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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: newuser1492]
    #3679946 -

I think corporations should make the right decisions... but I don't think they should be forced to.... and eventually karma will catch up to them.. I think they should be allowed to fire ppl of a certain party... but not to pull the carpet out from under people completely.. have a few months severence package or something.. I think a better more responsible way would be to agree upon the terms upon hiring. If a company hates your guts... why the hell would you want to work for them anyways?

If you force someone to make the right decisions... they'll never learn why they have to do it...

If someone makes the wrong decision... and the public finds out... your business will PLUMMET because it was a crappy PR move. I think the public opinion should regulate and create an equilibrium in corporate behavior... I don't think it should be mandated upon the government...

Again... you need the gov't in some cases to say "hey.. you can't pollute this river".. because then people get sick from using the water in the river... then you're causing harm to other people. Then you're destroying land which belongs to all of us. You're not causing someone harm by not hiring them for being a republican or a democrat.... They didn't have a job before the job interview... and they won't have a job after the interview either... boo hoo... I still haven't heard a good reason to why should that company be forced to hire someone they don't want. If enough people think its unfair and get pissed off.. the public will start going to another company for it's goods and services...

Like I said... you can't force people to treat one another with respect... but if you treat enough people with disrespect... you'll find yourself lonely and unsuccessful in a few years. You'll get what you deserve whether you're an individual... or a company.


And I think the only way we're going to learn that lesson... is the hard way. The only way I think someone can learn the truth about the way society needs to be run... it to let it run free.. and make it's own mistakes... and then eventually through experience we'll figure out the right thing to do.. and do it voluntarily. That should be our goal... We won't learn by being force fed "what's right" by lawmakers

Edited by BrAiN (01/25/05 09:11 PM)

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: Paou]
    #3680023 -

So should the Bill of Rights apply to corporations?

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: newuser1492]
    #3680046 -

Well the bill of rights for the most part specifically addresses individual issues...

Some things like "speedy and public trial"... good question. I guess that's why the gov't sometimes charges companies in civil suits

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: BrAiN]
    #3680860 -

Quote:
Like I said... you can't force people to treat one another with respect... but if you treat enough people with disrespect... you'll find yourself lonely and unsuccessful in a few years. You'll get what you deserve whether you're an individual... or a company.




Exactly.  I think everyone here agrees that it is well within a private company's right to hire who they want to, it is just more of an ethical issue.

However, getting into this topic, how do you guys feel affirmitive action and mandatory requirements of hiring on the basis of race and sex plays into this discussion?  If someone is allowed to discriminate on one basis, why should they not be allowed to discriminate on other principles?  One could argue that an addiction is not necessarily something that is chosen by an individual but is based on genetic and other factors as claimed by researchers as well as government institutions?  :confused:

edit: oops i see you have already somewhat covered this topic, my bad.  :blush:

Edited by Catalysis (01/25/05 11:32 PM)

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: vivid]
    #3681746 -

vivid said:
BlackSabbath: You being a flying projectile through your windshield isn't what makes you a burden on others. What are the chances that you are going to hit someone else with your flying body? where is your data to support this insane allegation.

The reason there are seatbelt laws and by not using your seatbelt you risk being a burden is because is A: a seatbelt keeps you in your seat, if you are hit but still travelling, you will still be at the controls of the car and may be able to help avoid further damage. B: Seatbelts reduce injury, hence emergency medical costs, especially for people who cannot afford health insurance, which then burdens the tax payers.

Thats what that is about.

now to the original topic. If the government is going to legally allow smoking cigarettes etc. etc., and endorse personal freedom.. then there is a huge problem with allowing a company to fire people based on their personal habits. To allow companies free reign to fire people for smoking cigarettes is a slippery slope to say the least.

I know you spend most of your time with your mouth rapped around the cock of the conservative agenda Black Sabbath.. but come on.. conservatives are supposed to be pro-personal freedom. Liberty! Justice! Fairness and Balance! :p



Hey genius, I know you spend most of your time with your mouth wrapped around the cock of the dumbass agenda, but please show me where I stated that the body would fly out of the windshield and kill someone outside of the car. I was referring to others inside the car. Only a fucking retard would infer that someone would be stupid enough to think that a body is going to exit one car, and then enter another and kill someone.


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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3681829 -

blackasbbath.. maybe you should by a little more clear in your posts before calling people dumbasses.

Also.. you're wrong.. NOT wearing your seatbelt DOES increase premiums a bit. Thats the only reason we have seatbelt laws. People that don't wear their seatbelts generally get worse injuries in a car accident.. causing your hospital bill to be tens of thousands of dollars more... which the insurance companies have to pay...

Don't believe me? Call your insurance company right now and tell them to modify your coverage to reflect that you don't wear a seatbelt... and then get a quote.

Hell.. your premiums go up just on the COLOR of your car. :P fucked up, huh?

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: BrAiN]
    #3681835 -

BrAiN said:
blackasbbath.. maybe you should by a little more clear in your posts before calling people dumbasses.

Also.. you're wrong.. NOT wearing your seatbelt DOES increase premiums a bit. Thats the only reason we have seatbelt laws. People that don't wear their seatbelts generally get worse injuries in a car accident.. causing your hospital bill to be tens of thousands of dollars more... which the insurance companies have to pay...

Don't believe me? Call your insurance company right now and tell them to modify your coverage to reflect that you don't wear a seatbelt... and then get a quote.

Hell.. your premiums go up just on the COLOR of your car. :P fucked up, huh?



Its pretty obvious that no one should be stupid enough to assume that one thinks that a body would not only break through one windshield, let alone two, and still have enough momentum to kill a person inside the vehicle. I mean come on, I was trying to give people on these forums enough credit, as I thought clearly they would be smart enough to realize I meant injury to others in the same vehicle. Also, maybe people should know my political afiliation before they tell me I constantly have my mouth wrapped around the cock of the conservative agenda.

I'm well aware of the fact that premiums will go up if you don't wear a seatbelt, and this in an instance where I should have clarified. In the real world, most people who are paying their own insurance premiums would not be dumb enough to admit not wearing a seatbelt if asked, and thus their personal premiums do not increase. However injuries resulting from people who don't wear their selt belts do cause premiums to go up for everyone.


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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3681989 -

> Hey genius, I know you spend most of your time with your mouth wrapped around the cock of the dumbass agenda

Please lower the tone a bit... I would hate to see people get banned for flaming one-another. Argue the topic, not each other please.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: Seuss]
    #3682025 -

Seuss said:
> Hey genius, I know you spend most of your time with your mouth wrapped around the cock of the dumbass agenda

Please lower the tone a bit... I would hate to see people get banned for flaming one-another. Argue the topic, not each other please.



I will lower the tone. It was my mistake. I'm not trying to justify my actions, but I didn't like being told I like to wrap my mouth around the cock of the conservative agenda.


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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3682028 -

I was speaking to everybody, not just you.  :smile:

Thanks!


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: newuser1492]
    #3682305 -

cb9fl said:
So should the Bill of Rights apply to corporations?



The Constitution and Bill of Rights specify what the government can or cannot do. They do not restrict anyone else.

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: Paou]
    #3682676 -

Corporations do not have rights or interests or desires or feel pain or love or hate. The owners of corporations do. This is an important distinction to make as the anthropomorphizing of an abstract concept leads to many logic errors. A corporation is a legal construct within which business is transacted. It is not an actual thing, such as a person or a dog or a boat.


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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3682832 -

blacksabbathrulz said:
I'm well aware of the fact that premiums will go up if you don't wear a seatbelt, and this in an instance where I should have clarified. In the real world, most people who are paying their own insurance premiums would not be dumb enough to admit not wearing a seatbelt if asked, and thus their personal premiums do not increase. However injuries resulting from people who don't wear their selt belts do cause premiums to go up for everyone.



You don't have to ADMIT it to the insurance companies. THey'll find out if you get a ticket for not wearing your seatbelt.

Everything you have said so far is WRONG.... then when you get your argument proven wrong, all you come back with is "uhhh UHhh that's not what I was saying, dumbass!"

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: Paou]
    #3682890 -

The Constitution and Bill of Rights specify what the government can or cannot do. They do not restrict anyone else.

Which is exactly why I posed my question as such, "So should the Bill of Rights apply to corporations?"

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: Ravus]
    #3683297 -

Ravus said:
This really has nothing to do with government control, it is a private company firing employees because of their lifestyle.




E X A C T L Y!!

The people that bitch about this sort of thing are against it because they don't understand the issue. The private company can hire whoever they want to. The abstract of all of the arguments against this seems to go something like this
"It's wrong to force people to do something because of your beliefs, so I'm going to force you to do what I believe!"


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: SoopaX]
    #3684854 -

A risk you take being a smoker. You can be alienated from restaurants and public places, why not workplaces?


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Echoes

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: wietstocker]
    #3685028 -

I like that pic, SoopahX. It's so true.

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: BrAiN]
    #3685220 -

Fuck it, I say get a book of matches and a few gallons of gasoline and burn that company to the ground one evening after working hours. Then ask the owner, "Who's smokin' now, bitch?".


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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: wietstocker]
    #3685359 -

wietstocker said:
A risk you take being a smoker. You can be alienated from restaurants and public places, why not workplaces?



In Florida there is now a state law mandating that all restaurants be completely smoke free. I think most people would at least agree that the government should not be able to make that law.

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Re: Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke [Re: newuser1492]
    #3685431 -

It should be at the restaurants' disgression as to whether or not they will allow thier patrons to smoke on the premises.

At the same time it should be at the restaurants' disgression as to whether or not they allow thier employees to smoke on the premises.

They should not, however, have the right to fire employees for what takes place off the clock, off company property, and in the employees' home.

If we keep heading in this direction we will all be slaves to the corporations that are surely trying to rule us in all that we choose to recreate in, consume, and believe. And for what? For larger profit margins.


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