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Offlinepseudonaut
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Registered: 05/22/01
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ego loss
    #350396 - 06/27/01 10:50 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

i realize that it's probably really hard to define, but i was wondering if someone could attempt to explain what the shroomery means by "ego loss" as experienced on level 4 and 5 trips. i may want to consider it in the future, but it may be more than i want out of a trip (which i haven't fully thought about. i've level 3 tripped once, and i really enjoyed that)

thanks in advance

?But then I suppose it takes at
least one hour to lose time in,
who has been longer than history
getting into the mechanical
progression of it."
William Faulkner


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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: pseudonaut]
    #350417 - 06/27/01 11:50 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

You talking to me? Sorry this thread grabbed my attention...Tag that search button on the top screen and search "egoloss, ego loss and level 5" you'll find some good reading....

Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy.....


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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OfflineHB
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Re: ego loss [Re: pseudonaut]
    #350516 - 06/28/01 03:58 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

though ive never tripped harder than lvl 3 before as well, MAYBE borderline 4, from what ive read, pure ego loss shouldnt be attempted unless you are totally at piece and are willing to see the world as we know it ripped to shreds and you have to rebuild everything particle by particle with no way out. you have to be extremely mentally stable and not afraid of the unknown. i couldnt handle pure ego loss, but i hear great things about when you are at full peace (satori enlightenment) Its a serious thing, dont take it lightly

We're all MADD here...


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OfflinepsilocybinjunkieM
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Re: ego loss [Re: HB]
    #350742 - 06/28/01 01:31 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Satori Enlightenment is sweet. I ate 7 grams of dried cubensis once and achieved a level 5 trip.The trip however is something I'm not in a hurry to do again.



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Offlinegribochek
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Re: ego loss [Re: pseudonaut]
    #350794 - 06/28/01 02:33 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I will mumble meaninglessly now, ok?

Ego loss is when you, as a being separate from the universe, disappear.

Now, if there is no "you" then...

there is no such thing as "your posession/property", for how can you own anything, if you don't exist?
there is no desire, for how can you want anything if you don't exist?
there is no worries or fears of anything, because what is there to worry about, if you don't exist?

You will discover what you are made of (for those are the things that will disappear) and you will have a choice to either keep your old values as the trip comes to an end, remake your set of values as you see fit, or, if you want, you can stay empty, that is to say, stay without an ego.

As you examine life from an egoless perspective your power to understand the true nature of things is amasing (for you are not separate from them!) and you can be a source of great wisdom and power if you know what to do with it. But reaching that state is the hardest, most scariest thing one can imagine. It truly is Death. One's ability to reach that state does not depend on the amount of mushrooms one takes, but it is true that when on high doses you may start to experience ego disappearance, and if you fight, it will be the most deadly fight you have ever fought, the fight to keep something that didn't exist in the first place. There are two outcomes -- either you surrender (and loose) the fight and be somewhat surprized about what you find, or you win the fight and then you will always think of this as a "bad trip" which you have been able to "crawl out of" and which left you "tired and depressed for weeks afterwards".

Anyway, that was lengthy and useless....

-------
just another attempt of a finger to point at itself


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OfflinePsilocybin
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Re: ego loss [Re: gribochek]
    #350990 - 06/28/01 09:11 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I achieved egoloss for my first time a little over a week ago on 6g. I had tripped about 5 times before that, but it was all in preperation for this one. Make sure you are at peace with yourself, and are stable with anything that has happened to you in your life before. At the beginning of the trip I was scared, but eventually being "scared" had no meaning, I completely left this reality. At first I was shown my life, I lived out every point of it from the crib to my current self. Then the shroom spirit asked me "are you ready?" and I said "yes" and at that point I ceased to exist. This next thing that happened cant be explained in anyway, it was neither good nor bad, it was just information, The sprirt told me many things, most of which cannot be remembered, although they have a big impact on your subconcious. About an hour later I appeared back in this world, but I wasn't me, I was floating above my head watching myself. Somehow I had ended up downstairs in my friends house(I was on his guest bed upstairs when the trip kicked in), I was a little fightened, because while I had control of my body, it was like playing with a puppet, I was above watching myself. The spirit told me that I had to find my place of peace and only there would he show me what I seeked, So I left my friends house(at 4am)and started walking down the street, I got about a mile when I realized the place I was seeking was many miles away, and I turned back. Eventually I ended up in the backseat of my friends car. I got their because I knew I had come from my friends house, but at the time I had no idea who house it was, and I assumed the car was mine, although my keys would not start it(yes, I did try to drive it to find the secret place, thankfully I did not have the keys or who knows where I would have gone). So I layed down in the backseat and thought about life. The trip ended soon after that, and I realized who's house it was and went inside.

The spirit was a voice in my head and I could hear it clearly, although I wouldn't say "hear" is the right word. The best way I can describe it as having a voice in your head, but not your own. I have no idea where the place the mushroom wanted me to seek is, although I believe this is the goal of my future trips.
I am probably not going to do this high of a dose for a while, as it is hard on the body, mentally and physically; I wandered all over my friends house, my back, neck and feet ached for the rest of the following day from standing around for so long(about 5 hours).

My advice is do not try this level of a dose if you have even the slightest doubt about it, it can get very scary if something goes wrong. And also I would suggest a trip sitter, I was with my one friend(who also took 6g) in his empty house and I consider myself lucky that I did no more harm than cut my lip in three places from purposefully hitting my face against the wall(This was during the puppet phase, the only reason I smashed my face was that I wanted to see if it would make a noise and to see if I could feel it, I couldnt feel or hear it, my senses were completely distorted) and yes hitting my face against the wall seemed very logical then, I remember thinking that I should hit the wall to see if I hear/feel it, and I had no control over my arms(actually I didnt know what they were for...). Everyone experiences trips differently though, I usually get good mindfuck but I never get visuals. My recipe for a good trip is, make sure you are comfortable with the setting, and that you are able to change the setting if you are uncomfortable with it; make sure you have a trip sitter around, or atleast someone who is still in this reality for your first trip; wear comfortable clothing and eat lightly the day before, close your eyes and concentrate your energy and stay relaxed. Do this throughout the day preceeding your trip and right before you take off. Good luck man, if you have a good journey you will never forget the experience.

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InvisibleKid
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Re: ego loss [Re: pseudonaut]
    #351023 - 06/28/01 09:50 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

When I loose consciousness I think that my Ego must not be working.



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Offlinesweatyb
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Re: ego loss [Re: Kid]
    #352029 - 06/30/01 05:19 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

When you experience ego-loss can you carry on a conversation or do something if you had to, I doubt it right? I always think of ego-loss like a DMT high where you are totally out of it for 10-15 minutes and are zooming across the universe.



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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: sweatyb]
    #352167 - 06/30/01 11:16 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

As gribocheck mentioned there is nothing to worry about once you reach that plane.....However a good or bad trip is very obvious before passing over and also coming out of egoloss... You may have a major good or bad trip or a mix as most have , but make sure you eat enough to get there or the trip may have an actual theme to it (this will make sense later). There is really no preparation you can do before hand.. And it's not a bad or good place to be, just a space. Don't fear it or crave it, just get there. From the people I've talked to few have reached it, maybe 20 of 100% max and most enjoyed it but are hesitant to venture out there again. I myself am like the rest, I love the experience but hate going for it, and to it. But it is definitley an experience that will show you how big life really is... If you want this experience go with an empty stomach on 8 grams dry or more...good tripping...enjoy........

Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy.....


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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InvisibleGlowing_Eleven
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Re: ego loss [Re: pseudonaut]
    #443517 - 10/31/01 08:39 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

its just living in the moment
riding yourself of the battle between your instinctual needs and what you have been taught that you needed
i think its bullshit that people on drugs claim they are "egoless"
the drugs aren't real being trully egoless is doing so in reality
It's a joke


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InvisibleKid
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Re: ego loss [Re: Glowing_Eleven]
    #443627 - 10/31/01 10:30 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I tend to agree. I don't see how you can have conscious experience without an ego. Experiences aren't things that float around. You have experiences. You cannot be a bundle of sensory experiences, as it were.


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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: Kid]
    #443656 - 10/31/01 11:03 PM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I can see your argument, but the word ego is the only word that closely relates to the perceptive experience. Defined :The self as distinguished from all others...I loose my physical self most others define as self..You two are having opinions on word play... If you try to argue widgets taste like chicken without actually eating a drumstick you'll never please your palate...


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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InvisibleGlowing_Eleven
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Re: ego loss [Re: Kid]
    #443707 - 11/01/01 12:15 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Everything is based on perception genius
when you think about it there is no possible way to "define" ego so don't try to act as if you know the exact way ego is perceived... it has been used in many different ways
What im saying is if you really rid yourself of your ego you wouldnt be on here at the shroomery posting posts about your trips and trying to act as if you are superior
"tripping" even if you reach a level five is not egoless... you used something to get to that state it isn't real...
that is all im saying..so stick your chicken analogy up your asshole
I can't believe people say trips were enlightening... i mean sure you realize a lot but you had to use a substance to do so
People justify it and really it is unjustifiable regardless of what any of you say
its sad our minds are so contained that we need to "trip"
If you reach a level five there is no way to even put that into words... I think that dude was more worried about trying to impress people and that right there shows "ego"
Ego is something i have been thinking a lot about lately.
It encompasses so much more then what you said
by the way... Word play and reading others words has a lot to do with "perception" too...
hey "egoless" ignorance is bliss eh? I thought maybe you would be somewhat interesting but you are to busy trying to fake depth...your drowning in it
If "ego loss" is what anyone wants to achieve they will never do it with drugs so don't kid yourselves or glorify it


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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: Glowing_Eleven]
    #443741 - 11/01/01 12:50 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I try to look past your anger to find your true argument and what I see is in your beginning statement is that we are initially saying the same thing. But I think when you say "Rid yourself of your ego you wouldn't be here posting posts about your tips and trying to act as if you are superior", you must have misunderstood that egoloss is not an eternal state just in the now, it is regained. You seem very hatefull and offended,usually these feelings are of inferiority, I meant nothing by my former post except that if you have not experienced this don't second guess it. This is real and I am real also, so I will be civil about the "Perception" factor. I have been a good shroomerite for sometime and I only post from experience and fact. I am sorry you are so fragile and have not reached or found what I speak of, but you are young and humanitarianism along with mind developement is hopefully just a few grams or years away........


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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InvisibleGlowing_Eleven
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Re: ego loss [Re: egolesss]
    #443748 - 11/01/01 12:59 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I should be more subtle but what is the point?
You should look past my anger because that can be "perceived" in many ways... I made the mention of the posts because if the ego is gone you are living moment to moment you don't look back and summarize your trips there is no possible way you could even look back into your trip you don't think of the past or the future just now
I think im just talking in circles.. i usually do since my mind tends to work that way... I think you are right in essence we are getting at the same thing
I will try to look past your condescending attitude since you were a kind boy and looked past my anger
After all things aren't always what they seem


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InvisibleKid
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Re: ego loss [Re: Glowing_Eleven]
    #443757 - 11/01/01 01:17 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

egoless:
> If you try to argue widgets taste like chicken without actually eating a drumstick you'll never please your palate...

And you can't experience the taste of widgets without an ego to which your palate belongs.

You're not really saying anything here. I've taken high doses of LSD and DXM. I've experienced what I could call a "nearly complete annihilation of my former self/ego", but to experience something, you have to have something to attatch it to. It's functional. Even if you're not aware that "I am experiencing", you are still the "I" that is experiencing.

Glowing_Elven
> What im saying is if you really rid yourself of your ego you wouldnt be on here at the shroomery posting posts about your trips

Psychedelic users typically want temporary freedom from the ego. This is a well-etched idea into the mind of most tryptamine users. The model is primarily based on Tim Leary's The Psychedelic Experience.
Posting about their trips is partly about seeking guidance for how to incorporate their experiences into their lives.

> "tripping" even if you reach a level five is not egoless... you used something to get to that state it isn't real...

I don't see why not. An experience is real as long as you experience it. There's no such thing as an unreal experience. If something is experienced, then that experience is real.

I see where you're going with this though. I think some psychedelic users take their drug-induced insights more seriously than the ones they experience while sober. In my mind, there's no reason why a substance-induced mental state is any more or less "real" than sobriety or any other naturally occuring mental state. Take your insights with a few grains of salt.

> I can't believe people say trips were enlightening

either can I. I'm not really sure what it's supposed to mean.

> People justify it and really it is unjustifiable regardless of what any of you say

LOL. I can justify murder to myself. I like your absolute here. I'd hate to have you as a dictator.


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InvisibleGlowing_Eleven
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Re: ego loss [Re: Kid]
    #443759 - 11/01/01 01:21 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

you actually make sense to me
I'm not sure if you were proving my stupidity, I speak/type in fragments.... I just have a problem with people in general and I guess I will never quite understand


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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: Glowing_Eleven]
    #443765 - 11/01/01 01:26 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Now your talking, when you say"There is no way you could even look back into your trip" You are correct, much is completely lost, a 5 hr trip can contain maybe 1 hour of what I "Percieve" as egoloss and I can only verbally explain to a person a short few minutes of what alcoholics call a moment of clarity, but I can speak of 30 minutes of the sound and feelings going in and out of this incredible state. But to you I say in all honesty, maybe with a higher dose you will get there, maybe you can't as others or possibly a higher dose is needed, for me I need to be alone and I need 6g or more, and even 6g sometimes does not send me through the wormholes of the space rollercoaster that launches me to the space in which I know not of what my body is performing , but glitches of what my mind is experiencing. ..You are the genius as perception is in the eye of the beholder...


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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Offlineegolesss
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Re: ego loss [Re: Kid]
    #443766 - 11/01/01 01:31 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

Kid I've never reached anything pesonal with LSD, I've eaten my share but this debate is completely superegoless....


--------------------
Going crazy will drive you mad, but once you get there the rest is easy....All spores are not created equal!!!!!!!!!!! Sporeworks, Hawkseye, PF, they are completely viable with very strong genetics.




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InvisibleGlowing_Eleven
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Re: ego loss [Re: egolesss]
    #443770 - 11/01/01 01:35 AM (16 years, 23 days ago)

I have found nothing is really definable, and its hard because we are conditioned to want exact definitions and outcomes for everything....

Life just isn't like that...and all those supposedly definable little things are what makes life..... its just all relative... It makes me crazy
I've seen to much... I haven't seen enough


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