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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Income Redistribution
    #3976538 - 03/27/05 05:58 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Now before you cringe and go, "Not another thread on income redistribution/Socialism!!!" hear me out.

I was thinking about my county today. The economy is very bad here. If you have a job that pays more than six dollars an hour, you are lucky. There are only a few industries thriving around here: The first is the healthcare industry because there are so many old people. The second is the law enforcement industry because so many of the young people around here are scumbags. The third is the illicit drug industry because there isn't much to do around here except get high.

We usually think about income redistribution and how it relates to the individuals who receive it. But what about the areas that receive it (the areas that get more government money spent on them than they pay in taxes)? My area is one of these areas. Here are some examples:

1. Because there are so many old people here, ample amounts of Social Security money flows into the area.

2. Because of the aging population, tons of money is spent on old people by the government (state and federal) for health care. Everything from hospital stays (paid for by Medicare) to the Visiting Nurses Association (paid for by the state) is paid for by the government.

3. There are a lot of poor people around here, and the government gives them ample things for free. They receive food stamps, medical care, and subsidized housing (the government pays for them to live somewhere). In fact, even though the economy is so bad around here, real estate is still selling. The reason that is is because prospective landlords know that they will get a guaranteed check every month from HUD (Housing and Urban Development government agency) if they let a poor family live in the house.

4. Even the local steel mill is dependent upon government propping up. A law was passed in my state that mandates that all government agencies that need steel have to buy it from factories in my state. The only reason that the mill around here is still open is because the state is forced to buy from them. If they were left to their own devices, they would have gone out of business a long time ago.

5. The biggest employer in the county is a 100% state funded mental retardation hospital. Hundreds of retarded people reside there and hundreds of workers take care of them. The only reason this place is open and offers decent pay is because the government dumps money into it.

Most (if not all) of the decent paying jobs around here are government jobs or in industries that are heavily subsidized by the government. Most of the economy around here is fueled by government handouts, government subsidies, and government money. There is practically no private economic activity here. Everything that goes on in the local economy is either directly related to the government or is dependent upon the government's money.

How embarrassing.....my area is dependent upon the government taking money from other more prosperous areas and injecting that money into our local economy. But, if it weren't for this government money, the area would be even worse off than it already is.


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OfflineCatalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 1,742
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Re: Income Redistribution [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3977302 - 03/27/05 09:16 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

But, if it weren't for this government money, the area would be even worse off than it already is.




Well thats the million dollar question (no pun intended). Are the negative effects of taking that money and disproportionately spending it on that area worth the benefits?

There is an interesting town right outside Chicago called Evanston. It is extremely liberal and kind of a microcosm of socialist economics. Interestingly enough it is only occupied by very rich people, very poor, unemployed people (lots of subsidized housing), and old people (subsidized retirement homes). There are barely any middle class because the property tax and sales tax are some of the highest in the country and there is also very little business. The town is supported mostly by taxes and contributions from the rich.

This town is interesting to me because I noticed that the redistribution of wealth creates a huge divide between the rich and poor there that is difficult, if not impossible to ever transcend. It has almost eliminated the middle class but, like i said, it is only a microcosm of the economy and questionable as a real model. I don't know if this directly addresses your topic but its just a "redistribution of wealth" topic that has been on my mind lately.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: Catalysis]
    #3977918 - 03/27/05 11:38 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Well, Evanston is right next to an economic powerhouse (Chicago), so the town itself might not produce much wealth, but the area in general does.

Do you live in Evanston? I stayed in Wilmette for a night, drove through Evanston (and past Northwestern University), and hung out at Navy Pier for a while. I didn't get to stay as long as I would have liked in the "Windy City area". It seems cool there.


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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3978779 - 03/28/05 02:27 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Well, the government seems to really care about the well-being of your area, otherwise it probably wouldn't be helping it out so much.
I'd even say that, given that America is such a wealthy nation, that its surprising that such poor and "underdeveloped" areas exist.

what's the point of this post? are you whining because the taxes being payed by americans are going to poor areas like this one?


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: exclusive58]
    #3979475 - 03/28/05 09:57 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

exclusive58 said:
I'd even say that, given that America is such a wealthy nation, that its surprising that such poor and "underdeveloped" areas exist.




People here aren't living on the street or anything. In fact, this area used to be very very prosperous (when industry was prevalent around here). It's just that the economy has gone downhill.

Quote:


what's the point of this post? are you whining because the taxes being payed by americans are going to poor areas like this one?



I'm not whining. I am merely examining my area and the concept of income redistribution as it relates to communities and not individuals.


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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3979501 - 03/28/05 10:18 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

oh..well good examination then!


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InvisibleDirtMcgirt
in a pinch
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/20/04
Posts: 2,213
Loc: city of angels
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3981836 - 03/28/05 10:20 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Are there alot of small businesses around where you are? Also who is buying up the real estate in your estimation? Is it local or real estate compnaies from Philly?


When I lived in a small, isolated town (possibly more or as destitute as yours) I was told that starting a small business was next to impossible because all the best real estate and and market share went to huge corporations that whisk away the profit margin to their own personal coffers instead of reinvesting it in the local market as a small business owner probably would. A SBO would live and shop in the community. Places like walmart can be blessing for a town's economy or a scourge depending on the situation. I my personal case, I think the over-corporatizaion of it's microeconomy was a bad thing. When people say a town is stupid for tryig to stop walmart building a store because it creates jobs and pays taxes they over look the fact that it can siphon money away from the communities economy in many cases.


I don't know how it is where your at but next time you go grab a quick bite eat at the local diner instead of wendy's or quizno's. I don't think corporations are evil or anything but when a isolated community gets oversaturated with them (especially in retail and service industries) it takes a toll I suspect.


--------------------
"And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."


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OfflineCatalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 1,742
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: Income Redistribution [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3981933 - 03/28/05 10:44 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
Well, Evanston is right next to an economic powerhouse (Chicago), so the town itself might not produce much wealth, but the area in general does.

Do you live in Evanston? I stayed in Wilmette for a night, drove through Evanston (and past Northwestern University), and hung out at Navy Pier for a while. I didn't get to stay as long as I would have liked in the "Windy City area". It seems cool there.




Yeah, actually I work at NU but i live on the chicago boarder because I can't afford the property taxes in Evanston. Thats why it is an interesting town. I can't afford to live there if i wanted to, yet half the town is basically a ghetto consisting of subsidized housing and the other half are people living in million dollar estates.

Chicago itself is actually a great city but it is very corrupt and the people bend over to anyone with the last name Daley...but thats another topic entirely.


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