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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: twighead]
    #23444506 -

twighead said:
I always thought that breach of an NDA (especially dealing with that subject matter) is considered a pretty serious legal matter, at the least as defined within the NDA grounds for the removal of ones security clearance. And while it doesn't say that any penalties are mandatory... it just does not sit right that someone in her position behaves in a way that would see most underlings heavily fined, fired, and at the least put on probation... and by underlings - that even applies to the director of the CIA who faced a removal of clearance, probation, and huge fine for a much more innocuous breach in recent history..



It is a serious matter, but that doesn't make it a crime.  They can't exactly fire Hillary...she doesn't work for the government.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23445362 -

Enlil said:
Snowden intentionally disbursed classified information.  Hillary didn't do anything even close to that.

I do appreciate your honesty about your clear bias, though.


Snowden was a whistle-blower... How is that comparable in any way? Last I recall you supported criminal charges against him too, so apparently you are the hypocrite by your own definition.


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"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
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Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #23445377 -

Not at all. Snowden intentionally disseminated classified information.  There is no evidence that Clinton did that.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23446399 -

Enlil said:
Not at all. Snowden intentionally disseminated classified information.  There is no evidence that Clinton did that.


Snowden exposed government overreach. He did Americans a service. We have a right to know about this government invasion of our privacy. Of course people hold him in higher regard than Hillary Clinton's potentially exposing classified information that could have put lives in danger for her own personal gain. It also looks like she was trying to hide something from the state department, and get around the freedom of information act.

Also, Snowden actually WAS essentially exiled for it. Clinton wasn't punished at all.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


Edited by Bigbadwooof (07/16/16 12:00 PM)

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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #23446427 -

You're making a "the ends justify the means" argument.  I reject that argument completely.  We can disagree on that, but that doesn't make me a hypocrite. 

The only relevant issue here is whether Clinton's conduct rose to the level of criminal culpability.  I think it clearly did not.  That has absolutely nothing to do with Ms. Clinton's position and everything to do with an objective look at the facts available to me.

You, on the other hand, want her to be charged.  I suspect that has very little to do with her actual conduct and a lot to do with the fact that you don't want her to be president.  I don't want her to be president either, but I'm not willing to see someone convicted unjustly to serve that end.  Again, the ends never justify the means.

To me, it is obvious that Ms. Clinton doesn't have the technical knowledge to set up a server nor to understand the difference between using a private server and a secure one.  I can't say that I know a single person over 60 who has such knowledge.  Honestly, maybe 2-3% of the people I know of any age would understand the difference.  Criminally punishing a senior citizen for an ignorant technology mistake that likely harmed no one is pretty much the antithesis of justice.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23447032 -

Yet employing people in the highest echelons of government who aren't exactly sure how to keep extremely sensitive data safe is the epitome of recklessness and stupidity. They at the least need to force them to take a few cursory data security classes. But I don't really buy that she was completely ignorant, when she was testifying to the house and they inquired whether she wiped her server, to which her reply was "What, like with a cloth?" That statement both stank of veiled knowledge and a bold lie.

Though I don't think the email server is the most important crime/breach to pursue, I think there are a lot of signs pointing towards the Clinton foundation being an international money laundering juggernaut.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: twighead]
    #23447213 -

twighead said:
Yet employing people in the highest echelons of government who aren't exactly sure how to keep extremely sensitive data safe is the epitome of recklessness and stupidity.


Certainly, that isn't her fault.  She isn't someone who has been working in the intelligence community for 40 years.  Her most recent job was appointed, and she was already over 60 when she got that job.  It's like giving your grandpa a computer and then wondering why he's got tons of viruses after a month of using it.

As far as the Clinton foundation, that's got nothing to do with this particular investigation.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23447856 -

Enlil said:
Not at all. Snowden intentionally disseminated classified information.  There is no evidence that Clinton did that.


Enlil, I've learned a lot from you.  And I think if you will look at the actual Federal law, You don't have intention to be persecuted for mishandling classified information.  Negligence is enough to satifsy an element to have completed a crime in the case of classified information.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23447898 -

Not simple negligence, however. Criminal negligence is a different standard, and it requires a willful disregard of a known risk.  That's the problem here.  There's no evidence she knew the risks involved.

She's an old lady. Her understanding of computers and servers is probably very little.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23447914 -

Enlil said:
She's an old lady. Her understanding of computers and servers is probably very little.


If she's that fucking stupid I don't want the bitch anywhere near the button for a couple thousand thermonuclear warheads.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: starfire_xes]
    #23447931 -

Me either, but it looks like it's inevitable.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23447952 -

Enlil said:
Me either, but it looks like it's inevitable.


Well, they are letting me play with Uranium 235 and around nuclear reactors, so I guess anything is possible. :lolsy:

hell, I couldn't believe I even passed an FBI background check.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23448975 -

She explicitly asks that a document that was marked classified be un-marked as such and sent anyway.

So she new this was wrong... this is not the simple, innocent negligence of an "old lady" but shows willful negligence; she signed a Sensitive Compartmented Information Nondisclosure Agreement specifically against “negligent handling”.  In 2011 she even received a memo written just for her warning of repeated hacking attempts, but continued with her acts of willful negligence.

In line with this comes the repeated lying to cover her tracks:

Quote:
 

As we've detailed, Mrs. Clinton has altered her email assertions over time:  At first, she claimed that "no classified material" passed through the vulnerable private server, which is comprehensively false.  Between 600 and 700 classified emails have been identified thus far -- including newly-released messages pertaining to the sensitive matter of embassy security measures, a topic Clinton recently testified she didn't directly deal with as Secretary of State.  Next, she said that nothing that was classified "at the time" was on the server, which has also been disproven. Then she shifted to arguing that she had never personally sent or received classified data.  Wrong again.  Finally, she settled on the defense that she hadn't trafficked in items that were marked classified at the time.  This distinction is legally irrelevant, experts say, because it was her duty as a government official with a top security clearance to assess and recognize classified information, regardless of official markings.  The agreement Sec. Clinton signed in 2009 conclusively proves that she explicitly acknowledged that the "marked vs. unmarked" excuse to which she's currently clinging holds no weight(...)


http://m.townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2015/11/09/memo-hillary-warned-of-repeated-hack-attempts-against-us-officials-private-emails-in-2011-n2077696


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1)Combo of oral DMT + smoked Bufotenine
2)Amanita (urine drank twice)
3)Mushrooms > Achuma 16"+cid(still need higher dose Achuma)> Cid (still need high dose)
4)Morning Glory-HBWR (+cumin, cinnamon aldehyde adducts) > Methyl chavicol (need more activators)
5)Salvia (need to try quid)


All readable matter in the above post is ficticious... any similarities to real life are purely coincidental.

Blessing.

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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: flickedbic]
    #23449117 -

Do you have a source confirming that she admitted to telling someone to unmark a classified document?


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23449767 -

seems to me that if she has the server hidden in her bathroom she knows she is up to something

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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: xzylocybin]
    #23449836 -

It seems to me that if the server is in her bathroom, it's not hidden.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23450148 -

lolers can argue circles around laypeople no matter what the topic/facts, it's your job, but having a private server in your bathroom still screams sketchiness.

I saw a podcast with an ex CIA/pentagon guy who said that if he had done the exact same things as Hillary he would be in prison super fast, and he had the same security clearance as her.

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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23450270 -

Enlil said:
Not simple negligence, however. Criminal negligence is a different standard, and it requires a willful disregard of a known risk.  That's the problem here.  There's no evidence she knew the risks involved.

She's an old lady. Her understanding of computers and servers is probably very little.


Oh but this is not the first time this issue has been addressed with Hillary.

How can she not have known about security risks when she had been warned in 2009 for accessing work emails on her unsecured blackberry! This specific issue had been addressed, without any investigation, at a previous date and she blatantly ignored it. What's your next argument? 'She is so old she didn't understand the warning'?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3302665/Hillary-s-security-staff-warned-BlackBerry-vulnerable-hackers-Washington-office.html

She knows how to send and receive emails. She had been told how she could and could not access work related emails due to the security risk. She was aware that her personal server was not allowed, and she knew that it was not allowed because it posed a risk. She willfully disregarded the protocols that she knew were designed to mitigate risk.

Who gives a fuck if she has technical knowledge of computers and servers? She knows enough about computers to use them everyday in her work.

If I'm not familiar with the mechanics of a gun, I pick one up, and shoot you by accident, would you assume that I didn't know the risks involved because my understanding of guns is "very little"?


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: xzylocybin]
    #23450279 -

I'm sure.  That's because he knows the risks associated with using a private server.  I seriously doubt Clinton did before all of this hoopla.


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Enlil]
    #23450289 -

she had to have known, she has been a part of politics and the government for like 20 years, there is no way she didn't know

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