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Offlinelonestar2004
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The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11
    #4325940 - 06/22/05 07:30 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)



found this on google?



THE WAR IN IRAQ HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11


If you believe that you are a fool!




John Kerry seemed to enjoy saying over and over during the 2004 presidential campaign that Iraq did not attack America on 9/11. Kerry?s infamous argument that the war in Iraq was the ?wrong war in the wrong place at the wrong time? was a case that Saddam Hussein was in no way a subject of the global war on terror.

Liberal news commentators have been fond of asking the question: If George W. Bush and Dick Cheney have not been at least implying that Saddam Hussein had something to do with the 9/11 attacks then why do 80% of their supporters still believe that to be true??

Here?s is the answer to both Kerry?s claims and the accusatory questioning of the liberal pendants: conservative minded people are not fools. We do not need the details outlined in The 9/11 Commission Report, showing a history of terrorist support, to know that Iraq has supported terrorists. We do not need all the reams of intelligence from agencies throughout the world, which simply reveal that Saddam Hussein?s regime was itself a terrorist organization, to know that Iraq was a hotbed of terror.

We are not fools. We know that Osama Bin Laden likely planned the attack on America. The specific group of terrorists who identify themselves as Al-Qaida may have carried out the horrific acts of war on our Pentagon and the World Trade Center. But the war on terror is against Al-Qaida, Hizballah, Islamic Jihad, HAMAS, Abu Nidal, hundreds of other terror ?organizations,? and every individual who seeks only to kill for the sake of Allah or any other reason. Saddam Hussein is counted as prominent among these terrorists.

Making no mistake, we know that the war on terror is currently focused on the most vicious and wide-spread seed of terror; that which grows out of the religion of Islam. We know that the war on terror is a war against Muslim radicals, Muslim extremists and Muslim moderates who support terror and who cheered at the deaths of thousands of Americans and other Nationals on 9/11.

We also know that Iraq is filled with these terrorists, that it has been a terrorist state. Do we need to stop and make a special statement that not all Muslims are terrorists? No, we are Americans. We believe in individuality. We judge people as individuals. It is one of the few things left that makes America different from most of the world. We know the truth: far too many Muslims throughout the world are terrorists.

Islamic terrorists are joined, not by organization, affiliation, treaty or agreement. They are connected by a hateful ideology that says that anyone who is not a Muslim should be killed. With a hive mentality they may use different names and may never associate directly one with another but they are all one in their goals of destruction.

Why do conservative minded people believe that Iraq was involved with the 9/11 deaths? It is not because George .W Bush or Dick Cheney said that Iraq was involved with 9/11. It is not because overwhelming evidence proves Saddam Hussein took part in the plot. It is with basic intuition and simple common sense that we ask ourselves these questions and know the answers:

Did Saddam Hussein support terrorists? Have terrorists been trained in Iraq? Are terror groups harbored in Iraq? Was Iraq a likely breeding ground for future terror attacks? Is the world a better and safer place if Iraq is free, democratic and against terrorism?

If you believe the war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 you are a fool.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4325963 - 06/22/05 07:39 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

cough... Saudi Arabia... cough...


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4325984 - 06/22/05 07:45 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yep if you believe that you are a fool. Because they used 9/11 as a pre-text to expand their global power.


--------------------

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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: barfightlard]
    #4325985 - 06/22/05 07:46 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Press Release Source: Harris Interactive

Iraq, 9/11, Al Qaeda and Weapons of Mass Destruction: What the Public Believes Now, According to Latest Harris Poll
Friday February 18, 10:46 am ET



ROCHESTER, N.Y., Feb. 18 /PRNewswire/ -- The latest Harris Poll conducted following the recent elections in Iraq finds that on many aspects U.S. adults have not changed their basic views about Iraq with one important exception: The number of adults who favor bringing troops home in the next year has increased significantly to its highest level since October 2003 when Harris Interactive(R) first measured the public's opinions on this issue.
Specifically, almost six in 10 (59%) adults now favor bringing most troops home in the next year and 39 percent favor keeping a large number of troops in Iraq until there is a stable government there. In November, less than half (47%) favored bringing troops home and half (50%) favored keeping troops in Iraq.

However, the public remains split on whether the invasion of Iraq strengthened (46%) or weakened (48%) the war on terrorism.

These are some of the results of a nationwide Harris Poll of 1,012 U.S. adults surveyed by telephone by Harris Interactive between February 8 and 13, 2005.

On other issues concerning Iraq, the attitudes of large majorities of the public have not changed significantly in the past few months.

-- 88 percent of U.S. adults believe that Saddam Hussein would have made
weapons of mass destruction if he could have (down slightly from 90% in
November).
-- 76 percent believe that the Iraqis are better off now than they were
under Saddam Hussein (same as November).
-- 64 percent believe that history will give the U.S. credit for bringing
freedom and democracy to Iraq (up slightly from 63% in November).
-- 64 percent believe that Saddam Hussein had strong links to Al Qaeda (up
slightly from 62% in November).
-- 61 percent believe that Iraq, under Saddam Hussein, was a serious
threat to U.S. security (down slightly from 63% in November).


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4325993 - 06/22/05 07:47 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

"-- 88 percent of U.S. adults believe that Saddam Hussein would have made
weapons of mass destruction if he could have (down slightly from 90% in
November)."

this is why bush was re-elected


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4325997 - 06/22/05 07:49 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

"cough... Saudi Arabia... cough... "

if you think gas prices are high now!


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326023 - 06/22/05 07:57 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Bellylard said: Yep if you believe that you are a fool. Because they used 9/11 as a pre-text to expand their global power

our global power??? this fucking war is running up our global credit card.

but IMO its about kill or be killed.


AL-Zarqawi himself put it this way:

"We do not wage our jihad in order to replace the Western tyrant with an Arab tyrant. We fight to make God's word supreme, and anyone who stands in the way of our struggle is our enemy, a target of our swords."


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326037 - 06/22/05 08:00 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

this fucking war is running up our global credit card.




You think Bush and his cronies give a shit about running up a deficit as long as they get their money?


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OfflineJesusChrist
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326048 - 06/22/05 08:02 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think that Iraq was exactly the right place at the right time for the global war on terror. From a historical perspective my guess is that this venture will be looked upon favorably.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: JesusChrist]
    #4326099 - 06/22/05 08:20 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

The winner does write the history books...


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Rose]
    #4326106 - 06/22/05 08:23 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Peace of history

(British Press and antiwar Left 'slowly' admitting Iraq's success)
The Sun (U.K.) ^ | April 13, 2005 | TREVOR KAVANAGH

By TREVOR KAVANAGH
Political Editor

IT has been a long time coming, but anti-war campaigners are finally admitting something good has come out of the liberation of Iraq two years ago.
The turning point came in January as eight million courageous civilians risked life and limb to vote for a regime that might not slaughter them.

It was accompanied by Libya?s decision to end its hostilities to the West.

And it gathered pace as first the Palestinians, then the Egyptians and finally ? astonishingly ? the Saudis began to nod in the direction of democracy.

As the thirst for democracy gathered pace, Syria risked being driven out of Lebanon and ex-Soviet tyrannies began to topple in Eastern Europe.

Now the mood of the world has changed towards the allied invasion which ousted evil Saddam Hussein.

For all the mistakes made in the immediate aftermath of the near-bloodless victory, there is now more than a glimmer of hope for Iraq?s future.

Most of the credit, grudgingly, has gone to American President George Bush.

Virtually none, until now, has been attached to Tony Blair, who risked all to support Britain?s greatest ally.


It is Mr Blair?s own Labour supporters who remain hardest to convince the war was worth the candle. Muslim-dominated constituencies vowed to give the PM a ?bloody nose? in the election.

Leftwing organs like the BBC, The Guardian, The Mirror, the New Statesman and The Independent led a vicious campaign of personal denigration against Mr Blair.

They revelled in embarrassing the intelligence services and gloated when the Prime Minister was hauled before the Hutton Inquiry.

Now many have been forced to eat their words.

To its credit, The Independent led the way yesterday with a page one picture of a British trooper laughing with young Iraqi girls.

Its headline read: ?Iraq: is the tide turning??


The anonymous story ? not by its anti-American, anti-Israeli Robert Fisk ? says the ?nightmare may be coming to an end?. ?Attacks on US forces are down from 140 a day to 30 a day,? it says.

?Casualty figures are down. So are assassination attempts.

?US forces believe they can reduce forces by up to 40,000. In Baghdad and Washington, the feeling is growing that the worst might just be over.?

The scale of this momentous conversion is impossible to exaggerate.

It compares only with the extraordinary admission by Lebanon?s Muslim leader

Wallid Jumblatt that the Iraqi invasion was ?the start of a new Arab world?.

Tony Blair is blamed by doubters for misleading the public, toying with intelligence and ignoring the corrupt UN.

He was isolated by French, German and Russian leaders ? their fingers deep in Iraq?s corrupt coffers. Had he waited for approval, millions of Iraqi people would still be risking death and torture under Saddam Hussein and his murderous sons, Uday and Qusai.

Sometimes, it is clear, the ends justify the means.



Defence Editor Tom Newton Dunn writes:

Two things have broken the back of the insurgents in Iraq over the last 12 months, British and US chiefs believe.

The first is a series of crushing military defeats.

But the second is far more powerful ? it is the will of the ordinary Iraqi people.

In the last six months of 2004, the gruelling cat and mouse game against the rebels climaxed in a handful of major battles.

For the Americans, that meant Najaf in August and Fallujah in November. And for the Brits, it came about in a series of ever more bitter confrontations in the long hot summer at Basra and Al Amarah. At the end of every one, Saddam?s die-hards in the north and the Shiite Muslim fanatics of the Mehdi Army in the south were left with many thousands dead.

A lot of those victories were down to the grit and determination of the average squaddie on the street who proved courageous time and again.

One of those was 23-year-old Private Johnson Beharry, who was rightly awarded the first Victoria Cross in 23 years for his extraordinary valour in rescuing more than 30 comrades and then going back out for more the next day.

But as well as decimating their numbers, the mental effect on the rebels was just as devastating.

Many potential recruits began to question whether certain death was really worth it. But more important than any bullets and bombs thrown at the enemy was the psychological effect of one single day ? January 30, Election Day.

In an amazing crescendo of public anger, eight million Iraqi people came out to defy terror to choose their own future for the first time.

It was a truly humbling experience for all of us journalists and soldiers alike to see the courage on their faces that day and to hear how voters spat on the charred corpses of suicide bombers.

It was an overwhelming national message to the insurgents ? they had had enough.

The only way any terrorist insurgency is beaten is when the ordinary people withdraw their support.

Terrorists can?t hide in a hostile crowd. As British forces chief in Iraq, Lt Gen Sir John Kiszely said in his farewell interview last week after six tough months in Baghdad: ?I see a changing mood in the Iraqi people, with a greater degree of optimism and self confidence.?

The utterly-wrong Vietnam comparison was all the rage among the chattering classes six months ago.

Now, you won?t even hear the MP for Baghdad South George Galloway saying that any more.

Instead, top brass behind the scenes are seriously talking about fixing a date for when to begin the long withdrawal.

It is likely to start by the end of this year.

Why will it be time to bring Our Boys home then?

Because it looks more and more like their job really will be well and truly done.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


Edited by lonestar2004 (06/22/05 08:25 PM)


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326661 - 06/22/05 11:12 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Our side......
Quote:

"We know that the war on terror is a war against Muslim radicals, Muslim extremists and Muslim moderates who support terror and who cheered at the deaths of thousands of Americans and other Nationals on 9/11."




Their side....
Quote:

"We do not wage our jihad in order to replace the Western tyrant with an Arab tyrant. We fight to make God's word supreme, and anyone who stands in the way of our struggle is our enemy, a target of our swords."






More and more this is starting to sound like a Holy War. :shake:


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326724 - 06/22/05 11:39 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Islamic terrorists are joined, not by organization, affiliation, treaty or agreement. They are connected by a hateful ideology that says that anyone who is not a Muslim should be killed. With a hive mentality they may use different names and may never associate directly one with another but they are all one in their goals of destruction




This is an incredibly simplistic idea. Terrorists and terrorism is started by many things. Power struggles, Socioeconomic, or religion or maybe all the three.

The truth is United States has a pretty long list of enemies, saying that Iraq was an enemy of the utmost concern is fairly rediculous. It was known that Iraqs infrastructure was pretty much destroyed in the Clinton years. Years of sanctions have left their populace in ruins. Their weapon systems and will to fight were pretty much obsolete.


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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #4327765 - 06/23/05 09:29 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

This is an incredibly simplistic idea.




"Simplistic" is not synonymous with "erroneous".

The fact of the matter is that well over ninety per cent of terrorist actions in the last decade or more have been perpetrated by Muslims. You don't see a whole lot of Buddhist or Taoist or Zoroastrian or Mormon or Wiccan or Shinto or for that matter Christian or Jewish terrorists -- even though people of those religions live in countries with socioeconomic problems and in countries where power struggles are occurring.

I suggest you read some of the written works of the "Founding Fathers" of the radical Muslim Jihadist movement and see for yourself why modern terrorism is almost exclusively a Muslim phenomenon.

Quote:

... saying that Iraq was an enemy of the utmost concern is fairly rediculous.




Which is why such was never stated. The contention was always that Hussein and his Ba'athist thugs were the enemy, not Iraq per se. The idea was not to subjugate Iraq, but to remove the thugs who had hijacked that country and allow the Iraqis themselves to replace it with representatives of their own choosing.


Phred


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The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Phred]
    #4327805 - 06/23/05 09:56 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Lonestar :

The problem with Bush is: What he said made it look like Iraq was DIRECTLY responsible for 911 - this was deception .
There are many countrys that have had terror causing leaders that were not attacked or blamed .

Most probably Bush himself neither writes his speeches nor makes the important policies of America . So replace Bush with American government .

Lonestar please address these points - I am not arrogant, so I am willing to concede an error if you point it out .


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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Mirth]
    #4327841 - 06/23/05 10:26 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Mirth writes:

Quote:

The problem with Bush is: What he said made it look like Iraq was DIRECTLY responsible for 911 - this was deception .




Examples, please. As I have pointed out in the thread "Impeach Bush", none of Bush's pre-war statements did anything of the sort. Further, when asked by a reporter whether the administration believed Hussein was behind the 9/11 attacks, Rumsfeld immediately answered, "No".

Pretty hard to make the case that Iraq was behind 9/11 when the first time someone asks you about it you answer that you don't believe they were.

But hey... that Chimpy Bushitler Rovepuppet is a sly one. Maybe he's just enough of a stoopid evil genius to pull off even that trick.


Phred


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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Mirth]
    #4327898 - 06/23/05 11:21 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Thought I'd help you out Mirth:

Quote:

Rono said:
Quote:

So just what was it Bush lied about to get the US congress to vote to give him the authority to resume hostilities in Iraq?




C'mon Phred, You've gotta be kidding me...I know you don't like "Libbies"...but don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here.


In one of Bush's speeches...
"This is a man that we know has had connections with al-Qaida," (referring to Saddam.) "This is a man who, in my judgment, would like to use al-Qaida as a forward army. And this is a man that we must deal with for the sake of peace."

or this gem...

"Saddam Hussein and his weapons are a direct threat to this country," Bush said March 6 in a White House news conference. "The attacks of Sept. 11 showed what the enemies of America did with four airplanes. We will not wait to see what terrorists or terrorist states could do with weapons of mass destruction."
(Notice how he is equating the 9-11 attacks with Iraq)

"Used to be that we could think that you could contain a person like Saddam Hussein, that oceans would protect us from his type of terror," he said at the same press conference. "Sept. 11 should say to the American people that we're now a battlefield, that weapons of mass destruction in the hands of a terrorist organization could be deployed here at home."

In that press conference....Bush mentioned the Sept. 11 attacks nine times, Saddam 40 times, and Osama (the real threat) zero. (remember Him...or has he now morphed into Osama Hussein?)

Even when he found no weapons to remove in Iraq, he continued to distort the truth about Iraq and 9-11...

"We will not wait for known enemies to strike us again," he said Aug. 26 in an American Legion speech, rationalizing his Iraq attack. "We will strike them before they hit more of our cities and kill more of our citizens."




Quote:

Cervantes said:
From The Washington Post
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn...p;notFound=true

Quote:


For example, in his Oct. 7 speech, Bush said that "satellite photographs reveal that Iraq is rebuilding facilities at [past nuclear] sites." He also cited Hussein's "numerous meetings with Iraqi nuclear scientists" as further evidence that the program was being reconstituted, along with Iraq's attempts to buy high-strength aluminum tubes "needed" for centrifuges used to enrich uranium.

But on Jan. 27 -- the day before the State of the Union address -- the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) reported to the U.N. Security Council that two months of inspections in Iraq had found that no prohibited nuclear activities had taken place at former Iraqi nuclear sites. As for Iraqi nuclear scientists, Mohamed ElBaradei told the Security Council, U.N. inspectors had "useful" interviews with some of them, though not in private. And preliminary analysis, he said, suggested that the aluminum tubes, "unless modified, would not be suitable for manufacturing centrifuges."

The next night, Bush delivered his speech, including the now-controversial 16-word sentence, "The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa."







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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4327907 - 06/23/05 11:30 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

According to the government 19 arab men and the famous Osama bin Laden are solely responsible for Sept 11. How can anyone be so stupid to beleive Iraq had anything to do with 911.

How much money does it take to find those responsible for that day? How many innocent men, women and children have to die for these people to be found?

How can anyone get away with this? This has to be the worst use of resouces EVER.

Its weird how the people who are making incredible profits from the attacks, were the same ones who actually had the ability to pull it all off.


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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Rose]
    #4327932 - 06/23/05 11:44 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Sorry, Cervantes, but none of those examples are illustrations of Bush alleging Hussein was behind 9/11. I've already adressed Rono's in another thread. He was using them as examples of Bush "lying" (which of course they are not), but for you to attempt to present them as examples of Bush implying Iraq was responsible for the 9/11 attacks is an even larger stretch.

Get serious about this or admit you're firing blanks, one or the other.


Phred


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Re: The war in Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11 [Re: Rose]
    #4327947 - 06/23/05 11:51 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Then let me BOLD some shit again... just to help you out. All Rono's quotes had to do with an Iraq/9-11 connection... just READ them again.

Quote:

Cervantes said:

Quote:

Rono said:
Quote:

So just what was it Bush lied about to get the US congress to vote to give him the authority to resume hostilities in Iraq?




C'mon Phred, You've gotta be kidding me...I know you don't like "Libbies"...but don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here.


In one of Bush's speeches...
"This is a man that we know has had connections with al-Qaida," (referring to Saddam.) "This is a man who, in my judgment, would like to use al-Qaida as a forward army. And this is a man that we must deal with for the sake of peace."

or this gem...

"Saddam Hussein and his weapons are a direct threat to this country," Bush said March 6 in a White House news conference. "The attacks of Sept. 11 showed what the enemies of America did with four airplanes. We will not wait to see what terrorists or terrorist states could do with weapons of mass destruction."
(Notice how he is equating the 9-11 attacks with Iraq)

"Used to be that we could think that you could contain a person like Saddam Hussein, that oceans would protect us from his type of terror," he said at the same press conference. "Sept. 11 should say to the American people that we're now a battlefield, that weapons of mass destruction in the hands of a terrorist organization could be deployed here at home."

In that press conference....Bush mentioned the Sept. 11 attacks nine times, Saddam 40 times, and Osama (the real threat) zero. (remember Him...or has he now morphed into Osama Hussein?)

Even when he found no weapons to remove in Iraq, he continued to distort the truth about Iraq and 9-11...

"We will not wait for known enemies to strike us again," he said Aug. 26 in an American Legion speech, rationalizing his Iraq attack. "We will strike them before they hit more of our cities and kill more of our citizens."




You're right, MY quotes were inappropriate (They had to do with Iraqi Nukes)... sorry. My bad... let's just stick to Rono's quotes then. Remember, I BOLDED the Iraq/9/11 connections for your viewing pleasure.

If you responded to them in the other thread, you sure as hell acted like you'd never seen them before... when you replied to Mirth in this thread.

How can you deny Bush blurred the line between 9/11 and Iraq?


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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