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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23230758 -

You guys want a real smart animal?

ants


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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #23230771 -

pigs are damn smart, I try not to eat pork. I never buy any, but sometimes if someone else prepares some I'll eat it and feel slightly guilty about it.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #23230774 -

moonrockmushy said:
You guys want a real smart animal?

ants




Yeah each ant is almost like a neuron in an ant brain whose cortex is the queen.

Douglas Hofstadter has a lot of interesting discussion about the relationship between human language and information transmission in ants in Godel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23230807 -

morrowwasted; something to think about. One ethically raised cow could feed like 1000 people. One cow is 2,400lbs. I just googled it. with some math yields that you could feed 900 people for one day (this assume 3000 calories eaten by a human a day. Very generous). assuming that its about 1,400 cals per pound. and this assumes super lean beef. Most of the cow is fattier so you could probably feed a person with more than that

I am getting sidetracked here, but the point is, one grass fed ethically raised cow is one life. ONE life is 900 peoples day of eating. I am not saying lets go on a cow killing rampage but its the circle of life. I feel really good on a vegatarian diet so I eat this way. but pigs and cows are fat animals. And raised ethically and killed quickly/environmentally usstainably, its not a huge ethical issue in my book. just my 2 cents

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23230828 -

Yeah I am not a vegetarian. I think eating meat is perfectly natural and ideal for the maintenance of human health. I don't think eating pork is necessary. Your hypothetical scenario involves ethically-raised cattle, which is rare. I only buy grass fed/freerange/antibioticfree beef (9.25/lb) and wild salmon ($4/6oz) and tuna. Sometimes I'll eat other things if other people prepare them, but I don't buy other stuff.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23230875 -

morrowasted said:
Yeah I am not a vegetarian. I think eating meat is perfectly natural and ideal for the maintenance of human health. I don't think eating pork is necessary. Your hypothetical scenario involves ethically-raised cattle, which is rare. I only buy grass fed/freerange/antibioticfree beef (9.25/lb) and wild salmon ($4/6oz) and tuna. Sometimes I'll eat other things if other people prepare them, but I don't buy other stuff.


Well I mean this is just my side of the debate. Like I said, I both agree/disagree. I think some people (me) work better on vegan/vegatarian diets. I think others need more meat. Theres a fair bit of science supporting that people whose ancestors ate less meat need less meat and produce omega3's from omega 6's and digest starches farrrr better. I am not saying one should or shouldn't have meat. I am just a firm believer in that each person's genetics are different based on their ancestry. thats a topic for a another time

Even if one were to sustain themselves soley on beef and broccolli/spinach daily, that would be about $20 a day. $140 a week Which the lower end of what people spend is about $150 a week on groceries. And that assumes they eat only beef. Idk I just don't believe that healthy food is unaffordable.That also assumes grass fed beef which not everyone eats. chicken is cheaper and even the sustainable varieties of chicken are much less than that. That doesn't even begin to include the fact that eggs, butter etc. are cheaper sources of animal calories and most people throw in cheap rice, potatoes etc. in their diet which are even cheaper on a dollar to calories basis

Also; supply and demand. if grass fed beef were "normal" is would be cheaper. The main reason demand for grass fed is cheaper is because grain fed beef is subdized HEAVILY by the govt. thats a huge history/politics lesson for another time but the govt pays farmers to grow corn. Even though a lot of it isn't used. This allowed grain fed to be cheaper. If these subsidies ended, grain fed beef would be near impossible to be done affordably and then grass fed would be the norm.

tl:dr; the idea that grain fed beef is cheaper than grass fed beef is a myth. It appears this way due to subsidies. In actuality, grass fed is VERY doable and scalable. Its also affordable in its current state. It is even more affordable than

i think shroomism sent me some links via PM at some point so he could chime in. He is more well read here. And

I don't want to thread jack you, but my opinion/knowledge.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23230884 -

shit I only spend like 75 bucks a week on groceries, tops. sometimes less. just meats, veggies, and fruits. a bit of peanut butter. all that shit is cheap

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23230924 -

I know lol. I cook most of my meals right now at uni and I spend like 100$ on veggies and fruit and tons of tubers etc. . A really clean and well rounded pescatarian diet. I was just trying to debunk this whole myth. sorry for the rant. the whole "grain fed beef is cheap and only rich douches can afford grass fed" gets to me

/rant

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23230939 -

hey sorry to thread jack again but this was the book you mentioned?
http://www.amazon.com/G%C3%B6del-Escher-Bach-Eternal-Golden/dp/0465026567

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23230957 -

Yeah it's like, the most insanely amazing composition of art, literature, philosophy, and science ever created, in my humble opinion. It should've gotten the Pulitzer twice, it's that good. Some of the theoretical stuff about computing is obviously dated since it was written in the 1970s, but its core message is ageless.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23231109 -

fuck that sounds interesting. Thanks

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23231123 -

After you read that, if you want to fall deeper down the rabbit hole, check out Incomplete Nature


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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23231147 -

morrowasted said:
After you read that, if you want to fall deeper down the rabbit hole, check out Incomplete Nature




hahah holy lord fuck just the cover looks intense. I read the summary on amazon and it looks like an acid trip. I will be sure to peak into it later

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: Asante]
    #23231152 -

Asante said:
The TRUTH about elephant painting: animal cruelty


http://www.onegreenplanet.org/animalsandnature/why-making-an-elephant-paint-is-cruel-not-cute/


man humans suck so bad. i don't understand how people can live with themselves inflicting suffering on a helpless creature.


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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: ReposadoXochipilli]
    #23231165 -


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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23231188 -

Ill watch that in the evening mate. I have spent all day reading about this type of shit and I have to do data Science homework. If I get to it this evening, I will watch it. It is in my "watch later" list on youtube

apologies :lol:

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23231313 -

thanks for the good lecture morrowwasted


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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: morrowasted]
    #23231917 -

morrowasted said:
Yeah it's like, the most insanely amazing composition of art, literature, philosophy, and science ever created, in my humble opinion. It should've gotten the Pulitzer twice, it's that good. Some of the theoretical stuff about computing is obviously dated since it was written in the 1970s, but its core message is ageless.


WOAH this book is amazing. Just burned through the first few chapters. Good lord.

The recommendation is much appreciated.


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۞̷̛̗̗͉͇̰̅͒ͯͩ̆ͯ̑͘ ̶̖̭ͧ͛ͬ͑ͣͦ̍ͧ͐͟͢ www.cactophage.com ۞̷̛̗̗͉͇̰̅͒ͯͩ̆ͯ̑͘ ̶̖̭ͧ͛ͬ͑ͣͦ̍ͧ͐͟͢
̸ۨ͜۞̷̛̗̗͉͇̰̅͒ͯͩ̆ͯ̑͘ ̶̖̭ͧ͛ͬ͑ͣͦ̍ͧ͐͟Dolphins of Dank۞̷̛̗̗͉͇̰̅͒ͯͩ̆

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: topdog82]
    #23231980 -

Quote:
Even if one were to sustain themselves soley on beef and broccolli/spinach daily, that would be about $20 a day. $140 a week Which the lower end of what people spend is about $150 a week on groceries


Who the fuck spends $600 a month on groceries? :lol:

$200 is what I spend while bulking, I eat healthy and cook most meals.
People are robbing themselves.

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Re: Elephant paints a self-portrait and writes its name with its trunk [Re: Repertoire89]
    #23232008 -

not every man weigh's 120 lb's and curl's pencils for a living.  3 meals x $6 = $18  and thats on the cheap side of things and doesn't even include drinks and other such things


--------------------
We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.

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