much of a debate on this responce, but from reasearching bodybuilding for over a year and talking and talking to alot of bodybuilders over the net. Every single one of them seemed to be into it for an egotistical purpose

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Conversation over the internet is not an incredibly accurate glimpse into the inner intentions of other individuals, and this has been directly evidenced and addressed in this particular forum many times over. I cannot imagine one accessing much data that could even substantiate that a single individual "seemed" to have "egotistical purpose", let alone an appropriate cross-section of bodybuilders. It is all simply speculation based on one's limited observations, observations that cannot truly give a glimpse of the mind of the individual who is said to be exhibiting such behavior.

My whole point is that there is no ground upon which to sustain such a proclamation of others nature.

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sure we are free to change ourselves still, but for what reason would one going down a spiritual path, require to take up bodybuilding

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Um, personal preference? The awareness and freedom that we, as human beings, have the great opportunity to engage in behavior that we prefer, and that we can fully experience that behavior without attachment?

Aren't you simply harboring a prejudice agansit a specific behavior that you do not personally prefer to engage in, and trying to dismiss its relevance to other peoples' lives by proposing that it simply could not be an aspect of a "spiritual path"?

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it requires a whole change in lifestyle eg dietry changes which are generally not too healthy, and if you are going for it properly is extremely unhealthy.

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i beleive anyone that takes up bodybuilding will become far more self critical and eventually when going down the line slwoly one makes other lifestyle changes which can lead to an unhealthy obsession.

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I apologize, but this is just an unfounded belief, in all its glory. It could similarily be applied to any activity or behavior that human beings engage in, and it would be just as inapplicable for them as well.


Peace.

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"My God, to think that's life, that's why you get dressed and wash and make yourself pretty and all the books are written about that and you think about it all the time and finally that's what it is, you go to a room with somebody who half smothers you and ends up by wetting your stomach. I want to sleep."
-Sartre, "Intimacy"

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soulcircus said:

not at all, aesthetics is fine depending on the reasons behind it.

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Aesthetics is aesthetics. We aren't here, debating the spiritual value of the bright blue feathers of a bluejay, which natural selection has provided to the bluejay to fufill the purpose of attracting a mate, and I don't see the difference.

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and maybe the answer is acceptance, thus changing the aspect of the non acceptance. some things will never leave you fully satisfied, until you realise happiness in the acceptance of the way it already is.

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It's not a horrible reason itself, however, it does not help with your spiritual growth to beleive that you can find happiness through gaining attention/appeal from women due to physical appearance and looking for a partner on this basis too, this is more likely to vear you off course

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Who implied that they are seeking attention from women by enhancing their physical appearance in order to derive a sense of happiness in doing so? Perhaps they are simply interested in gaining the attention of women, and are already happy?

Who the fuck knows? We are simply speculating on the intentions of people who do not actually exist, hypothetical figures who engage in certain behavior. Gaining a lot of ground, we are.

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it doesn't bother me really, i didn't beleive that bodybuilders could continue what they do and effectivly follow a spiritual path.

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Please, this is ridiculous. All it takes is a clear mind and some weights.

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however in pursueing the spiritual path much further down the line, bodybuilding in my opinion may still hinder growth.

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Just as anything could still hinder growth if one allowed it.


Peace.

soulcircus said:

lol, i don't think i can put up a suitable argument by your standards 

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but i still stand by my beleifs as being applicable to a vast majority of bodybuilders.

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i thought it was simple psychology

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and even with the example of the cop, it still demonstrates a purpose to invoke a sense of fear through domination which is egotistical.

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i'd gladly alter my beleif if i ever came across a single bodybuilder who i felt was not doing it for any egotistical purpose.

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Personally, I find an important aspect of the spiritual path is ensuring that one's perspective of reality is, at all times, the most reflective of reality, as much as one is currently capable of.

Forming beliefs that assert the nature of reality in the manner that you have is a hinderance to this. One does not conclude that all bodybuilders are "egotistical" until one meets one that suspossedly is not. One simply acknowledges that, of the bodybuilders that one has met, they suspossedly are egotistical, and one does not form further conclusions that pertain to the rest of the incredible amount of bodybuilders that you have not interacted with.

I could proclaim that, based on my observations of you, your spiritual path is merely an egotistical one, and I would have just as much basis in doing so as you have in asserting that bodybuilders are egotistical. You can't have it both ways.


Peace.