Home | Community | Message Board


Vaposhop
Please support our sponsors.

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Jump to first unread post. Pages: 1
InvisibleautomanM
blasted chipmunk
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/18/03
Posts: 7,963
company fires smokers subthread
    #3688271 - 01/27/05 01:37 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

if a company can fire people from smoking because it increases heatlth care costs, should they be able to fire for any reason that could raise helthcare costs? where should the line be drawn? what makes you think this "drawn line" cant be moved?


--------------------
No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. ~ Niels Bohr


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisiblePaou
Seeker

Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 376
Loc: Transcendence
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: automan]
    #3688284 - 01/27/05 01:41 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

They can draw the line wherever they want, but karma's a bitch. If a company is too strict with its policies, it'll have a hard time finding employees and will suffer financially as a result.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinespreaded
always beprepared

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 109
Loc: outer rim of space
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: Paou]
    #3688310 - 01/27/05 01:50 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Its legal, due to the health insurance factor. We talked about this in business ethics last semester. A more ethical point would be just stop hiring smokers and give the existing smoking employees a sort of rehab program, like give them patches, gum, medicine, whatever. Then the company could test you for being a smoker, and that wouldnt be cool. In general, I dont think its cool to fire smokers. Employ us, we dont got long left LOL... not funny I know.


--------------------
I set into a downward spiral, Caught an illness that was literally viral -WP


Edited by spreaded (01/27/05 01:53 PM)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleautomanM
blasted chipmunk
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/18/03
Posts: 7,963
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: spreaded]
    #3688347 - 01/27/05 02:06 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

what i'm getting at is * /me takes a drag off a cigarette to collect his thoughts * this opens up employers for not highering overweight people because of legitimate health reasons. if both of my mothers parents and both of my fathers parents have or died of cancer, i have a very good chance of contracting some sort of cancer, thus, a health insurane liability. to take this to the extreme, black people are more suseptible to certain types of cancer, sicle cell anemia, etc and thus, a higher liability for insurance purposes. this can be said for any race of people. where is it ok to draw the line? also, should a line be drawn or should people run a business as they see fit even if excluding whole peoples?


--------------------
No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. ~ Niels Bohr


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinei_rage_against
Mwaa ha ha
Female User Gallery

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 798
Loc: a shithole in the northwe...
Last seen: 4 months, 12 days
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: automan]
    #3688955 - 01/27/05 04:39 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Companies shouldn't force people to quit smoking, I understand that we do have higher health cares\ costs but one way of evening things out is (although this is still not completely fair) charge smokers a higher premium for their health care benefits, most private insurance companies do this anyway.


--------------------
whoever told you that is your enemy.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleEonTan
bird
 User Gallery
Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 468
Loc: very south
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: automan]
    #3689095 - 01/27/05 05:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Smoking is a choice. I think that is their rational.

I don't think it is right to fire anyone unless their job performance is Lousy. Even if Layoffs are a must, they should be done based on performance nothing else.

I also think Urine testing for jobs is ludicrous. For the same reason. You should be judged on performance not urine content. But it is alot easier to prove you use drugs or smoke, then your poor job performance.

I think the line is with things you can control, like to smoke or not to smoke. To do drugs or not to. Since eating food is a requirement for life, It is a little more difficult to judge fat people. THEY DO HAVE TO EAT, their bodies just don't deal with the food choices very well. Can you really blame them, the same way you could blame a cigarette smoker. I guess you could at some level, but it would be more of a stretch.

I sure hope this is not a emerging trend though. It would be uncool to fire people becasue they smoke. You could esily restrict use at work, and probably get people who smoke to leave if they are really obssesive about it, or they smoke on their own time.

I am curious how legal it is too fire people becasue they smoke on their own time.

As far as business hiring practices, they should be able to hire whom ever they want as long as they do not discriminate based on race, religion, etc..

If it was the hiring practice not to hire smokers, I would be ok with it. I just would not be ok with Firing Employees you already have based on smoking. JOB PERFORMANCE should be the determining factor.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 9 months, 18 days
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: EonTan]
    #3690075 - 01/27/05 08:35 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Good post Eon. I think a great many people here get a little overwrought about these monolithic, mystical "corporations". They are all owned by people, individuals with their own rights. As long as smoking is a choice, just like heroin use, or eating yourself into leviathinism, then they can tell you to go work elsewhere. The fact that smokers are probably the coolest and most effective and best looking workers is irrelevant. They can choose to cripple their company in any way their shareholders will allow. (Can you tell I smoke? Can you tell I can get a job anywhere I want?)

Seriously, these people are horseshit assholes but they are clearly within their rights.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBaby_Hitler
Errorist
 User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 22,840
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 5 months, 18 days
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: zappaisgod]
    #3690141 - 01/27/05 08:56 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Corporations are essentially very powerful beings with no consciousness, or conscience. The people that the corporation is comprised of are so far removed from the results of their efforts, that they could be ruining thousands of lives daily and be none the wiser.

They are blind hungry monsters and we live in their sandbox. Yet we are also part of the organism.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 9 months, 18 days
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #3690229 - 01/27/05 09:19 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Corporations are neither beings nor monsters. They have no conscience or consciousness. Your personal feeling of powerlessness does not necessarily coincide with an actual powerlessness on the part of humans in general.


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineBaby_Hitler
Errorist
 User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 22,840
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 5 months, 18 days
Re: company fires smokers subthread [Re: zappaisgod]
    #3690498 - 01/27/05 10:12 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

I am both victim and benefactor of these constructs, as are we all.



[Haiku music]


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Jump to top. Pages: 1

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Company Fires All Employees Who Smoke
( 1 2 3 4 5 all )
phreakyzen 3,378 92 01/28/05 02:07 PM
by SoopaX
* WTC 911 Fires - Not So Hot, Eh?
( 1 2 3 4 ... 9 10 all )
usefulidiot 7,072 189 01/27/05 01:11 PM
by CJay
* Please support Cigar smokers rights in the US (cigarette smokers too!)
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 all )
rodfarva 5,561 135 03/12/09 07:33 PM
by rodfarva
* woman fired for bumper sticker...
( 1 2 all )
Annapurna1
1,588 20 03/13/06 11:47 AM
by Baby_Hitler
* MEND organization targets Oil companies on Niger Delta The_Red_Crayon 373 0 12/27/06 08:34 PM
by The_Red_Crayon
* Lawmakers consider requiring "fire safe" cigarettes California 1,042 16 03/26/05 01:49 AM
by fresh313
* SAID: Low Point Of Powerlessness Zahid 289 1 09/26/04 02:15 AM
by retread
* Feds bail out AIG to the tune of 85 bil, take over 79% of company.
( 1 2 3 4 5 all )
The_Red_Crayon 5,016 94 09/21/08 12:47 PM
by pothead_bob

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Prisoner#1, Enlil
757 topic views. 7 members, 1 guests and 6 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic | Stats ]
Search this thread:
Myco Supply
Please support our sponsors.

Copyright 1997-2017 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.053 seconds spending 0.003 seconds on 14 queries.