March Hare said:

Looks like a win to me. Weren't you the one talking about how it's a kill or be killed world and how you'd have no problem killing people?

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dakaen said:

Gilgamesh18 said:

I am not denying there were skirmishes with the indians. However disease did the vast majority of the work. Pretty scary how deadly disease can be huh.

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To act like it was just disease that primarily killed the natives is so disrespectful brother. Imagine trying to say that to survivors of the Holocaust. Imagine telling them that it wasn't the Nazis fault, yes some Nazis killed Jews but it was really the diseases that ran rampant in the concentration camps that led to so many deaths... Seriously man it's just disrespectful. I don't know why so many Americans can't come to grips with the truth. The truth than hundreds of thousands of men, women, and children were slaughtered like animals over land and minerals.

I'm not saying you should feel personally responsible but at least have the respect to acknowledge that it was our very own government and the ancestors of many of the people who live in this nation that are responsible for the genocide of nearly a hundred million people...

March Hare said:

Looks like a win to me. Weren't you the one talking about how it's a kill or be killed world and how you'd have no problem killing people?

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Bro, some of what I say is a joke. While I do believe the world is a kill or be killed world that doesn't mean I think it's right to commit genocide.

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spazmodog said:

the Europeans would have killed them all anyway, given the chance

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Juicin said:

If you said that about the holocaust it wouldn't be true.....

When you ask what happened to our native population, you would be lying if you said American pioneers actively murdered a decent percentage of that 100 million.

Obviously we did other things to crush their culture, and continue it today. But our genocide was never meant to literally wipe out the natives as a race, just force them to assimilate as second class citizens.

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The Ecstatic said:

Y'all motherfuckers need to read A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn.


We didn't just sail over here, and say "hey guys wanna be christians? how do you grow tobac- oops you're all dead now."


We (Europeans) exploited, stole from, enslaved, raped, sold, and murdered indigenous peoples from Africa and the Americas.


Yes, we managed to kill some by inadvertently infecting them with disease. That doesn't excuse the genocide that did take place, and the fact that people are trying to downplay it is disgusting.

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The Ecstatic said:

Y'all motherfuckers need to read A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn.


We didn't just sail over here, and say "hey guys wanna be christians? how do you grow tobac- oops you're all dead now."


We (Europeans) exploited, stole from, enslaved, raped, sold, and murdered indigenous peoples from Africa and the Americas.


Yes, we managed to kill some by inadvertently infecting them with disease. That doesn't excuse the genocide that did take place, and the fact that people are trying to downplay it is disgusting.

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dakaen said:

Juicin said:

Do you understand what "second class" citizenship is?

As in not with full rights? It's a convoluted topic that changes a lot over the years. But obviously natives would not be on par with whites

They would have no desire to kill them after they gave up their land, adding some more low wage man power was good for business. Which is what distinguishes it from a genocide. There was no overarching need to kill natives

And many people couldn't vote at the time. Including whites. Most of our founding fathers felt only land owning white men should vote. That Zinn goes into great detail about.........

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Do you understand that the US Government paid bounty hunters by the scalp to hunt and kill Indians regardless of sex, age, or hostility?...

I can see that you're not going to surrender your beliefs which is unfortunate. This country desperately needs to come to terms with the horrific past that founded it.

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Juicin said:

I don't see how you could have read Zinn's book and read it as a genocide to wipe out the natives as you're suggesting. He didn't put it that way in the book

Wipe out their culture and take their land yes.

Wipe out their blood? No

It doesn't have the same tone as the genocide in Rwanda or the Holocaust. It was a cultural genocide.

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March Hare said:

Looks like a win to me. Weren't you the one talking about how it's a kill or be killed world and how you'd have no problem killing people?

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