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OfflineDal33tdude12
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A question for those with PMP's...
    #5848118 - 07/11/06 06:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I have a question, Not sure if this is a problem or me just being paranoid but i figured i would ask and make sure. I have a 90 quart container, with a pump for "up to 125 gallons" im using lava rocks, about 3 to 3 1/2 inches worth, and 2 to 2 1/2 inches of water, i have a hygrometer its a taylor 1458 (which im currently testing to make sure its accurate) it says that i have about 94 to 95% humidity and the temp is 78 to 80 degrees, now my problem is the 1/2 pint cakes seem a bit dry, some have SOME droplets of water on them and others have no droplets. On a few of the cakes is a fluffy white mycelium ontop of the cakes, not a lot but a little bit and ive read that, could be from low humidity. Overall just the look of the cakes seems to be a bit dry. I dont have a camera sorry i will try and get one and take some pics. Any and all help is much appreciated. Also can you use perlite for a PMP? Anybody have any results on using it?


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Offlineghostofbmarley
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: Dal33tdude12]
    #5848266 - 07/11/06 07:12 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Dal33tdude12

I just got done reading the original magash PMP thread where this was discussed several times.

perlite = works; messy
lava rocks = works; less messy but you prob. have to prepare it
geolite/hydroton/LECA = works; but you prob. have to prepare it

I don't have the sterilization details of the lava/leca down so search for PMP with author magash

EDIT:
the aritcle: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=boxes&Number=1303334&page=0&fpart=all

I have no experience, but at HD they have crushed red brick that could be considered if it is less expensive.

Sorry I can't help w/ your Rh question. I am still trying to get some understanding in that regard, myself.
-ghost


--------------------
~OM MANI PADME HUM~


Edited by ghostofbmarley (07/11/06 07:17 PM)


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OfflineDal33tdude12
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: Dal33tdude12]
    #5848498 - 07/11/06 08:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thank you ghost, i appreciate your help, but ive read that though. Im wanting to get some people who actually have a PMP and their exact results and findings. I know a lot of people have PMP's Does nobody want to help me?


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: Dal33tdude12]
    #5848530 - 07/11/06 08:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i've got an FC that's "sort of" a PMP with perlite.  yes, it works.

that particular FC is a big clear rubbermaid, sides covered in black duct tape, holes w/polyfill around sides and some in the top... air pump w/bubble stone on the bottom, and about 3-4" of perlite.  reptile heating pad underneath for the colder months... 0 maintenence for the most part... but like i said its not exactly a PMP.  point being, you can use perlite, it will work.

how long have your cakes been in there?  they always fuzz up the first coupla days after birthing and before pinning, its normal.  your humidity is fine.  have you gone through grows before? what are you basing your assessment that the cakes are dry on?  some droplets on them are normal, but a lack of droplets isn't necessarily a problem either.

did you double-end case or roll them in verm to help retain moisture/promote pinning?  if not you may wish to try it on a later flush and/or in the future.

you can always suppliment your humidity with indirect misting (spraying across the top of your PMP allowing the finest mist to drift down onto everything) if things seem dry... but by the sound of it everything is on track and you're just getting paranoid because the pins haven't come yet, i'll bet all they need is a little more time. :smile:


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Invisibledecepticon
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: Dal33tdude12]
    #5848543 - 07/11/06 08:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

perlite works very well.

gives you better surface area than your lava rocks or whatever.
therefore a better RH.

did you dunk after birthing?
you should always dunk your cakes and then roll them in
either vermiculite or a pasteurized 50/50+ mix.

cakes can be rather dry upon birthing.
I would dunk them now.

perlite can be a touch messy, but not overly bad.
rinse out all of the dust and super small pieces before use.

perlite will give you very high RH (99-100%).
that is what you need for your cakes.
so it could be worth the effort to switch.

I too have little experience with pmp's, but I have had a few over time.


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OfflineDal33tdude12
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848555 - 07/11/06 08:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks creamcorn you are making me feel better lol, yes this is my first flush and some of the cakes have been in there about a week and a half,and some a little under a week, im just really nervous is all, no i didnt dunk or roll i just put them straight into the PMP,
"did you double-end case or roll them in verm to help retain moisture/promote pinning?" What is a double end case???? I didnt know whether or not to dunk and roll them, will you give me some more info about that? When i touch the cakes i dont feel water like it feels kinda dry, they look pretty good though, Any more good tips good sir? Thanks for all your help. Also do you think i should switch from Lava rocks to Perlite or just quit being paranoid about that?


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848570 - 07/11/06 08:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

here actually... some visuals for you:

the FC, designed sort of in the style of a PMP but using perlite instead (with the addition of the polyfilled holes for extra FAE).. RH stays between 95-99%.  i don't fan or mist this one... i simply put cakes in, take mushrooms out, end of story!



and if there's still any question as to whether it works:



i don't understand the "perlite is messy" argument... i use the FC for certain experiments and mostly for raising printable mature mushrooms... as you see they puke spores everywhere, so i take a large spoon and clean up the blackened perlite, pour a little bit of fresh perlite over it and i'm back in business.  its a lot easier than cleaning spore mess in a greenhouse, and if there were lava rocks or something in there i couldn't just scoop up the "dirty" section so easy... to each their own i suppose :smile:


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Invisibledecepticon
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848578 - 07/11/06 08:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

the messy part comes when you empty out the tub
clean, and refill it.


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: Dal33tdude12]
    #5848583 - 07/11/06 08:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Dal33tdude12 said:
Thanks creamcorn you are making me feel better lol, yes this is my first flush and some of the cakes have been in there about a week and a half,and some a little under a week, im just really nervous is all, no i didnt dunk or roll i just put them straight into the PMP,
"did you double-end case or roll them in verm to help retain moisture/promote pinning?" What is a double end case???? I didnt know whether or not to dunk and roll them, will you give me some more info about that? When i touch the cakes i dont feel water like it feels kinda dry, they look pretty good though, Any more good tips good sir? Thanks for all your help. Also do you think i should switch from Lava rocks to Perlite or just quit being paranoid about that?




double ended casing is taking a jar ring and lid, putting it upside down so it forms a bit of a bowl. fill it with verm, mist it down, and rest your cake on it. put a small handfull of verm on top of the cake and mist that as well. you'll get lots of pins around the top and bottom. most of the cakes in the pic i posted above are DE cased.

rolling is what it sounds like, roll your cake around in verm so a bunch sticks to it all over (roll in dry verm, mist it lightly so it sticks)

either way works, i prefer DE casing because its easier. and you absolutely should dunk before each flush, including the first. since its been a week plus i'd let these guys go, but dunk after and go with either the DE case or rolling on the second flush. (maybe try some of each and see what your preference is.)


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: decepticon]
    #5848586 - 07/11/06 08:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

decepticon said:
the messy part comes when you empty out the tub
clean, and refill it.




i clean mine once per 3 months... i replace the top layer of perlite like i said by scooping it out and putting fresh down, but as for dumping everything and giving it a real good cleaning, i don't do it very often - and when i do, it takes about a half hour... its really not a big deal. :smile:


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OfflineDal33tdude12
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848588 - 07/11/06 08:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks guys i will go get my parents digi cam tomorrow and take a few pics of my PMP and see what you all think, How often do you haft to dump the perlite and fill it back up, or as you were saying you just scoop up the bad where all the spores fall. and put more in?? I think i will be switching soon.


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Offlineghostofbmarley
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848592 - 07/11/06 08:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

creamcorn -

Nice FC.  Thanks for the visuals.  I PM'd someone tonight as I was bugging that a potential container was too deep...  Yours looks nearly identical to the size of it though. :smile:

And to stay OT, what is your mixture of perlite in that container?  Looks pretty clean to me.  Maybe most people's problms stem from not rinsing perlite in a colander or using not a high enough dry perlite layer.
-ghost


--------------------
~OM MANI PADME HUM~


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: ghostofbmarley]
    #5848593 - 07/11/06 08:49 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yeah, not a big deal.

you will get used to the cleaning part of this hobby for sure.

I rate cleaning up after large spawning missions much
worse than just some perlite.


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: ghostofbmarley]
    #5848621 - 07/11/06 08:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

ghostofbmarley said:
creamcorn -

Nice FC.  Thanks for the visuals.  I PM'd someone tonight as I was bugging that a potential container was too deep...  Yours looks nearly identical to the size of it though. :smile:

And to stay OT, what is your mixture of perlite in that container?  Looks pretty clean to me.  Maybe most people's problms stem from not rinsing perlite in a colander or using not a high enough dry perlite layer.
-ghost




its just straight perlite, not a mixture of anything... have used miracle gro brand perlite that has fertilizers in it (was all i could find at the time) and that's more of an off-white color... recently switched to plain perlite because i found it (the fertilized stuff works just fine by the way, poses no contam risk or anything funky like that) and that's a more pure white color... rinse in a collander like you say and put it in wet.  every coupla weeks when there's less going on in there i mist the hell out of the perlite to replenish moisture but otherwise i do like i said - scoop the top off when it looks messy and dump some fresh damp perlite on top.

i'd clean more often if i had to but i've never had a contam in that FC, ever, so i don't feel a need to expend the effort  :cool:


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Offlineghostofbmarley
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848627 - 07/11/06 09:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

creamcorn
You have a layer of water at the bottom of your FC though, correct?

Again, looks reasonably clean.  Unless it is more expesive than crushed brick, I'm in.  No more debating for me.  Thanks to the original submitter  :thumbup:


--------------------
~OM MANI PADME HUM~


Edited by ghostofbmarley (07/11/06 09:01 PM)


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: ghostofbmarley]
    #5848646 - 07/11/06 09:04 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

nope, no standing water.  well... maybe a tiny bit collects down there when i re-wet it down, but not much.  that's the difference when using perlite vs. lavarocks/hydroton/geolite... standing water actually lowers your humidity, you just want the perlite itself to be damp, but no extra water.  there's about 4" of perlite in there, which is quite a bit and maybe a little overkill, but it keeps maintenence down in the long run, because with that much of it in there it holds a lot of moisture without standing water. :thumbup:

and its not expensive, a bag to fill that FC cost literally $2.50.


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848676 - 07/11/06 09:10 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

here and while i'm at it... not to hijack or anything... but for the sake of completeness, this is what's underneath the perlite:



and as mentioned the only other component is a reptile heating pad.  its really thin, and flexible, and has adhesive on one side (meant for sticking to the underside of an aquarium)... its stuck to the underside of the FC in this case.  i think its only 8 watts or something, its rather low-powered, but raises temp a few degrees (in winter time my home is about 68-69, the heating pad brings me to around 72-73... just a nice little boost towards "optimal" with negligible electricity use... it stays off in summer because its about 73-74 in here on average.  you can see the cord from it hanging from the left side in the first pic i posted way back.

hope that all gives you guys some ideas... improvisation is fine when putting together FCs :smile: :thumbup:


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Offlineghostofbmarley
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848786 - 07/11/06 09:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

creamcorn

simply said, your rock!  :laugh: very helpful to me, and I am sure many others!

-ghost
ps - I am proud you knew what was coming and preemptively showing the air setup!

EDIT: Last question - what is the depth of that pod?


--------------------
~OM MANI PADME HUM~


Edited by ghostofbmarley (07/11/06 09:34 PM)


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: ghostofbmarley]
    #5848858 - 07/11/06 09:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

its about 13" tall. so minus the 4" of perlite there's 9" growing space. i've had some 6-7" mushrooms come off cakes (gotta love the B+) that came really close to the top but haven't had anything reach all the way up just yet... and obviously holds a dozen cakes, has been the perfect size for its purpose.


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Offlineghostofbmarley
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Re: A question for those with PMP's... [Re: creamcorn]
    #5848887 - 07/11/06 09:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

OK, that must be the model I compared against. I liked the grey opaque mode.

And again, based on this thread I am gonna use perilite in my book.


--------------------
~OM MANI PADME HUM~


Edited by ghostofbmarley (07/11/06 09:54 PM)


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