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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic] * 1
    #25677666 -

Christianity is a giant jackoff. Held me back when I was young and now restrains freedom in my society. It's a good way to take a lot of money from stupid people and if you're a priest you can get away with fucking children. All this deep discussion is just more jackoff bullshit, the topic is a waste of energy and time.


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Inspiration move me brightly.[gradient:#C7C7D4,#CFD4C7]y[/gradient]

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: InfraredRick]
    #25677674 -

Truth is people want to live forever and VERY CHEAPLY christianity promises that.  It might not be an issue but it's viral and completely political.  It's not even so much a way to avoid mortal fear as it is a way now, to be seriously delusional about being superiour.


Like Jesus said, you're all hypocrates.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: InfraredRick]
    #25679770 -

Apparently you do not know very much about your own psyche, its historical, cultural, social, psychological, or philosophical influences. It seems equally probable that you know a good deal about bullshitting and jacking off. :lol:


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25693821 -

I consider myself an esoteric Christian, but I think Christ would be ashamed at the state of Christianity today. I am considering a vocation to the Episcopal priesthood however, which is like Catholic but more open and accepting to gay people, allows women priests, et cetera.

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: HulGil]
    #25695292 -

Reading other religions, it's easy to understand that modern Christians are not reborn.  Rebirth is enlightenment.  It doesn't come with a simple prayer and joining a church.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Morel Guy]
    #25703533 -

Everyone reading this thread has been helped by Christianity. Before Jesus of Nazareth, the world was a dark, cruel place. People killed each other for sport and slavery was the norm. Jesus showed us that a kinder, more gentle world could be possible.

Since it's Christmas, I'm reminded of the lyrics from O Holy Night. "Chains shall He break for the slave is our brother. His law is love and His gospel is peace." That sums up Christianity in a nut shell.

It's fashionable to trash on organized religion. Surely, every Christian falls short of the standard He set. We're all broken and fallen. But religion - particularly Christianity - is not to blame for the flaws of mankind. To the contrary, it is the only way to overcome those flaws.

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Jeers]
    #25703562 -

Is going to church how you practice Christianity?

If so, what spiritual authority do pastors have and how did they acquire it?

I feel like personal growth isn't a part of contemporary Christianity and that you have to meditate and achieve depth on your own.


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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: yeah]
    #25703658 -

yeah said:
Is going to church how you practice Christianity?



Nope! Going to church is important, because it creates a sense of community and allows fellow Christians to encourage each other as we follow Christ. It also allows us to partake in sacred rituals, like baptism and communion. But going to church is NOT how one practices Christianity.

Jesus taught that the greatest command was to love God - and the second greatest was to love your neighbor. He taught that only by losing your life in service to God and neighbor can one find purpose and meaning - and, ultimately, life everlasting. Christianity is practiced by comforting the sick, visiting the lonely, and making the world a kinder place. It is practiced by putting the needs of others before your own selfish desires. It is practiced by making your life less about yourself and more about serving others.

In Christianity, one cannot "achieve depth on your own," as you suggest. Rather, personal growth requires that you forget about yourself and focus on others. I can say from personal experience that the times I've been happiest were the times I was focused on others...and the times I was most miserable, were the times I was focused on myself.

Without a doubt, every Christian falls short of the goals Christ set for us. But we're trying...

Edited by Jeers (12/26/18 01:34 PM)

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Jeers]
    #25703941 -

Christianity has helped me by giving cuties a reason to come talk to me, being conversion. Usually it ends up with them talking me into joining up to which I decline. I appreciate the interaction nonetheless.


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Terence McKenna's biggest fan

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Jeers]
    #25704549 -

Jeers said:
Everyone reading this thread has been helped by Christianity. Before Jesus of Nazareth, the world was a dark, cruel place. People killed each other for sport and slavery was the norm. Jesus showed us that a kinder, more gentle world could be possible.

Since it's Christmas, I'm reminded of the lyrics from O Holy Night. "Chains shall He break for the slave is our brother. His law is love and His gospel is peace." That sums up Christianity in a nut shell.

It's fashionable to trash on organized religion. Surely, every Christian falls short of the standard He set. We're all broken and fallen. But religion - particularly Christianity - is not to blame for the flaws of mankind. To the contrary, it is the only way to overcome those flaws.



Only in that area of the world.  That's the problem with christian-centric people.  They all think their religion is all the world was.  Like the world revolved around the middle east.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: HulGil]
    #25714708 -

I took a 2 year non-ordinational M.T.S. degree from Drew University's United Methodist seminary. I was just stalling after undergrad studies, having gone from pre-med to philosophy and finally  I considered becoming a monk for a while, interviewed with a Capuchin Reformed Franciscan, a Benedictine and a Cistercian (Trappist). I eventually woke up from that notion. I love women and all the monks I met were Gay. :shrug: Considering that I was raised in a Reformed Jewish home by liberal parents, then got baptized in a Roman Catholic church, a seminary degree where I focused on the psychology of religion and comparative religion was a compromise and a preparation. I wanted to help others so I became a psychotherapist and a hypnotherapist in the 1980s. But, if you feel a calling, pursue it. It does not have to be for life it it doesn't fit. Alan Watts was an Episcopalian priest before he was ordained in a Zen tradition.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25720659 -

That's very interesting Markos. I myself was preparing to become a Jesuit priest until I got fed up with the Catholic Church. What attracted me to the Jesuits was how well-rounded and liberal they were, and more accepting of gay people. This was important to me because I myself am gay. But until Vatican Three happens, I'm not going to become a Catholic priest.

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Shroomigan]
    #25722248 -

Shroomigan said:
Christianity has helped me by giving cuties a reason to come talk to me, being conversion. Usually it ends up with them talking me into joining up to which I decline. I appreciate the interaction nonetheless.


Do you feel you'd enjoy talking better with those guys, knowing that they aren't just speaking with you with the intention to 'convert' you?

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: HulGil]
    #25729458 -

:lol: I don't know what Jesuits you have met, but the word liberal doesn't come to my mind when I hear about them! I worked for the Miami Catholic Archdiocese as a clinical consultant for marriage annulments. it was a racket, reading anecdotal materials from friends, relatives, and witnesses which would suggest some clinical reason why the marriage was not valid (even after decades) because divorce is forbidden. I went by Vatican II guidelines and the DSM-IV at the time.

I was also employed to counsel priests in formation in order to discover if any were unsuitable for the priesthood for psychological reasons. I used to see them individually and in small groups in my home. EVERY young man I ever worked with was Gay, but that was not the issue. Being a masochistic submissive who would get blind drunk, submit to humiliations in the pitch black back rooms of leather bars, and wake up under a tree in some field was cause for censure. However, this was the 80s, and given the kind of perversity that went uncorrected before the shit hit the fan about pedophilia in recent years, I wouldn't be surprised if lots of really disturbed and disordered young men were ordained back then.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

Edited by MarkostheGnostic (01/07/19 07:35 PM)

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25751200 -

Whether you see it as literal or not, the story of christ redeeming all things can be very powerful, especially for a jew mindset which is who the message was originally intended for. Jesus revealed that god is actually not an evil taskmaster who requires blood sacrifice in order to accept you.
The law is an extension of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (the eating of which caused the Fall) and it was fulfilled and done away with by christ as he made all things new and whole. repentance (metanoia) is simply acknowledging that and therefore becoming free of concepts like separation, guilt, shame and blame. The gospel was supposed to be the end of religion or any list of dos and don'ts.
the christ story also serves as an outline for this journey from bondage to union as we accept the gospel at a heart level. Jesus surrendered his sense of doership to god (not my will, but yours) then found himself being crucified (a picture of ego death) and rising again with all creation (liberation), every valley lifted and mountain made low.

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: mt cleverest] * 1
    #25752773 -

I think your words, "jew mindset," reveals far more about you than the all rest of your words and concepts combined. Moreover, you seem a bit confused, conflating your own take with the actual biblical material, literalism and idiosyncratic concepts. The biblical Iesous WAS a blood sacrifice. His 'vicarious sacrifice' was supposed to be the completion of temple sacrifices of the pascal lamb according to Jewish tradition. He also served as the 'scape goat' in Jewish practice. Unfortunately, aside from ritual sacrifice, God knows how many lambs are sacrificed for Eastern Orthodox Christian Easter let alone the animals killed for other Christian celebratory meals along with Jewish and Muslim butchering. This is not religion mind you, it is just heartless gluttony of animal-eating humans.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic] * 1
    #25753384 -

I can't say that the gospel was intended for jews without being accused of what?  antisemitism? lol you are a funny guy.
Yes Jesus was a sacrifice but god didn't actually require Jesus' blood in order to accept humanity, humanity did. we are only separate in our minds.  the sacrifice (whether it happened or not, I'm more concerned with the metaphor) was a fulfillment of OT prophecy and was the proclamation of the end of the old system. Yes it was originally designed for the pharisaic mind with its long history of trying to appease god via blood sacrifice.
but in seeing that its not just the jew who feels unworthy and separate with a need to barter with god to get what they want, the gospel was opened to the gentiles too.
the concept of a living sacrifice works for everyone. as metaphor for surrendering your will to god to do as He will with you, which has always been the case we just hold onto an illusory sense of agency, of it being "my" life.
Of course this is my take. everyone has their take. I could accuse you of conflating your take with the "actual biblical material" but I don't cus thats lame.
but I will say that it has been said many times that to neglect a mythic interpretation of scripture is to miss the message entirely.

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: mt cleverest]
    #25755096 -

Nooooo..."jew mind" is crude .For one thing,  'Jewish mind' would read better and not sound like a hillbilly who still thinks Jews have horns that pop out at night. The entire 'passion play' is built on Jewish liturgical material. Unfortunately the types of blood sacrifices were several in Temple Judaism. Then there were the burnt offerings. Iesous was intended to be the replacement as I wrote, but of course since he did not meet the criteria for Messiah to the Jews at that time, his followers were few in comparison to those who remained in the tradition. And why shouldn't they have? Judaism had a long history by the time Iesous showed up.

Even today, religious Jews in Israel cannot say what characteristics the Messiah is to have (just watch YouTube vids on that). They are like parents whose daughter's boyfriends are never good enough for their daughter. The oppressed occupied Jews of 1st century Judea wanted a warrior like King David, whose power would be preternatural if not supernatural, and he would somehow conquer the Romans. Oppressed people, weary of being humiliated, do not follow a teacher who preaches humility, mercy, and loving kindness, they want a conqueror. Not ever having a particularly strong Jewish identity, I did not feel guilt in reaching out to the Christian idioms for salvation.I was disowned by family and disinherited by my parents even though they were not religious or spiritual people.  Like Gandhi, I like Christ very much, I just do not like most people who proclaim that they are Christians. All they do is parrot the myths, but they do not live as if those myths convey any spiritual Way of being to them. :shrug: If you are, then good for you! :yesnod:


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25761605 -

Christianity is an apocalyptic doomsday machine.

Striving to be Jesus so we can pass judgment down to others in hell.  Forgetting compassion is the key to not suffering.

Just meditate always on how we judge our own feelings.  Obviously that judgment has a place and it's also largely used in futality wasting effort and energy.

Personally, I find the bible to not be an inspiration for much else than being a martyr.  Selling false promises of security based on a weak contract with belief.  Of course everyone feels justified.  So when is a soul actually saved?

Is there any enlightenment in the church?  No doubts when there is no evidence outside of belief.  Human experience and belief can be manufactured.  Making religion AT BEST striving to enjoy life as much as possible NOT BASED on hope of an afterlife, which no one can prove is there or not.

At most religion is a human attempt to live forever.  Once again the political nature of 'legacy'.  In my experience magical thinking is dangerous.  Taking bridges to nowhere.

But then again life may be so hard that it takes some delusional hope to not be totally negative and a buzzkill for the rest of what exists.  Which is precisely what religion becomes, a buzzkill for those that don't have complicated belief systems.

Non-secular science should be able to give with a far higher degree of success if religious judgments wouldn't derail the efforts of concrete truth.  Truth is religion sells a meal ticket to living life with less suffering.  Which seems to be in modern days an extremely frail ideology and brutal throughout modern history.

Who wouldn't want to live in ecstasy and be a perfect person?  Cause that is the highest ' goal ' of all religion.  Even satanism has the ideal, just different in oh so many ways.  All people want to live above what is so human.

I feel politically I cannot encourage delusionally hopeful people into furthering their spread of nonesense that they are somehow correct in their statements and actions.  Not when they condemn others based on really far out beliefs that cannot be proven and are not rightfully the core of improving the human condition.  That is the political nature of stories, that should be empty to communicate their own stated values of not causing harm.

People are unique in not being able to withstand judgment.  Being sensative deeply self aware creatures.  There are few christians that I've met that are not consumed by judgeing and comparing themselves to their religious ideals and to others.  Humanity has to get itself out of that trap.  It's the worst of the ego game and rat trap.

I do find Jesus to have achieved the greatest that man and womans mind can achieve.  All the particular details of heaven or this or that is utter bullshit.  Just a bunch of wishful thinking that is only for those that achieved the level of peace would know.  Cause at that level of achievment it's no longer important.  It's just humans fighting over concepts of things that just do not matter in the here and now.

The church tends to constantly self affirm itself.  Is that faith or strengthening a system of delusion?  Do I always have to tell myself I am alive and going to heaven?  It's impossible and not a miracle.  It's not raising above the game that mortal beis are trapped in, it is the game.  The game of self affirmation is hell.  Not saying it's unhealthy, it really depends on the grossness and grandger of the procees.  To really get out of it is the goal and ideal set forth in all religion.

The good thing about the church is being affirmed in helping others and suffering for others.  That is a great goal if not abused, for society.  That is the story of Jesus, no matter how horrible and unlikely some features.  We are not all children and can appreciate wisdom of stories without buying that there will be no christmas without believing in santa.  The point being that wisdom doesn't need the bullshit.  Buying the bullshit is a very dangerous level of the game and seriously without authenticity and without authority.

Today the world is in an uproar of bullshit.  Bullshit is celebrated as the highest authority and one cannot be authentic without being utter bullshit.  The bullshit of being a false identity and not knowing what and who you really are.  Alot of peopl want to belong to an identified culture so much that they cannot see the wisdom apart from the utter disgrace.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: How has Christianity helped you? [Re: Morel Guy]
    #25762018 -

The Eucharist is a powerful ceremony..


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Thank you for your Time...

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