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Help with friend zone plus drama queen
    #20710567 -

I took a 7 year break from dating. I was fat, lazy, no money, not confident, etc. I wanted to get my life back together.

Once I felt it was time, I asked this woman at work out. Let's call her Cindy.  We went out twice and I was still lacking confidence and didn't kiss her when I had my chance.  We ended up being friends.  Two years later, we are close friends. We talk all day.  Now this isn't a post about getting her back. No thank u.  This is about mental well-being.

I dated another woman last year, but then I got dumped. This was my first sober relationship/breakup in almost a decade. Cindy was there for me and talked me through it.  We confide in each other.  I have viewed her as a strong person. She lost 60 lbs in a year, got accepted in lawschool but couldn't afford to go, lives out on her own, etc.

For the last 5 months, Cindy has been dating a guy we'll call AH.  He's a real asshole. He got mad at her one night and made her drive an hour home in the dark at 1 am when she was drunk.  He tells her he doesn't care about her, she makes him miserable, nags, etc.  but he won't dump her. This has been going on for the whole relationship of only 5 months! Lol she won't dump him Bc she says he is the one she wants.  We all know she is just insecure.  She has a bunch of other guys wanting to date her. One seems like a great guy. 

Anyways, I've noticed lately that I whine to her a lot. For example: I'm not eating right, I can't get a date, I have a hard time saving money, I wanna workout but don't when the time comes.

What I realized the other day was that my life is good.  I have a great job, custody of my kid, I'm in pretty good shape, gonna try building a house next year, etc. I feel like I can see the vision of who I am striving to be, but can't seem to do the effort to get it.  Like the universe is saying, "here it is if u want it."  And I'm just not doing it.  Recently, I've discovered Theodore Roosevelt and the strenuous life.  It speaks to me. I'm trying to change. Or think I'm trying,

Now, AH today is taunting Cindy to break up with him. She won't do it.  He won't either. It's like wtf?!  It took me two years, but it just hit me a few minutes ago that she is a drama queen. With me being her best friend, I'm allowing myself to get sucked into that in my own life!

I've mentioned to her in the past month that there is a lot of negativity going on. Why can't we both just be happy with life and work together as friends to progress in life... This would be the ideal friendship.  Just now realizing...she is very dramatic. I AM positive. I just can't tell anymore from the constant bombardment of drama from her. 

I don't want to date her. I'm not trying to fuck her.  How I gracefully bow out of the drama but keep my friend...? How do I get my manhood back? Feel like a man again instead of a bitch?  Before her, I lost 50 lbs, finished college, custody of my kid, good job, etc. Now I find myself whining to my parents that I don't understand life and why I can't make myself do what I want to do formyself and kid.

Please help me out here. Anyone have similar stories? I'm sure I'm not alone.


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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20710675 -

Idk man, it's not that complicated. Be a man and tell her he's no good for her, and that she could do much better. After that walk away, because any shit she gets from her boyfriend is her fault for not getting the eff out.

And let's be real dude, you still like her. This isn't about her breaking up with him so you can be friends, it's about her breaking up with him so that you have another chance. If it wasn't you wouldn't have mentioned anything about a friend zone, she'd just be a friend.

And if you want to get out the friend zone you walk away, be straight up and tell her she's stupid for staying, and that you can't deal with her drama anymore. That'll turn her on more than anything haha

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: jimboob]
    #20710717 -

Yeah, I find myself thinking at times about her in that way . I'll admit that. Sometimes she says things too.  We live an hour apart now. I care about her.  But I'm ready to get on with my life.  I'm just having an issue convincing myself to drop her completely. 

I don't feel I want a dating relationship with her but it certainly crossed my mind.  I like what u said about  the shit she gets being her fault.  What do I do though when she is messaging me on the computer all day?  Just ignore it?  Say something stern?  It's like we are talking about this guy I don't know for months now. I'm tired of hearing about it.  It's the same conversation over and over again


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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20712018 -

Seekingtruth said:
Yeah, I find myself thinking at times about her in that way . I'll admit that. Sometimes she says things too.  We live an hour apart now. I care about her.  But I'm ready to get on with my life.  I'm just having an issue convincing myself to drop her completely. 

I don't feel I want a dating relationship with her but it certainly crossed my mind.  I like what u said about  the shit she gets being her fault.  What do I do though when she is messaging me on the computer all day?  Just ignore it?  Say something stern?  It's like we are talking about this guy I don't know for months now. I'm tired of hearing about it.  It's the same conversation over and over again



That's hardcore friendzone shit man.

If you want out, be stern and tell her that your tired of this talk, and the only solution to her problems would be to break up with him. Then tell her how you really feel, that you like her and want to be with her and can't stand talking about this asshole anymore, and that you can't stand being so close yet so far from her. THEN cut her off, ignore her, and start working on yourself immediately. Find a good job, START WORKING OUT, get a hobby, A NEW girl.

Then maybe, JUST MAYBE will you bump into her again one day with your chiseled abs, fat stacks of cash and newfound confidence and she'll be chasing after YOU!!

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: jimboob]
    #20713018 -

Find something to do which makes you not bitchy and whiny. Something to do regularly to strengthen your morals, make you more adapt socially and more pleasant to be around. It's gotta be some kind of practice which is associated with feelings. Something that will recharge your inner battery and let you do you no matter how sucky another person's life is. Something to make you an anchor - instead of  getting sucked into other people's shitholes.
What that thing is - is going to be up to you...

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Deckard_Cain] * 1
    #20714313 -

I appreciate all the input.  I really am trying to focus on the drama aspect of this rather than the friend zone stuff.  The idea that her dramatic-ness, is rubbing off on my and negatively affected my life and outlook.

DC - I immediately thought of meditating. I've been doing this and writing lately.  This is probably why I got the strength up to finally say enough!  I will continue to do so. 

I ignored four texts from her last night and she apologized with the fifth. I ignored that too and she sent me a pic of her in a bikini... Lol not sure what to make of that but I liked it


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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20714445 -

OP, I think you need to take a hard and LONG look at your life, and what's happening on your planet, and realize that for the sake of your kid, you'd best grow up and start being a man soon. Or you will teach your kid to be a lifelong insecure child, just like you happen to be now, because you can't teach anything other than what you yourself know and practice on a daily basis.

THe fact that you got "custody of" your kid means absolutely nothing, other than that you'll get to teach him your way of life. Which IMO at this particular time, isn't that worth teaching.

I'm not telling you these things to be insulting or demeaning, I am simply bringing to your attention some facts that should have had your attention long before you had a kid.

Right now you are wanting. Wanting other women's attention and failing pretty hard at knowing how to get it. This is your fundamental role in life, FAR more important than how to make enough money to buy a TV or some candy on Christmas, is how to read your fellow human, how to provide confidence and trust to a female, how to be the man in a situation, that everybody goes to be reassured by, not that needs constant reassuring and approval and an ear to hear your whining.

If you think that bitching and whining TO A WOMAN is a minor matter, you're missing A LOT of the big picture of life. Whining to a woman shows that you don't know the dynamics involved, you're unconsciously treating this female friend as mommy, that you can cluelessly go to and whine, and (if all goes right) she'll say "there there" and say something nice. VERY dangerous waters to swim in, as an adult single male, especially with a kid.

It also shows that you have no great plan or dream that your energies were going into that day, no great awesome progress to report on that plan, you are generally being a clueless drain on others' energy, instead of a booster and reinforcer and empowerer, an example of how awesome life can be when it's lived well.

Now, some energy management: Your friend's love life is not really your business. Put some boundaries WHEREVER YOU WANT THEM and make them clear, and she'll respect them. If you can't be fucked to hear any more of her troubles, then say so and say it clearly. "My dearest, I value you greatly as a friend and wish you the best with this guy here. I am from this day forth pushing myself to be the best and most positive person I can be, so I can set a great example for my kid, and so I won't be able to listen to your constant bitching and whining about this relationship. Call me when there are great vibes to report and if it takes a few weeks and months, so be it. If it takes more than that, then in your place I'd start considering why I'm spending my life with a man who makes me miserable and gives me no great joys to share with friends."

Or whatever it is. YOU choose these boundaries where YOU are comfy with them. It's ON YOU to tell her what's what, and there's only one way to do so. Friendly, understandingly, but decisively. Draw a CLEAR line to show your boundaries, that no, your energy will NOT be dissipated in this useless way, listening to chatter. And may all the gods in the sky be merciful on a kid that has a dad with weak and unclear boundaries.

About the friend btw, it's clear she found a man that has something. Backbone. Not much brains, but certainly balls and backbone. Which she can't resist, as expected. What you may not have seen is the QUALITY of men that like her, what balls, what backbone and energy they bring to the table. Ask her to talk about her man, and ask her to talk about these others. See what her voice says, not her words.

Quote:
Anyways, I've noticed lately that I whine to her a lot. For example: I'm not eating right, I can't get a date, I have a hard time saving money, I wanna workout but don't when the time comes.




Quote:
I feel like I can see the vision of who I am striving to be, but can't seem to do the effort to get it.  Like the universe is saying, "here it is if u want it."  And I'm just not doing it.



Know that this, and PRECISELY this, is the lifestyle and approach to life that you are right now teaching to your kid. How to fail. How to postpone. How to think of things and never do them. How to be insecure, and though you have an INCREDIBLE amount of data at your fingertips, how to fail to Google. ALL of the things you mentioned are easy to do, well within reach to a determined and focused individual. None of them are doable to someone that dissipates in a million directions, spilling their energy on minutia.

As long as these are the things you practice, I wouldn't really worry much about the friend and her preference for dating a brute. It's her life. She chose him and she has her reasons, conscious or not. If she were offering great support and you had energy to help her out on this one, I'd take time and help her. But put your own oxygen mask on first. You have a kid to worry about, and right now you're teaching skills like "how to be scattered" or "how to start things and not finish" or "how to waste energy by hesitating and postponing and endlessly switching between tasks".

I'd like you to understand the fact that ONLY kids look to others for approval. Adult men look inside their own hearts and do what they feel is right from within. No looking to others for approval, no endless hesitation, constant asking of opinions and so on. I mean all is good within reason, but when it becomes an MO, HABITUALLY asking others and waiting on others' opinions and ideas, that's when you know you're a child. Can't make decisions, lets others make them because there's the intrinsic belief there that they would know better. They don't. It's YOUR life. You're the most awesome expert there is. The only issue is whether or not you've discovered and feel that fact, or have yet to start doing so.

VERY dangerous things and views of the world to teach your kid, to be unsure, to wait on others, to keep taking orders and ideas from outside, from above. If I wanted to train insecure slaves and servants, that's PRECISELY how I'd do it.

I know I may sound harsh with some of this, and I am formulating things harshly because I was in that place myself for most of my life. I bitched and I whined, I blamed others and pointed fingers, I aimlessly looked around (outside) for answers which can only be found within after PLENTY of looking.

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Recently, I've discovered Theodore Roosevelt and the strenuous life.  It speaks to me.



I've never read the book and am VERY suspicious of the word "strenuous" in the title.

Does it empower you? By empower I mean literally, give you energy IN YOUR LIMBS and breath IN YOUR LUNGS to get up, do things, go woo hoo with energy on your goals and dreams, OR does it give you stuff to sit down and "think about" some more? Food for thought. If your lungs and limbs ain't movin' from it, I'd keep looking for that book called The Fun Life. The Awesome Life. Or my favorite, How To Be a Rolling Thriving Festival of Awesome :lol:

Quote:
I'm trying to change. Or think I'm trying,



Why? Why the vagueness? Why the lack of trust in yourself? What's holding you back, or what do you THINK is holding you back?

More importantly than probably all of the above, what exactly would you like to do, from here on? What's the clearest picture that you can paint in words, about your future? Speak about your relationships with women, with your kid, as well as awesome external achievements you'd like to go for, from this day on.


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Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Spacerific]
    #20714973 -

This is really speaking to me. The strenuous life is just food for thought. I'll file it as such.  I was thinking lately that it was another gimmick.  I've ran through my share of those.

Ok, I need to have my own place for me and my kid.  For a woman, I need her to be good with kids, attractive to me(not looking for a supermodel). Someone I can really fall in love with and spend time with. I don't want some fake woman or money lover. Hopefully she will like being outside.  My kid: I want her to be successful. She is joining the basketball team this year. She is great at art. I can definitely be a better role model for her.  She already makes all A's and is a great kid. I need to work on being a better role model for sure.

For me, I need to get in better physical condition. I'm real off and on with my workouts.  I'd like to join some organization or club that's outside a lot.  I have been wondering about becoming a hiking or camping guide. I would love that.  I've been trying to teach my kid how to build things with wood lately.  I love it but she semi pays attention. 

I'm rambling.  I keep telling myself that I don't do the things I want to do. I ask myself why?

How do I go about getting my backbone back?? My balls??? I want to feel like a man again.


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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20715285 -

Quote:
How do I go about getting my backbone back?? My balls??? I want to feel like a man again.



Now we're getting to the meat of the matter. Love the direct approach :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

For me, one thing that consistently worked and got me places, is following my true inner drives and passions. ESPECIALLY those that my immediate friends/family thought were ludicrous bullshit.

Something like this:



For me, this meant giving up trying to kid myself, trying to form myself by others' desires. My mom wanted me to be some dude in a suit working in a bank. Tried for some months, BORED TO DEATH and I went away. Moved. Followed dead end jobs of my own choosing, for as long as I found them worth following, able to teach me something. As soon as that feeling went away, I went away.

Followed the psychedelics. Followed them wherever they lead, and they've given me health, peace of mind, A LOT of interesting shit to talk to people about, observation powers around the human nervous system (interest, attraction, energy levels etc) that help LOADS with the ladies, and -++

Well now this is a fantastic turn of events :lol:

As I was typing, room mate of my host came home and this started. Needless to say the rest of my post will have to wait until clearer waters. But be well, enjoy your existence on the blue planet and explore the wonders of this here forum.

Know that all is well, and ALL the info you seek is there for the looking, the hearing and the asking. All that's left for you to do is the associating and following through. And no worries, you WILL follow through on anything that's properly approached, seen, imagined and associated. The only things you fail to follow through on is the ones you're not properly linked with, have insufficient detail knowledge of, or have not clarified in your minds' eye your preferred outcomes. Work on this and you shall see true returns.

Boy this music rocks.

My good man I am in true tripping mode as we speak, shapeshifting into my true form. Will see where this leads :hellfire: :awecid: :hellfire:


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Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Spacerific]
    #20715364 -

Lol have fun. I was really looking forward to a more straight forward post. Maybe later!


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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20717383 -

I think you're doing fine man.


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Love.

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Re: Help with friend zone plus drama queen [Re: Seekingtruth]
    #20718161 -

Seekingtruth said:
Lol have fun. I was really looking forward to a more straight forward post. Maybe later!



OK I'm still tripping bawelz here, but why not drop in.

Allow me to offer apologies if I've been too unkind, crude or in other ways disruptive to your emotional well-being. I simply wish to share a way of doing things, a focus on direct action, cutting through the bullshit and the chatter and excuses, the overly verbal and in-the-head ways of the modern urban westerner, that are simply ruining the manly vibes in so many men these days. I know this because I suffered from it. Excessive seeking of approval, excessive talking (verbally) as opposed to clearer gesture, eye contact, few words but with a lot of weight behind each one.

It's good to have female friends. They indeed need not be fucked, dated nor in other ways compromised, unless they show some form of mutual interest in the same direction.

On how one deals with these matters, with women, with parents and children, I think it's a good idea to know the phases and processes involved. All kids need learning and protection up to a point, then they need to be given space and let to take their knowledge, tools and skills out into the real world. Growing up, there's that hero's journey, the young hero, protected in the family house / cave / city, has to get out in dangerous wastelands, jungle, desert, taxing conditions, and out there find himself. Find his or her true strength, find new tools, knowledge and companions, and then with this newfound treasure, return once more to his tribe, and be received as a valuable member, as a contributor and wise person. One who can be relied upon, because he knows himself, his tools and his limits, having tested them all well. Those who never leave the safety of the familiar, those who never risk, dare, fight the elements and crash against their limitations, will never know, never grow. Takes risk and sometimes losses to gain that hard skin, and it's the only way.

The child looks to the parent. Looks to the authority figure. Looks to the females like they're mommy (source of approval) and looks to other males like they're daddy (source of punishment if misbehaving). There's a certain reflex, an emotional pattern to this. A looking, a stopping-of-breath (waiting for approval, a sign of how one SHOULD feel, good if parents approve, horrible if they don't).

Watch for this reflex. If you say something and then look at others, wait on their approval, know you're being submissive, beta, practicing child mode. If on the other hand, you speak your mind as it is, with no care whatsoever if anybody approves, if you speak from your clear core truth, that' a man right there. No doubt.

The man looks to nobody but himself, for knowing what he feels and what is right. Deep within, in his very core. Sure one can ask mentors or friends for advice or opinions, but that's consulting. THere's no hanging on words, no anxiety, no stopping one's breath as one expects a cue on how to feel. The man simply is as he wants to be, feels how he feels, and all those who don't like it are none of his business. A man has a clear territory, clear loved ones he's responsible for, and there lie his priorities. THEIR opinions matter. It is for them that he keeps his heart and mind and body strong, clear and focused. It is for them that he will say a clear and loud NO to all requests for frivolous wasting of time or energy. The man has none to give on trivial matters, as he has a territory to maintain, loved ones to entertain, and bring them the good things in life, most of all his wise and pleasant company. Unspoiled by needless worry, un-hurried by trivial matters.

For some intuitive reason this seemed appropriate. I know it's long and the speaker starts a bit boring, but stick with it and you'll find some golden bits in there :biggrin:



As someone said above, you're doing fine. You have both your balls and your backbone where they need to be. Simply look to them for answer, not women, not parents nor anybody nor anything else in this whole wide universe but yourself, and that's all you need to do. You have them, just look deep to your own heart, your own breath and solar plexus for what is right, and that's it :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Any questions left?


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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