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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5313767 - 02/18/06 03:53 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Dear gettinjiggywithit -

I strongly recommend a Mr. Myogi ['Karate Kid'] honk-the-nose of your opponent strategy in this case  :heart: Radical Fundamentalism of ANY tradition cannot be reasoned with, and the mental agility to assume other perspectives is fettered with emotions so hostile that they are best regarded as detrimental as gamma radiation. One of these days such an individual may deliver a nuclear holocaust or a radioactive hell just to show that my metaphor about Fundamentalist rage is not merely metaphorical! Who indeed are the Children of Wrath?
Don't say I didn't warn ya  :wink:


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: fivepointer]
    #5313785 - 02/18/06 03:58 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Jesus and Satan
Jesus and Satan were having an ongoing argument about who managed to get the most out of his computer. This had been going on for days and God, was tired of hearing all of the bickering.

God said, "Cool it. I am going to set up a test that will run two hours and I will judge who does the better job."

So down they sat at the keyboards and typed away. They moused away. They did spreadsheets, they wrote reports, they sent faxes, they sent out e-mail, they sent out e-mail with attachments, they downloaded, they did some genealogy reports, they made cards, they did every known job. But just a few minutes before the two hours were up, a lightening flashed across the sky. The thunder rolled and the rains came down hard. And of course the electricity went off.

Satan was upset. He fumed and fussed and he ranted and raved, all to no avail. The electricity stayed off. But after a bit, the rains stopped and the electricity came back on. Satan screamed, "I lost it all when the power went off. What am I going to do? What happened to Jesus' work?"

Jesus just sat and smiled.

Again Satan asked about the work that Jesus had done. As Jesus turned his computer back on the screen glowed and when he pushed "print it", it was all there. "How did he do it." Satan asked? God smiled and said, "Jesus Saves."


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #5313801 - 02/18/06 04:03 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I hear ya and thanks for the warning.;) Perhaps, I am an optimistic hopeful that the fundamentalist mentality can be broken up from its tight arse hold on dogma with some silliness infused into it so they can see how silly it is from another perspective on it.

It's all in good humored creative play for me. I'm here with open mind and heart if they want to better explain themselves.

Thank you for keeping it "light". Your joke was funny. The Lightness serves the essence of the post best! :smile:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinefivepointer
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5314001 - 02/18/06 05:28 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:
Salvation is based solely on the perfect atoning work and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ on behalf of His chosen people. Repent and believe the gospel.

Thanks you for sharing your prime example of RELIGIOUS DOGMA.

The article you posted makes doctrinal statements and therefore is dogma (according to how you use the term dogma).

Care to point out ONE lie and back it up to give your tripeful statement any use or meaning?

I am not going to spend all my time refuting such obvious nonsense. I read the article and the best word to sum it up is tripe. However I will point out one lie (it is hard to know where to start, there are so many).

You quote:
These self-evident mysteries come into one?s awareness directly as a result of the integration of one?s consciousness into the Body of Christ. And he said unto them, "Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are outside, all these things are done in parables." (Mark 4:11)

Perfect example of scripture twisting. The article asserts man can of his own efforts become aware of the mystery of the kingdom of God. This is a false teaching. Fallen man is spiritually dead (Col2:13, Eph2:1,5) and in bondage to sin and unable to understand spiritual things at all (1Cor2:14, Rom 8:7). This is why a man must be born from above before he can see the kingdom of God (John3:3). Jesus told His disciples that it was given to them to understand the mystery, but to those outside of them it was done in parables. God Himself reveals truth to those who He choses(James1:17, John6:44-5). This teaching denies original sin and man's total spiritual depravity. It also denies that God teaches His people, and this is the reason they understand anything at all.

So you honor feeling bad huh? You must be one of the ones that believes in suffering as well. No wonder you know so much about Satan.

I do not believe in suffering. I do not know how you came to this conclusion.


I realize you may have been joking around as well with your reply, because your reply read like a joke. If so..

I wish I were joking, but this is a matter of eternal life or eternal death and is no joking matter.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5314375 - 02/18/06 07:24 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I suppose that I'm not totally depraved (only partially  :grin:) by the mythic sin committed by the Original Sinner, Adama [Hebrew for Earth, I believe]. Of course, the Hebrews did not, and do not believe in the total depravity of Humankind and neither would Y'shua have if He were indeed a Hebrew (if indeed He actually existed as a historical person). Jews believe we have an evil inclination [Yetzer Hara] which we can choose not to follow. Of course, Augustine had to invent the church doctrine of Original Sin in order to make the one antidote - Jesus - absolutely necessary for salvation. Despite Jesus' own words that "I have come not for the righteous, but for the sinners," legalistic minds that would put the Biblical Pharisees to shame have manipulated scriptures to condemn Jews and Gentiles alike who do not knuckle under to the power of scripturally-derived and extracted propaganda. I once succumbed to the same brainwashing (many people only require a light rinse  :laugh:), but in re-investigating my Jewish roots, I decided to get a second opinion  :wink:.

Ya know, I would've had 'darshan' with Y'shua if I had been around, and I would've offered Him the best wine I could get in order to pick His mind. I believe that I would have gotten a smile out of Him as well, if not a laugh. He never would've threatened me with Hell or damnation because those concepts hadn't been taken from the Pagans yet, and the Jews had no such articulated concepts other than a vague 'Sheol.' 'Christian' threats of fire and brimstone began with Matthew and continue to the multitudes even today. The danger of Hell is what Fundamentalists are gonna turn this planet into with their hate and eventual destructiveness. They'll prove Armageddon is real by making it happen themselves.

Peace & Love  :heart:,
Mark[ostheGnostic]


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: fivepointer]
    #5314379 - 02/18/06 07:26 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Thank you for expansiating on your comments fivepointer.  :smile: :thumbup:

Quote:

The article you posted makes doctrinal statements and therefore is dogma (according to how you use the term dogma).




Since you couldn't grab even ONE from the article to support that comment, it remains a meaningless moot one.


Quote:

I am not going to spend all my time refuting such obvious nonsense.




Then why did you bother posting a reply in refute of the article in the first place?  :confused:

Quote:

I read the article and the best word to sum it up is tripe.




Thank you for sharing your opinion then. :smile:

Quote:

However I will point out one lie (it is hard to know where to start, there are so many).




Though I respect the fact that you see the Bible as your authority on spiritual truth, it's not mine. I realize you have no respect for that. :smile: If all that doesn't come directly from the Bible is a lie to you then, your entitled to your version of the religious truth.  I'm not a religious person myself.

I understand now now why the article offended you though.




 
Quote:

Fallen man is spiritually dead (Col2:13, Eph2:1,5) and in bondage to sin and unable to understand spiritual things at all (1Cor2:14, Rom 8:7).  This is why a man must be born from above before he can see the kingdom of God (John3:3).  Jesus told His disciples that it was given to them to understand the mystery, but to those outside of them it was done in parables.  God Himself reveals truth to those who He choses(James1:17, John6:44-5).

This teaching denies original sin and man's total spiritual depravity.  It also denies that God teaches His people, and this is the reason they understand anything at all




Fallen man is different then a spirit that chose to descend into matter. I don't believe in original sin or any sin for that matter or that all men are spiritually depraved or a God that is a He that is separate from me.:shrug: 

Quote:

I do not believe in suffering.  I do not know how you came to this conclusion.




That was easy to come to when you said the article was "feel good" and called it tripe at the same time. Feeling good must be tripe to you. What is the alternative to feeling good? Feeling bad, suffering. Simple conclusion.


Quote:

I wish I were joking, but this is a matter of eternal life or eternal death and is no joking matter.




Who is stopping you from obtaining eternal life according to the instructions in the Bible with devout seriousness? You're free too. Sounds to me like all you need is your trusty Bible and you are good to go. :thumbup:

If you jumped into this post to Bible thump the fundamentals of your Christian religion, someone may be digging it. :shrug:

Why not just start posts of your own preaching the Gospels according to your Bible?

I was born and raised RC. I have had more then my fair share of the preachings about eternal damnation and a God who judges us to be feared. It's not for me. :sun: Thanks anyway.  :smile:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #5314406 - 02/18/06 07:36 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I enjoyed that reply Markos! :smile:

:peace: :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5314533 - 02/18/06 08:33 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

"That was easy to come to when you said the article was "feel good" and called it tripe at the same time. Feeling good must be tripe to you. What is the alternative to feeling good? Feeling bad, suffering. Simple conclusion."

You nailed it g. (no pun intended). Christians defined as those whose being is immersed in Christ have become 'Christs' themselves - Eastern Orthodox Christian 'theosis.' The perspective is mystic, it is gnostic, it is beyond doctrine, beyond the myths, and WAY beyond finger wagging and pain-fueled hatred of those who are Truly Free.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Offlineeve69
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #5316810 - 02/19/06 03:15 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

eve69,

Will you please at least read this paragraph so you can see why your saying The Christ plane (as referred to in the article) is a religion like Sri, so funny and non sensical.



Christ and Sri are the same energy. The love and compasssion which has no name but is the Shakti of life. Call it what you want. That won't change things.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: eve69]
    #5316943 - 02/19/06 04:02 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Are you responding to me, or to yourself?

BTW, you are free to call cats dogs, and dogs cats, but Shakti is not Karuna [Compassion], and if one wishes to communicate with people, it is important to recognize the same language and the same meanings for the words in that language. Capiche?


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: eve69]
    #5316992 - 02/19/06 04:18 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

This post wasn't about other names Christ energy goes by. Besides Sri to you, some call it Buddha, Cosmic, Compassion. So what? :shrug:

If you think having direct experiences with (_______) energy is Tripe, why bother stating that hear and then bolting?

What were you wanting to contribute to the post article or discussion? Did you just come in to dump on something  others were expressing appreciation and enjoyment of? Feel better now? :wink:

Do you just want everyone to know you think a direct experience with  Christ Consciousness is rubbish?

If so , now we all know. :smile: Eve69 thinks Christ Consciousness is the same as Sri consciousness (just so you all know) and it is non sensicle rubbish-tripe. Make note of that readers. :thumbup:

Thank you for sharing your enlightening opinion.:sun:



Nice reply again as ussual Markos. It feels good to be truly free indeed.  :thumbup:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: eve69]
    #5317074 - 02/19/06 04:49 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I forgot to add to the last post that eve compared the article to a RELIGION. The Sri was a man just like Jesus was that people built religions on.

The Christ plane and a direct experience with it has nothing to do with religion or any human other then the one having the direct experience with it.  :sun:

Just for anyone who was confused by the derailment.

It is an ancient religion and if I remember correctly Hinduism branched off from the Sri Religion. It is interesting to learn about. I surely am not as knowledgeable as markos on the history of world religions. Religion has nothing to do with the article is all.

:peace: :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5318267 - 02/19/06 11:33 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Great post, sad replies. Oh well, can't be troubled by some people's inability to read or post. Tsk Tsk...

One thing I like about people on the other side against unity, is that you can come back to them with love, and it's like they don't get it. It is like they miss out on a great joke, and you can revel in it so much!


--------------------
No ONE wants to know the ultimate TRUTH, as soon as YOU find IT out, YOU want to forget IT.

You are everything's way of feeling itself.

Happy Schwag, everygodly!


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Offlinefivepointer
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: mecreateme]
    #5318877 - 02/20/06 08:08 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

gettinjiggywithit wrote:
"I don't believe in original sin or any sin for that matter or that all men are spiritually depraved or a God that is a He that is separate from me. "

What saith the scriptures?

Ro 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Since you deny sin you can never repent (since you have nothing to repent of). I hope that the Spirit will convict you of your spiritual bankruptcy so that you will repent.

Mr 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Lu 13:5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Lu 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.



The law of God is summed up as:

Mr 12:30,1 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

If you do not keep the law PERFECTLY, then the law will accuse you and you will be found guilty of breaking it. Any breakage of the law will result in just judgement, and eternal damnation.

God can not set aside His law, every transgression, no matter how slight, must be punished, no exceptions. This is why in order to forgive a sinner the law can not be merely set aside. The law must be satisified. The law demands punishment. That punishment must be meeted out. Christ came to save His people, and take the punishment they so justly deserve. This is how God can remain just and justify at the same time.

Jesus Christ alone kept the law PERFECTLY, this is the only way a sinner can ever approach the Most High God, only through His righteousness.

Jesus loves His people, not while they were friends, but while they were enemies.

1Jo 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.
Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.


This is true unconditional love. To love those who have no reason to be loved at all. Just as He was hated without a cause, He loves His people without a cause.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5318882 - 02/20/06 08:14 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks for the vote of confidence, but the appellation 'sri' is a title of respect in India (Sri Ramana Maharishi, Sri Chinmoy, etc.) and beyond that I am not aware of the reference to yet another offshoot from Hinduism.

That which is here referred to as the "Christ Plane" has its correlates in other religions. For example, the idea of the 'Lesser Countenance' as the 6th 'sphere' (not plane) of Tiphereth [Beauty]/Rahamim [Compassion] in Jewish Kabbala, (as opposed to the 'Greater Countenance') is a 'Son and 'Father' parallel with Christian theology. Hinduism itself has a number of references, but I like 'The Heart Cave' [Hridayam] or Spiritual Heart, which again has its parallel in Catholic thought as 'The Sacred Heart.' Buddhism has many references to being in a place of non-violence [ahimsa], or the 'Skillful Means' to Wisdom [Prajna] being Compassion [Karuna].

"You may call God love, you may call God goodness. But the best name for God is compassion." - Meister Eckhart


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Offlineeve69
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #5318907 - 02/20/06 08:33 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I just reread you gettinjiggywitit. I stand alone apparently in not believing in Ascention, or End Times. The Earth was always a perfect aware being of Christ, and no Ascention was ever necessary. All there can be are refining means of perception for understanding this. In a universe of great darkness and inorganic matter in this one life had a mystical foundation, linked to the sun and water, the womb of Earthly life and thence of all philosophy and rhetoric.

One spirit of life exists, and not two, even in the deepest throws of space. I don't care about names. I am an advaitist, a nondualist, I do not see up and down, nor right or left, nor god and satan, nor an east or west, nor alot of things, not on the inside anyway. Outside, I'll perhaps play along. Iit's hard living in the West amongst dualists. They are not taught to understanding pure awareness only as the only thing in existance.

But if you look, then there you will be looking right back at you through whatever it is, and that you is awareness. Plain and simple. Awareness is kaivalya, Patanjali's ultimate residence in aloneness - all one ness.

If Christ was ever anywhere it was right here right now, or nothing. In fact, the less done about it, the less thought, the less spoken in heated discussion, the cooler things remain the closer ones metabolism to the true inner reflection. May all find therein the Three Buddha Bodies. Should these words prove false may I explode spontaneously momentarily.

Should they be true may all beings be liberated thereby.


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Offlineeve69
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Re: The Christ Plane [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5318910 - 02/20/06 08:38 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

gettinjiggy:
I forgot to add to the last post that eve compared the article to a RELIGION. The Sri was a man just like Jesus was that people built religions on.

The Christ plane and a direct experience with it has nothing to do with religion or any human other then the one having the direct experience with it.

Just for anyone who was confused by the derailment.

It is an ancient religion and if I remember correctly Hinduism branched off from the Sri Religion. It is interesting to learn about. I surely am not as knowledgeable as markos on the history of world religions. Religion has nothing to do with the article is all.




-----I'm not sure about this article not being some religion. If it is about experiencing something with cute jingoisms about erroneous and unprovable things like Ascensions and Christs and so on then it's at best some modernized association of mythologies and other New Agey stuff, and at worst it's simply a religion.


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...or something







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