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 Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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 Sterile equipment question 
#3170795 - 09/23/04 04:24 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Hi, everyone! I haven't started growing anything, yet, but am preparing to right now. I've spent about 2 weeks reading up(tek instructions more than once at shroomery and erowid) instruction, tips and problems. But I have some questions before I get started.
1. I have sterile niddles(20ga), syringes(10cc), water(DI) and scalpels. They are either wrapped in sterile wraps from autoclaves or in original packing. Is there any point in sterilizing them at home? Aren't I asking for more trouble by trying to sterilize them again?
2. Assuming the answer is "don't mess with them"... Because of geographic location, I can only get spore print here. So, I ordered a couple of prints from sporeworks and they should be here in couple of days. I need to make the spore syringes with minimum risk of comtamination as possible in my kitchen. All the instructions for spore syrange seem to doesn't deal with presterilized equipment. What would be the best way to do this? I can get a sterile container, but it'd be a bit on the large size for this use. And, also I read from erowid to use 1mmx1mm from print... is that enough?
For obvious reasons, I'll be using PF Tek and sticking to it as much as possible.
I made the jars already using ground up brown rice and verm. I steam cooked them for 2 hours each.(Yeah, I can be very patient) I guess I'm looking for last minute tips. I read a lot, but still a bit anxious about it. I don't like anyone telling me I'm a failure, and surely don't want the damn fungus to tell me that... Anyways, thanks in advance.
Sam
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 pshawny
Mycobian
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 1,332
Loc: Shroomery
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3170842 - 09/23/04 04:36 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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the syringes and needles come sterile, so there is no need to mess with them, they are ready to use. Spring water is good to use right out of the bottle too. Flame sterilize the scalpel before using though.
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Gr0wer
always improving
Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 6,056
Loc: El Paso, TX 
Last seen: 6 years, 1 month
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: pshawny]
#3171001 - 09/23/04 05:11 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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You can use the pre sterilized stuff as is. Unrap and fill syringes with sterile water in a pint or half pint jar with a polyfill wad in the lid. I wouldnt use spring water without sterilizing first. After the syringes are empty you can just re steralize the syringes filled with water. Have them pointed up so the water doesn't boil out.
I normally like using dark syringes and use 1/8-1/4 of a print.
For what obvious reasons are you using PF tek? The grain teks liek wbs, corn, or rye are far better and colonize quicker since you shake them and easily G2G. Some PF jars take over a month to colonize when a normal grain jars its 1-2 weeks. I would advise to try corn or rye first then try WBS if you start going bulk and spawning.
Edited by Gr0wer (09/23/04 05:13 PM)
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Gr0wer]
#3171063 - 09/23/04 05:29 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Grower, you mean 1/8-1/4 for a half pint jar of water or per syringe? Thanx, btw.
I picked PF because it was recommended for newbie over and over again for its success rate for non-experienced growers. I'm pretty patient when I need to be, so I'll do things like packing lightly and using more innoculates and stuff. Then just wait.
One more question. My house here is not very friendly temperature-wise... It's air conditioned to 67-70F at all times. Laundry room is an exception, and I figure it's a bit cooler than outside which is aroun 85-90F/72-75F. Temperature from day to day is very consistent, even through typhoons. My office is probably a bit warmer than the rest of the house because of 6 computers in it, but only if keep the door closed. I had many ideas about incubating(like sit in waterbath heated by submerged aquarium heater), but decided to just keep it out of sight in my closet and keep the door closed(about 75F). Should I use some other incubation methods or just the closet?
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Gr0wer
always improving
Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 6,056
Loc: El Paso, TX
Last seen: 6 years, 1 month
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171099 - 09/23/04 05:36 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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1/8-1/4 per syringe.
Well i would advise to start a few PF jars then do a batch of grain jars after you see growth on the PF and you feel you have the teks down. You can even just do WBS cakes in pint jars and birh them to KISS for now.
With your temp situation i would throw together 2 tub in a tub incubators. Its a tub with water with aquarium heater then a top tub submerged into it held down with zip ties.
Have one set to 85F for incubation and the other at 75F for fruiting with pearlite or growton humidification w/ airstones. You'll see much faster growth and with optimal temps.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Gr0wer]
#3171145 - 09/23/04 05:45 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thanx Grower. I'll put together an incubator before the spores get here.
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171262 - 09/23/04 06:12 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Grower, 1 more question.. You said 1/4 print per syringe... That's only 40cc per print. Is that right? Cuz, I was under the impression, print makes more.
Sam
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Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Ayrios
Stranger
Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 619
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171273 - 09/23/04 06:14 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Personal preference. I recommend stretching it out. 40cc isn't enough from a decent print... Having a dark syringe is novelty when your syringe looks like Nugrape.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Ayrios]
#3171347 - 09/23/04 06:27 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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so, stretch out to how much?
Sam
--------------------
Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Ayrios
Stranger
Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 619
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171359 - 09/23/04 06:29 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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100cc sounds good.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Ayrios]
#3171373 - 09/23/04 06:31 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thanx.
--------------------
Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Gr0wer
always improving
Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 6,056
Loc: El Paso, TX
Last seen: 6 years, 1 month
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Ayrios]
#3171381 - 09/23/04 06:32 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well if your taking more prints in the end then theres no harm in having allot of spores.
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NOS4A2
This is the way
Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 572
Loc: -tite
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171443 - 09/23/04 06:43 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Sam you seem to be worried about using too much of your print...
have you seen any liquid culture teks
I'd use some of that print to start a couple of jars of liq cult at the same time you innoc those jars. then by the next time you need to innoc you can go crazy!
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MadHatR
journeyman
Registered: 10/13/03
Posts: 278
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Gr0wer]
#3171558 - 09/23/04 07:03 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I agree. Start off with a nice big collection of spores for the first syringe, especially if it is your first time. This will promote faster colonization. The faster it can get to a fully colonized jar the less chance of contamination. Often times that is why something like rye is good to start off with. While you would not have the verm barrier to help with contaims the fast growth strengthens the myc and allows it to fight off contaims itself if need be. Also instead of verm you just go down to you local post office and get tons of free filter discs that do a great job of keeping them nasty contaims out. The double tub is the way to go for good temp control. Just plan for the future. Get larger ones then you think you need, you will grow into it, and you can always toss a blanket over the top of it to stop any extra heat lose. On a average batch you should be able to inoc them all with 1 syringe averaging 1cc per jar. Remember to flame the needle prior to every time you inoc, even if you inocing 4 times in the same jar for best results. Also I would recommend that you take 2 or 3 of those jars once they are fully white, seal them up good and put them in the fridge, that way you will always have a source of spores and will never have to buy that strain again. You can at a later date inject karo and water into them, shake then suck it back out and in a few days you have a ready made syringe for easy inocs. If done right you should only have to use that first 1/4 of the print, then you have the rest left over for backup. Just seal it away and do transfers with the jars you just made.
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tripndicular
My Minds Eye IsRhizomorphic
Registered: 08/25/02
Posts: 2,791
Loc: Bowels of HELL
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3171724 - 09/23/04 07:40 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sam1912 said:
Grower, you mean 1/8-1/4 for a half pint jar of water or per syringe? Thanx, btw.
I picked PF because it was recommended for newbie over and over again for its success rate for non-experienced growers. I'm pretty patient when I need to be, so I'll do things like packing lightly and using more innoculates and stuff. Then just wait.
One more question. My house here is not very friendly temperature-wise... It's air conditioned to 67-70F at all times. Laundry room is an exception, and I figure it's a bit cooler than outside which is aroun 85-90F/72-75F. Temperature from day to day is very consistent, even through typhoons. My office is probably a bit warmer than the rest of the house because of 6 computers in it, but only if keep the door closed. I had many ideas about incubating(like sit in waterbath heated by submerged aquarium heater), but decided to just keep it out of sight in my closet and keep the door closed(about 75F). Should I use some other incubation methods or just the closet?
During the germination\incubation periods pick the warmer area of your home like around 82-86*F temp , then when it comes time to initiate pinning go for the area that is in the mid 70's to 82*F area that way you will not have to have other equipment to regulate heat .
Good Luck
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Any information I give is not intended to aide you in the production of potentialy illegal substances !None of my exp comes from growing illegal varities , so take it as you will .
So with that said here is our mission statement .
Then the priest fell into a trance or swoon,& said unto the Queen of heaven ; Write unto us the ordeals; write unto us the rituals; write unto us the law !
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: tripndicular]
#3172838 - 09/23/04 10:44 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'm not worried about using too much spores. I ordered 2 diff strains to optimize my chances of success this time. Just wondering, because according to PF tek info from Erowid(which BTW seem to be the only one to quantify number of syringes from a print) they said UPTO 50. I would like to use as spores as possible on as many jars as possible. I have 30 Jars prep'ed right now, so I was figuring 1cc per site(more is good, right?), 4 sites per jar, that'd require 120cc, which would require 12 10cc syringes, and 1/4 print per syringe only gives me 8 syringes. I thought I had plenty to go around when I was reading the instruction. I knew that UPTO wasn't meant for me, but I didn't expect to be short on spores for 30 jars...
Grower, btw, I went out and got 3 large boxes and two large tupperware type container for the incubator. Right before I went out to get them, I read a thread where people were arguing if they needed it or not. I just figured you know your shroom no matter what people say.
And I think I'm okay on the fruiting. My room stays at 76F at 47% humidity with doors closed. I can remember to keep it closed.
Back to spore print... I'm still planning on making 12 syranges. That's 60cc of innoculates from each print, and still planning on 1cc per site/4 sites per jar. I should be okay, right?
Thanx, Grower, and thanx everyone.
Sam
--------------------
Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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Ayrios
Stranger
Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 619
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3172884 - 09/23/04 10:52 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Nooo... PF tek says 1cc per jar, not hole. Do 1, 1.5cc per jar.
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MadHatR
journeyman
Registered: 10/13/03
Posts: 278
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Ayrios]
#3173016 - 09/23/04 11:20 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Any more than 1 or 1.5cc per jar will cause problems with to much moisture. They should have 1/4 marks on the syringe, just do 1/4cc in each hole. The only way you could go above 1.5cc per jar would be if you took that into account when adding the water in the jar during prep. When doing that many make sure you clean that needle every time you take it out of the jar for best results.
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Sam1912
journeyman
Registered: 09/23/04
Posts: 2,142
Loc: Cali
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Ayrios]
#3173023 - 09/23/04 11:22 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Um.. I know it says drips and 1cc per jar, but there was an adaptation method...
http://www.erowid.org/plants/mushrooms/mushrooms_mmgg.shtml#Large_Inoculation
That's it. Should I ignore it? It does make sense, though. Everything I read basically said more the better as is in this thread.
Now, you are getting me worried again about spore counts...
Am i missing something?
Sam
--------------------
Protect your civil rights! End drug prohibition. And if you don't care about your civil rights, protect mine!
If you want a rating from me, please PM me. For those really newbies, don't expect an answer back, but you can try me anyways.
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MadHatR
journeyman
Registered: 10/13/03
Posts: 278
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
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Re: Sterile equipment question [Re: Sam1912]
#3173174 - 09/23/04 11:58 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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I have tried several different amounts, and 1 - 1.5cc seems to be the magic number. I have had good results with more, but you really have to have a eye for it. I would put more in the ones that looked a bit dry after PCing, this would balance it out. Putting to much in a jar often causes a slight yellow run off, and as always to much moisture invites in contaims. It's all a balancing act.
You might want to start with a karo/honey/malt jar. Then use the rest of the syringe if you have no empty ones to inoc jars. Then in a few days the karo/honey/malt jar will be ready. Use the now empty syringe to pull up your myc from the karo/honey/malt jar and do the rest of your jars with that. You will be surprised how much faster the karo ones fully colonize.
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