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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms
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Re: Portobello's [Re: Hotnuts]
    #7666924 -

Wow, well he sure enough said that. Man, I just don't know what his source is for saying that. I've read a lot fo the papers on pubmed, and I just do not know about that.

In fact I just found this there. 2 sides to every story?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17504192&ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Agaritine and its derivatives are potential inhibitors against HIV proteases.

Gao WN, Wei DQ, Li Y, Gao H, Xu WR, Li AX, Chou KC.
College of Life Science and Technology, Shanghai Jiaotong University, 800 Donglin Road, Minhang District, Shanghai, China.

Agaritine, or beta-N-[gamma-L(+)-glutamyl]-4-hydroxymethylphenylhydrazine, is a Chinese herbal medicine, known having the antiviral and anticancer function. However, so far no reports whatsoever have been made for its potential as an anti-HIV agent. It was observed by docking experiments for more than 9,000 compounds extracted from various Chinese medicines that the compound agaritine distinguished itself from all the others in binding to the HIV protease with the most favorable free energy. Based on this, a series of derivatives were generated by modifying agaritine. It has been observed thru an extensive docking study that some of agaritine derivatives had markedly stronger binding interaction with the HIV protease than agaritine, suggesting that these derivatives might be good candidates for developing drugs for AIDS therapy.

PMID: 17504192 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Also it is not very stable of a molecule and degrades quickly after the time of harvest. It further degrades if the mushrooms are prepared in any fashion (soaked, boiled, baked, fried, etc...). See this article

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=12396396&ordinalpos=7&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Influence of storage and household processing on the agaritine content of the cultivated Agaricus mushroom.

Interestingly enough, it appears that agaritine causes cancer in mice, but not rats...

Fate of the mushroom hydrazine agaritine in the rat and mouse.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=10965520&ordinalpos=10&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

More evidence of the ridiculousness of the statement...

Failure of the cultivated mushroom (Agaricus bisporus) to induce tumors in the A/J mouse lung tumor model.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=9570389&ordinalpos=12&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Also check this out;
Genotoxicity of agaritine in the lacI transgenic mouse mutation assay: evaluation of the health risk of mushroom consumption.

Of the mushroom diets, significant effects were seen only with the crude agaritine extract: it induced an increase in MF of 100% in the kidney and 50% in the forestomach. The other two A. bisporus diets, with lower agaritine doses, showed slightly but not significantly, raised MF values in the kidney alone. Thus, agaritine was weakly genotoxic in vivo; no genotoxic activity other than that attributable to agaritine was detected in A. bisporus.

the rest here;
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=7737599&ordinalpos=16&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

And really the list goes on and on...
Lack of carcinogenicity of agaritine by subcutaneous administration in mice.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=6539423&ordinalpos=25&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

So the jury is still out as far as I'm concerned. Really any mushrooms growing in a contaminated environment (from agri-chemicals, air pollution, heavy metals contaminations, etc...) could be really bad for you. So a lot of the benefits and dangers of mushrooms are modulated by so many factors.

It's a balancing act to maximize the benefits and minimize exposures to toxins as much as possible.


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Jeremy_Davis]
    #7667166 -

Cool I read most of the articles, but did not understand shit.

So cooking reduces Agaritine huh. and that is what they (who ever they is) say is responsible for tumors??

I think Paul just said that as those are the commonly available mushrooms, and he cultivates all these other crazy mushrooms so his is the best.

Kind of like an insurance company saying their web-site will give you their rates and the rates of their competitors... ya right.


--------------------
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions?
- Scott Adams

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Re: Portobello's [Re: abesh]
    #7667960 -

abesh said:
I think Paul just said that as those are the commonly available mushrooms, and he cultivates all these other crazy mushrooms so his is the best.

Kind of like an insurance company saying their web-site will give you their rates and the rates of their competitors... ya right.


Well said :mushroom2:


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Jeremy_Davis]
    #7669352 -

To be honest; if there were any sound information or data relating the mushrooms in question to cancers, i'd think the FDA would be more likely to step in and take a look at this further. IMO the entire topic is highly over rated.

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Hotnuts]
    #7676018 -

The FDA? Riiiight. Like how they let meat from tumorous animals and animals with infected cuts to be sold as grade A, and allowing puss in they milk sold to consumers.


--------------------
MY TRADE LIST!!!

FULLY AUTOMATIC!! 12-Pot Multi Grow Hydroponic System for Trade.


Download PSX ISOs

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Re: Portobello's [Re: legallyhomeless]
    #7676053 -

now thats pure nasty.

Who wants a steak and glass of milk???

-Graham


--------------------
www.MycoPath.com
Mushroom Spawn, Cultures, Fungi Bags, Casings, Master Grain Jars, Bags for In-vitro, Laboratory supplies, and much more!
Mushroom Supplies. Fast Turnaround Times. Great Service.
orders@mycopath.com
enter code shroomery for 10% off product.

www.FungiForum.com

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Cryogenicz]
    #7676124 -

Cryogenicz said:
now thats pure nasty.

Who wants a steak and glass of milk???

-Graham


No one I know haha


--------------------
MY TRADE LIST!!!

FULLY AUTOMATIC!! 12-Pot Multi Grow Hydroponic System for Trade.


Download PSX ISOs

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Re: Portobello's [Re: legallyhomeless]
    #7676324 -

legallyhomeless said:
The FDA? Riiiight. Like how they let meat from tumorous animals and animals with infected cuts to be sold as grade A, and allowing puss in they milk sold to consumers.


That's b.s. Let's keep the thread on track please.

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Hotnuts]
    #7676340 -

Funny how you can bunk something you have no knowledge on :thumbup: Ive been a vegetarian almost my entire life. And No not one of thoes crazy ones that would save a drowning dog before a baby. RESEARCH my friend. Thats why we are all here.


--------------------
MY TRADE LIST!!!

FULLY AUTOMATIC!! 12-Pot Multi Grow Hydroponic System for Trade.


Download PSX ISOs

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Re: Portobello's [Re: legallyhomeless]
    #7677240 -

I have complete knowledge on this. My mother's entire family are steer and dairy farmers. :rolleyes:

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Hotnuts]
    #7678146 -

:thumbup: great. PM me if u want to continue this discussion


--------------------
MY TRADE LIST!!!

FULLY AUTOMATIC!! 12-Pot Multi Grow Hydroponic System for Trade.


Download PSX ISOs

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Re: Portobello's [Re: legallyhomeless]
    #7680142 -

hotnuts, did you do anything speceil to get the spores to germinate on the agar? Was the salt added to aid germination?


--------------------
Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.


My Legacy
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22140987#22140987

Teh=The
I need to proofread

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Re: Portobello's [Re: tahoe]
    #7680185 -

Using gill fragments from a somewhat live specimen allows for an easy culturing. I have heard that spores from Agaricus species can be tricky to germinate on agar. I think it was Workman that stated to try to generate biological activity in the plate along with the spores in order to trigger Agaricus germination? I can't remember who it was, but I think it was Workman. The live gill fragments give you that activity. I would've cloned the mushroom, but that would be cheating. :wink: I'd rather work for my own isolate to be honest.

The salt was added to the agar to limit the contaminates from the gill fragments that were used from a specimen that was purchased in the wide open. No container, just a heap of mushrooms in the produce aisle.

Edited by Hotnuts (11/26/07 06:57 AM)

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Re: Portobello's [Re: Hotnuts]
    #7680664 -

Stupid question: So you mix some salt while preparing the agar?
And how much salt?

Also where would one get blood meal?
I would guess maybe like a farm supply store but just want to be sure rather than go there and look stupid. :crazy:


--------------------
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions?
- Scott Adams

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Re: Portobello's [Re: abesh]
    #7680737 -

1ml of non-iodized salt/100ml of water. The salt helps keep the bacteria down.

Farm supply stores and even places like Lowes or HD carry it. Most stores with a garden section in them will propably have it.

Edited by Hotnuts (11/26/07 07:03 AM)

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Re: Portobello's [Re: legallyhomeless]
    #28329455 -

Paul Stamets agreed, only if eaten RAW. Cook all mushrooms on high heat recommended

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