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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: LosTresOjos]
    #25872313 -

Kinda but there's far bigger and more serious realizations to be had.

As far as faith goes, my view on it is my view, people have their own interpretation of what things are about, and the word "faith" has been corrupted by religion. To me, faith means exactly what i said it means, it means that even though you've went through all this stuff and experienced all this stuff and came to all these realizations and teachings and remembrances and knowledge/wisdom, when you go back to your day to day life, especially without another experience here and there to refresh your memory and keep you connected to that deeper realm of understanding, you lose/distance yourself away from that connection, and when the connection is gone, the ego takes back over and most of what has been learned falls back into a distant memory that causes you to forget what you've learned or fall back into egoic ways, hence without that ongoing connection, it can be easy to forget or to dismiss what one has went through/experienced and chalk it up to nothing more than some chemical alteration "drug effect" or just some weirdly awesome time in your life but nothing more. Therefore faith can be useful in that you know what you've experienced was/is real, and even though you can barely remember that connection, there's still a strong sense of knowing that what you went through was real and important and it did happen, therefore to keep the faith means to remember that connection even if you're not any longer connected. That's where religion fucked up, because they left the connection behind and went with authentic faith, which after a good long while most likely, turned into blind faith because nobody remembered what that connection was like.

For example, i didn't know about any of this stuff until i took Ayahuasca and experimented around with that for a good long while, and while i'm on Ayahuasca the connection is fully alive and active, but if i haven't had Ayahuasca for a good long while, that connection fades, hence why it's good to at the least, have an experience every now and then to refresh that connection and keep it alive. If you don't, then you end up falling back into everyday consciousness and going about your usual life while disconnected from "the source" or from this higher perception, and thus is why faith can sometimes be required, especially if it's based around some sort of structure one can integrate into their day to day lives.

So authentic faith is a remembrance and i guess celebration/recognition of that connection to something larger than our day to day selves. Blind faith on the other hand, is the result of the lack of direct experience and the lack of a true connection, so blind faith is trust in whatever the authorities of religion tell you to believe in, whereas authentic faith is trust in your own experience, your own personal connection, and the knowing that accompanies it.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872397 -

Ok, so blind faith is faith, and authentic faith is long term memory? And since your authentic faith is admittedly weak it's good to re-up on the experience?

I guess the only thing I disagree with is you use of the word faith when other words, like memory, are more accurate.

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872413 -

Because memory implies that you can actually remember most of what you experienced, rather than a few snippets. Therefore authentic faith implies everything you've went through and the authenticity of it all and of the connection that was active. Memory is a good word for what's rememberable about it, but if you can't remember the depth of that connection, faith is a good word to go for.

I think the only one's who have an issue with the word faith, is because they have something against anything tied to religion, which i understand, religion is fucked up and far away from the original religion based around sacramental Entheogenic use, what we have today is a mockery so it's understandable that people would have something against the word "faith". I used to too, until i understood it more deeply.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872435 -

I use the word more to represent trust in the process, trust in the source, trust in the connection, trust in the authenticity of it all, trust in the magic and mysticism of it all, it's basically trusting the universe to help guide you along your life's path, which does seem to happen at least ime with Aya it was like the universe was listening and things were getting way synchronistic and things just kept unfolding and lining up, and i have faith that what i experienced was real even though in my current state i'm only focused on the present and don't really reflect back much on the past, therefore it's hard to recall a lot of what i've went through, but the connection does pick back up every now and then, when i take some more Aya/Psilo-huasca.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: LosTresOjos]
    #25872569 -

I can give you an example of wisdom.

*Silence*

Let's talk about the ineffable!

For the record, I VERY RARELY see visuals put front and center. Maybe you guys just do it for everyone if they even mention them.

I constantly see people posting in very simple ways about the amazing experience rhat is psychedelics.

It's good to see that SO MANY people have experienced and learned some of the same fucking things I have, and to not be alone.

Just recently read a trip report aboit it from someone who took a high dose of azure


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Within You , Without You


:mushroom2::levitate::mushroom2:

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872570 -

Sabnock said:
Because memory implies that you can actually remember most of what you experienced, rather than a few snippets. Therefore authentic faith implies everything you've went through and the authenticity of it all and of the connection that was active. Memory is a good word for what's rememberable about it, but if you can't remember the depth of that connection, faith is a good word to go for.


Hell, I'm lucky if remember more than snippets right afterwards. You could use the words "vague memory" instead of "authentic faith" and it would still be more accurate. Do you even have a citation for what "authentic faith" means? Cause I'm guessing it means whatever faith the person talking about it thinks 'they' have.

Quote:
I think the only one's who have an issue with the word faith, is because they have something against anything tied to religion...


That's exactly right. The problem with most religions is that they rely on faith, and trump their weakness as a virtue. It's very clever and why they're bullshit. Psychedelics are different and NOT bullshit because they DON'T rely on faith. You and Doblin are unwittingly cheapening the reputation of the real experience, equivocating it with faith based religion, for which every member thereof would tell you their faith is authentic.

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872627 -

kabel said:
Sabnock said:
Because memory implies that you can actually remember most of what you experienced, rather than a few snippets. Therefore authentic faith implies everything you've went through and the authenticity of it all and of the connection that was active. Memory is a good word for what's rememberable about it, but if you can't remember the depth of that connection, faith is a good word to go for.


Hell, I'm lucky if remember more than snippets right afterwards. You could use the words "vague memory" instead of "authentic faith" and it would still be more accurate. Do you even have a citation for what "authentic faith" means? Cause I'm guessing it means whatever faith the person talking about it thinks 'they' have.

Quote:
I think the only one's who have an issue with the word faith, is because they have something against anything tied to religion...


That's exactly right. The problem with most religions is that they rely on faith, and trump their weakness as a virtue. It's very clever and why they're bullshit. Psychedelics are different and NOT bullshit because they DON'T rely on faith. You and Doblin are unwittingly cheapening the reputation of the real experience, equivocating it with faith based religion, for which every member thereof would tell you their faith is authentic.



Without authentic experience, there can not be authentic faith. Those who can't separate modern religion from original religion probably won't understand where a lot of this stuff came from.

So just because i use the word faith which is associated with man made religion i'm somehow cheapening the reputation of real experience? I beg to differ, but okay.

Also, the problem with religion isn't that they rely on faith, i mean it is when it comes to blind faith, but their problem is they don't have direct experience, and direct experience would lead to authentic faith based on a more authentic understanding of the spiritual/religious. And no, Psychedelics do not require faith, as Dennis McKenna said - "No wonder psychedelics are threatening to an authoritarian religious hierarchy, you don't need faith to benefit from a psychedelic experience, let alone a priest or even a shaman to interpret it. What you need is courage - courage to drink the brew, eat the mushroom, or whatever it is, and then to pay attention, and make of it what you will. Suddenly, the tools for direct contact with the transcendent other (whether you call it God or something else) is taken from the hands of an anointed elite and given to the individual seeker." However, the faith comes afterwards, after the direct experience, after you've allowed your path to unfold, after the connection has died down a good bit. Faith is a reminder, a trust, not a blind belief in bullshit.


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Edited by Sabnock (03/13/19 10:25 PM)

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Enkidu]
    #25872631 -

Enkidu said:
I can give you an example of wisdom.

*Silence*

Let's talk about the ineffable!

For the record, I VERY RARELY see visuals put front and center. Maybe you guys just do it for everyone if they even mention them.

I constantly see people posting in very simple ways about the amazing experience rhat is psychedelics.

It's good to see that SO MANY people have experienced and learned some of the same fucking things I have, and to not be alone.

Just recently read a trip report aboit it from someone who took a high dose of azure


True. A wise man once said nothing, not only because a lot of it is ineffable, but also because there's no way to impart such understanding on those who've not themselves been there. And you're definitely not alone :smile:


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872668 -

Sabnock said:
Without authentic experience, there can not be authentic faith. Those who can't separate modern religion from original religion probably won't understand where a lot of this stuff came from.


"Those who can't separate" being pretty much every modern religious person in the world. How far do you have to go down this google search to find an "authentic" faith that isn't the same as "blind" faith?

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872671 -

kabel said:
Sabnock said:
Without authentic experience, there can not be authentic faith. Those who can't separate modern religion from original religion probably won't understand where a lot of this stuff came from.


"Those who can't separate" being pretty much every modern religious person in the world. How far do you have to go down this google search to find an "authentic" faith that isn't the same as "blind" faith?


Go within, not to google.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872680 -

Just like they say the real work comes after the Psychedelic experience (even though the Psychedelic experience itself can be work), faith can also come after the Psychedelic experience to help you integrate the things you've learned into your day to day life.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872685 -

Sabnock said:
Go within, not to google.


Been there done that, and I don't have to contradict myself. How did you put it? Oh yeah...

Quote:
Personally i go more with Dennis McKenna's line of, with Psychedelics you don't need faith, you can say "i know that this is real, because i've experienced it".


See, I agree with you... half the time. Had I triggered your autism the other way I bet you'd be arguing the opposite.

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872693 -

Religion, because it's distanced itself from the authentic connection to soul/spirit, has also distanced itself from the proper use of the terminologies they use. A lot of stuff from modern religions do match up with original religion aka Entheogenic use, however they've gotten so far off point and distracted and led astray that they no longer have the proper understanding. Therefore, they're operating on blind faith (faith in the system, in the religion, in the savior/deity) rather than authentic faith based in direct experience.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872695 -

Quote:
kabel said: Been there done that


Apparently not deeply enough lol.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872700 -

Right, if only I had more faith, lol

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872708 -

Blind faith is belief without true understanding, perception, and experience. Authentic faith is belief due to true understanding, perception, and experience.

Do you get it yet? lol. Blind faith = no direct experience. Authentic faith = trust in direct experience.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872712 -

I guess not everyone reaches a deep enough understanding of these things. I guess i got lucky :shrug:


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872727 -

No, I completely disagree. I agree with the Dennis McKenna quote YOU quoted, and said YOU mostly agree with.

I'll leave it there. You can win this argument and have the last word. Your ego is smaller, lol :bow2:

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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: kabel]
    #25872729 -

kabel said:
No, I completely disagree. I agree with the Dennis McKenna quote YOU quoted, and said YOU mostly agree with.

I'll leave it there. You can win this argument and have the last word. Your ego is smaller, lol :bow2:


Spoken like someone who still has more work to do.


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Re: Am I sensitive to psilocybin or what? [Re: Sabnock]
    #25872735 -

"I know this is real even though i've never experienced it and blindly believe whatever the bible and religious masters say"

vs

"I know this is real because i've experienced it personally/directly, i receive my understanding from within, from soul/spirit, rather than from external sources"

= blind faith vs authentic faith. If you don't understand that, idk how much clearer i can make it mate lmfao.


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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