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Liquidkick
H2O
Registered: 05/03/02
Posts: 2,635
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Do you isolate strains?
#5881607 - 07/20/06 02:42 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ok, who here isolates strains, and keeps master slants/cultures?
Do you find it much easier to get consitent results?
I have only done multispore and some agar work, but never isolated and stored master cultures.
Do you find it worthwhile?
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creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: Liquidkick]
#5881755 - 07/20/06 03:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I isolate and keep masters. Did it the "old" way with agar in the past, but do everything with LC now. Cloning a mushroom is simpler than preparing a spore syringe, and more of a sure thing than agar multispore isolation. I can't think of a reason not to work with isolates.
Absolutely better results. Consistency in size, speed, yield, potency. More efficient use of your substrate because you don't have a bunch of non-fruiting substrains chowing down on your food mixed in with the fruiting ones.
Its absolutely worthwhile.
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monstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 3,911
Loc: Arizona Bay
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: creamcorn]
#5882025 - 07/20/06 05:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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absolutely!!
I don't know how you all do it without it.
worth every second spent.
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Babo911
Pooper Scooper


Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 1,745
Loc: Arizona Bay
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: monstermitch]
#5882049 - 07/20/06 05:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I worked my way up. Went from multi to makein LC and now after 3 grows worth of cloneing I have the perfect clone / master LC. To be exact like 5 gallons of it hehe
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Ronhero on the Growery is me
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: Babo911]
#5882919 - 07/20/06 09:49 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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> Ok, who here isolates strains, and keeps master slants/cultures?
I have a collection of oyster mushroom strains.
> Do you find it much easier to get consitent results?
For sure.
> Do you find it worthwhile?
Definitely. I'm interested in genetics, so it's absolutely essential to my program.
-FF
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure


Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: creamcorn]
#5883054 - 07/20/06 10:32 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
creamcorn said: Did it the "old" way with agar in the past, but do everything with LC now.
They're not the same. You can't isolate strains in LC. You can 'clone' in lc, but not isolate. You need the two dimensional space of a petri dish so the individual strains can sector out, where you can take a specimen from each. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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Yamidude
Stranger

Registered: 06/15/06
Posts: 957
Last seen: 15 years, 5 months
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#5883065 - 07/20/06 10:34 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Im pretty sure he meant clone. He did just make that cloning tek which i so look forward to trying out soon.
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Roadkill
Retired Shroomery Mod


Registered: 12/11/01
Posts: 22,674
Loc: Montana
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: Liquidkick]
#5883640 - 07/21/06 04:20 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ok, who here isolates strains, and keeps master slants/cultures?
I do
Quote:
Do you find it much easier to get consitent results?
do I really have to answer this? what do you think?
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I have only done multispore and some agar work, but never isolated and stored master cultures.
most people probably don't. but if they want better fruits, better flushes and better yeilds... they should.
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Do you find it worthwhile?
errrrrrr yeah!~

tc
-------------------- Laterz, Road Who the hell you callin crazy? You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch! Brainiac said: PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.
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creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#5883861 - 07/21/06 08:19 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: They're not the same. You can't isolate strains in LC. You can 'clone' in lc, but not isolate. You need the two dimensional space of a petri dish so the individual strains can sector out, where you can take a specimen from each. RR
explain to me how a clone is NOT an isolate?
scenario a: swipe spores on a plate. many strains grow side by side. observe sectoring. choose rhizmorphic growth in hopes to have a fruiting isolate. cut wedge from sector, and transfer to fresh plate. If no further sectoring is apparent, you've successfully isolated it.
scenario b: multispore inoculate a growing/spawn medium. many strains grow side by side. some fruit. choose a fruit, clone it. if your culture develops properly, you have a guaranteed fruiting strain separated from the rest. have you not just isolated that strain from the others?
ok ok, so you didn't isolate from within the LC (and I never meant to imply that you could in the first place), but did you not use it as a different tool to achieve the same goal?
its semantics... but i'd still call it isolation. whether or not you catch it shortly after germination in the case of agar in a petri, or after its been through an entire life cycle in the case of cloning from a grow, isn't relevant! the end result is the same. you've allowed several strains to grow side by side (albeit to different levels of maturity), but have chosen one based on certain characteristics your particular method calls for (observed sectoring vs. simply choosing a lone fruit body), and separated it from the rest... that's isolation! it just involves a different timeline, a different procedure, and a more "macro" mindset.
there's certainly purposes for agar and things it can do that LC methods never will allow. i.e., you’ll pretty much never isolate a clean mycelium sample from a contaminated LC. you obviously can't inoculate an LC with multispore and expect to isolate from there; there's no 2D plane as you mention to pick and choose from, its mixed up mess. regardless, there's certainly a lot that can be said for the ease of the LC methods (or any cloning methods over “traditional” isolation for that matter) - it takes some of the guesswork away, and for all intents and purposes does the same thing, when your intention is to grow, and improve your grows, rather than experiment/observe/clean up wild sample/recover from contamination/isolate PRIOR to a grow cycle/etc, where agar in a petri is our best and perhaps only tool.
no need to be any more specific or stubborn about the terminology, IMO. to each their own, maybe im just too practical and results-oriented.
i just don't think its wrong to consider cloning by any means a form of of strain isolation, just a different way to go about it.
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure


Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
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Re: Do you isolate strains? [Re: creamcorn]
#5884005 - 07/21/06 10:14 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Cloning has been used for years. It just isn't strain isolation. In fact, many strains can be incorporated into a single fruitbody when multispore inoculation is used, especially on the first flush. When isolating strains, usually it takes several transfers to begin to even see sectoring, and a few more to get down to individual strains. I see where you're coming from, but didn't want the new folks to get confused. They're two totally different processes. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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