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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: morrowasted]
    #22909690 -

yeah I can understand that. I felt the same

I've worked heavy manual labour most of my life and believed breakfast to be not only wanted, but essential

There is a huge psychological aspect to it.

There is tons of benefits to NOT eating breakfast, in fact


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Masked]
    #22911646 -

Intermittent fasting takes a day or two to get used to. But it def works. The issue for me is that I already have a low bodyfat and wieght. I need to gain weight before thinking about fasting and cutting

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: topdog82]
    #22911994 -

Intermittent fasting isn't about "cutting"

You don't change how much you eat, what you eat, etc

...you only change when you eat

I put on 5lbs of lean muscle in 2 months of intermittent fasting and eating 3000 calories during my eating window.

But that's a whole different topic that is not relevant to moonshoes goals.  I Don't mean to sway the discussion away :smile:


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: morrowasted]
    #22912309 -

It would be tough at first, but eventually morning fasting will slow one's metabolism which would cancel out or even lessen any morning weakness before eating; Sumo fast and workout during the day (before gorging themselves in the evening) to slow metabolism and build weight.


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: DustBunny]
    #22912348 -

I have not done well so far with changing my diet.

But what I have done succesfully is this:

1. Start taking two apple cider vinegar pills three times a day

2. Start taking 2000-3000 IU of vitamin D once a day

3. Take a ten billion living cell probiotic pill once a day

4. Drink a fresh fruit and vegetable smoothie with kale or spinach daily

5. Take a turmeric and curcumin pill once daily

Going to buy hemp protein and start adding that to my smoothies.


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: DustBunny]
    #22912384 -

Morning fasting does not slow metabolism. That is a false assumption and not founded on good science

It all has to do with the thermic effect of food(Tef)

Likewise,  eating every two hours does not boost your metabolism

http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html?m=1


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Masked]
    #22912406 -

Yes, it does slow metabolism, and there is very clear evidence/"good science" (:confused:) to support it.


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: DustBunny]
    #22912624 -

False


"
1. Myth: Eat frequently to "stoke the metabolic fire".


Truth

Each time you eat, metabolic rate increases slightly for a few hours. Paradoxically, it takes energy to break down and absorb energy. This is the Thermic Effect of Food (TEF). The amount of energy expended is directly proportional to the amount of calories and nutrients consumed in the meal.

Let's assume that we are measuring TEF during 24 hours in a diet of 2700 kcal with 40% protein, 40% carbohydrate and 20% fat. We run three different trials where the only thing we change is the the meal frequency.

A) Three meals: 900 kcal per meal.

B) Six meals: 450 kcal per meal.

C) Nine meals: 300 kcal per meal.

What we'd find is a different pattern in regards to TEF. Example "A" would yield a larger and long lasting boost in metabolic rate that would gradually taper off until the next meal came around; TEF would show a "peak and valley"-pattern. "C" would yield a very weak but consistent boost in metabolic rate; an even pattern. "B" would be somewhere in between.

However, at the end of the 24-hour period, or as long as it would take to assimilate the nutrients, there would be no difference in TEF. The total amount of energy expended by TEF would be identical in each scenario. Meal frequency does not affect total TEF. You cannot "trick" the body in to burning more or less calories by manipulating meal frequency.

Further reading: I have covered the topic of meal frequency at great length on this site before.

The most extensive review( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9155494/ ) of studies on various meal frequencies and TEF was published in 1997. It looked at many different studies that compared TEF during meal frequencies ranging from 1-17 meals and concluded:

"Studies using whole-body calorimetry and doubly-labelled water to assess total 24 h energy expenditure find no difference between nibbling and gorging".

Since then, no studies have refuted this. For a summary of the above cited study, read this research review by Lyle McDonald.

Earlier this year, a new study ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/19943985/ ) was published on the topic. As expected, no differences were found between a lower (3 meals) and higher meal (6 meals) frequency. Read this post for my summary of the study. This study garnered some attention in the mass media and it was nice to see the meal frequency myth being debunked in The New York"

http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html?m=1


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Edited by Masked (02/16/16 07:02 PM)

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22913291 -

Moonshoe said:
I have not done well so far with changing my diet.

But what I have done succesfully is this:

1. Start taking two apple cider vinegar pills three times a day

2. Start taking 2000-3000 IU of vitamin D once a day

3. Take a ten billion living cell probiotic pill once a day

4. Drink a fresh fruit and vegetable smoothie with kale or spinach daily

5. Take a turmeric and curcumin pill once daily

Going to buy hemp protein and start adding that to my smoothies.


you are doing pretty solid with that. A tip that has helped with my journey is trying to do "force multipliers". That is a term coined by tim ferriss. If doing this particular thing would make doing other shit easier, then it is worth your time to do it. For example, would meditating daily make other stuff easier? Yep definately. It makes my mind sharper and your brain to more able to pickup new habits

In times of my life where I feel frustrated, I go back to "Force multipliers". So I wakeup and first thing have some coffee, yoga and meditate. The likelihood that I will do other productive shit in the day is much higher if and when this happens

So I would say try and have some probiotic, apple cider vinegar, maybe some coffee, in the morn. From there, you can't help but do something else productive. probiotics and ACV (which is a strong probiotic) all helps you crave less junk, and garbage. Also, sleep more /I find makes me crave better food

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Masked]
    #22913307 -

Masked said:
Intermittent fasting isn't about "cutting"

You don't change how much you eat, what you eat, etc

...you only change when you eat

I put on 5lbs of lean muscle in 2 months of intermittent fasting and eating 3000 calories during my eating window.

But that's a whole different topic that is not relevant to moonshoes goals.  I Don't mean to sway the discussion away :smile:


I know it works, and I know it burns fat like a torch lighter from experience

But I am saying that I am an inherently skinny guy and I regquire a lot of food. I also find I digest vegan food best. So I am not vegan, but I eat largely vegan diet. Trying eatin 3000cals of rice, potatoes, and bananas. That is the bulk of my diet. And as such, I can't do that in 2 meals or 8 hours

The few times I have done it, it works. But I need to eat quite a bit. It doesn't work for me. Just my experience

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: topdog82]
    #22913373 -

Fair enough.  Some people struggle with eating 3000 good calories

I have 2 big meals plus snacks and find it easy.  But I love to feast, always have


I'm now switching it up and doing a slight calorie deficit while IF'ing

It is much much harder for me.  Feel hungry.  And while I will lose some muscle mass, being under 10% body fat for the summer would be nice.  And a first for me! :smile:


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Masked]
    #22913566 -

Masked said:
Fair enough.  Some people struggle with eating 3000 good calories

I have 2 big meals plus snacks and find it easy.  But I love to feast, always have


I'm now switching it up and doing a slight calorie deficit while IF'ing

It is much much harder for me.  Feel hungry.  And while I will lose some muscle mass, being under 10% body fat for the summer would be nice.  And a first for me! :smile:


the few times I have done it, it is probably the best way I have discovered to put on muscle

I couldn't sustain it for the reasons explained above. But IF is almost like a hack or magic. I am surprised more people don't know about it. but if you bulk in an 8 hour eating window, I would argue that you don't even need to cut

When I move into my own place, I am going to try bulking on like 3-4k cals and break my fast right after my morning weight training. I think you could easily put on 15 lbs of lean muscle and no fat in one year.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22913731 -

Decided to finally make an account and be active on the boards here and the title of this thread caught my eye. I've recently just started doing the same thing, mainly focusing on dairy, but overall following an anti-inflammatory diet due to all of the reasons you stated. Its not easy staying away from things that are found in almost every product on the shelves minus the whole foods, and its also very hard to eliminate foods you love so I'm right there with ya. I look at it this way - I've been eating this way for over 20 years and I'm now realizing it may not have been the best diet, but that doesn't mean its going to or needs to change over night. Being more mindful and limiting exposure to dairy and highly processed grains is a step in the right direction, but don't drive yourself nuts over it. Stress is also a leading killer so don't sweat it if it takes some time to adjust. More power to ya!

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: topdog82]
    #22913908 -

Good call and I agree man :cheers:

There is such a thing you speak of.  Lean gains.  Build muscle while burning fat at a near 1:1 ratio.  It's all about watching you macros

Check out leangains.com.  Invaluable information that has personally done me wonders


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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: topdog82]
    #22918804 -

I like the idea of nutritional force multipliers
I think I am starting to feel benefits already
The daily veggie smoothie has probably tripled my veggie intake

The apple cider vinegar is hopefully helping to alkalize my system
And the probiotics are transforming my gut fauna for the better
And the vitamin d is a huge nutritional deficit where I live
And the turmeric is my main defence against cancer Alzheimer's and arthritis
I am also taking melatonin a few nights a week at bedtime for a mega antioxidant boost and to protect against harmful radiation
I have probably cut down slightly on dairy but not much
And no real success cutting down on carbs / sugar yet
Next step is to buy hemp protein to add to my smoothies

Just took ACV, about to drink some matcha green tea with turmeric stirred in

Be well friends!


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22918828 -

From the pictures of you that I've seen you have a very low percent body fat. Unless you intend to go on a completely ketogenic diet and start coating all of your food in copious amounts of lard, you probably need a lot of carbs or else you are going to feel a mental fog and physical lethargy.


To stay healthy you NEED carbs, fats, and proteins (unless you intend to put your body into ketosis then only fats and proteins). A good ratio for a 2000 calorie diet is 40% carbs, 30% fats, 30% proteins. You should just try to avoid certain kinds of carbs as much as possible. Whole grains are great sources of carbohydrates, and some vegetables have them as well. If you suffer from chronic inflammation, white flour, dairy, and sucrose should be avoided. If you don't, there is really not a pressing reason to avoid them.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: morrowasted]
    #22918979 -

You make a lot of sense man, but some of these guys are hell bent on following a very specific diet regardless of current state.


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No one behind, no one ahead.
The path the ancients cleared has closed.
And the other path, everyone's path,
easy and wide, goes nowhere.
I am alone and find my way.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: morrowasted]
    #22919204 -

Thanks man,
Yeah because I struggle so much to gain weight and tend to lose weight so easily
I find i can't cut anything out of my diet or
Else I just get even skinnier .

In just trying to stick to sprouted, whole grain,
Fermented, multigrain etc - healthier carbs,
And minimizing sugar.

To counteract the inflammatory effects of the carbs I do eat, I take
Turmeric . 

I would be interested in going fully Ketogenic someday but for now my main goals are to increase my veggie intake, decrease my sugar intake and increase
My healthy fat and protein intake


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: Moonshoe]
    #22919567 -

Hey moon I am not sure if this helps, but I have been going to a family acpuncurist. It sounded like bullshit to me, but despite my healthy diet and lifestyle for the past 2-3 years, I still had occassional tinnitus, sleep issues, and digestive issues

I ate pretty much all junk food my whole life and despite healthy habits recently, there were a handful of "imbalances" in my body. things that standard western medicine doesn't understand. I already know I will get flamed, but both chinese and auyurvedic medicine understand the body in way that most western science wont even fathom

I never believed it, but after 2 sessions my lifelong tinnitus was decreased. I plan on regualrly going in for check ins once every 6 months. If you can afford it, I would say its helpful. She made suggestions on changes I need to make in my diet. Some people digest meat less easily, others have issues with dairy, I supposedly have issues with raw foods. cutting down on raw foods helped me in a wierd way

Point is, modern science is not really personalized. And although some may disagree, I believe that chinese medicine is very personal and can give you an edge on your health that reading all the books in the world on diet wont give you. each author has suggestions on what worked for thier patients. Notice how there is never "one diet" to follow in chinese medicine. Because they understand that its largely personal

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Re: Radical Diet Change [Re: topdog82]
    #22919584 -

I am absolutely a believer in acupuncture.

There is also scientific validation that it works.

I get covered or acupuncture and I have a shoulder injury so I should for sure make an apointment.

Thanks for the recommendation !


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