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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: PatrickKn]
    #20244685 -

but in America... no one is a savage.

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: akira_akuma]
    #20245329 -

This is why I hate the term "Native Americans". The term applies to many different groups of people with completely different cultures.


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #20245356 -

It's like every other broad label. Caucasian, Asian, American, African, European, Pacific Islander, Italian, Chinese... they all encompass many different groups of people with varying degrees of accuracy. It's hard to get perfectly defined terms for every situation.

I think Native Americans were probably just as widely varied in aggressiveness as all the other cultures on the planet.


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Edited by March Hare (07/09/14 01:34 AM)

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: millzy]
    #20246008 -

millzy said:
by the way, i'm curious, were the inca as violent as the maya and aztec? for some reason i've always gotten the impression that they were the nice ones of the bunch. anyone know?


I do get the impression that the Inca were less violent than the maya or aztec, however they still practiced human safricife but not nearly as much as the Aztecs.

Incas are famous for their impressive administration and engeneering weras the Aztecs are famous for human safricice and being fearsome warriors, whether that is actually the case I dont really know. The human mass human safrices by the Aztecs might have overshadowed their civilised side.

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: PatrickKn]
    #20246015 -

To answer the OP

PatrickKn said:
Can't sum up an entire continent full of several hundred tribes, cultures and military superpowers and sum them all up as either "Savage" or "Peaceful". It's just silly, really damn silly. Even after the beginning of European colonization of both American continents, we are still talking about OVER 500 years of evolving war technology, cultural assimilation, yada yada yada. Anywhere from 10 million to 70 million people by any range of estimates across an enormous piece of land covering over a third of the planet.

Were the Native Americans savages? Sure, all humans are if you want to sum them all up in one group. It's damn silly man, so damn silly.


^^^

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: topdog82]
    #20246114 -

How savage were the people who conquered the Americas and laid waste to the many nations of its native inhabitants?


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Asante]
    #20246147 -

obviously very savage, but that wasnt the question

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: spazmodog]
    #20246164 -

Not all of em though.

And thats key to the original question. The original question is very ethnically polarized.  The native americans measured relative to, well probably white europeans.

You just cant do that. There were so many nations and they went through so many stages of development.

Take Germany for one. 70 years ago, very savage. Now they kick ass at economics and football. One nation.

And evenb within Nazi Germany the majority ofd people were good people, and you couldnt really hold them accountable for the politics of their nation.

Some nations were peaceful, some were warloving, but in all cases most of the people were sort of OK.

The original question is entirely too ethnically polarized and simplified.


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Asante]
    #20246209 -

They were savage and violent but all to varying degrees. I've done a fair amount of reading about this back in college and from what I understood the main thing that kept them peaceful had nothing to do with their intent, but rather their ability to move great enough distances in short time.

Many tribes were considered mostly peaceful, while some were considered extremely aggressive (like the Blackfoot). The main thing keeping them from fighting all the time was the fact that it would take a ridiculously long time to travel in those times and the tribes were pretty well spread out. Once the Spain came over with horses, which came up through Mexico and flourished in North America, it gave the "Native Americans" the ability to move or attack at a much greater speed and they started raiding other tribes all the time. Food, territory, women, fun, profit, greed.... Pretty much the same reasons war has been fought since the beginning of our existence. Why should they be any different?

Before they would of exhausted a ton of resources and had to move their entire tribe in the process of raiding another tribe, but now that they could do it quickly, they could send out groups of warriors, and more often than not killing and stealing was a lot easier than farming and hunting for the same amount of food/resources.

No culture is free from blame. No matter who they like to point the finger at.

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: JonnyBtreed]
    #20246399 -

Here is an interesting, well sourced article about wars between native American peoples. I think much of the perception of their wars being bloodless or more peaceful comes from the fact that they were mostly stealing people to bolster their numbers, why would you kill someone you're aiming to kidnap?

http://www.answers.com/topic/native-american-wars-wars-among-native-americans


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Calm_A_Llama_Down]
    #20246453 -

I think you may have misread. It says nothing about bolstering numbers. The article mentions grief wars and that captives were either 'ceremonially tortured to death' or adopted into the group. When explaining the roles of men and women in their wars in general, it states that the primary impetus was taking captives, but doesn't further explain what they were being taken captive for. Could be slaves, could be sacrifices, could be new blood for the tribe.


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Edited by March Hare (07/09/14 09:18 AM)

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: March Hare]
    #20246472 -

I've always wondered why the white men nearly wiped out the indians with their diseases and stuff but not the other way around. seems like it would be a two-way street.

I mean didn't the indians have a bunch of diseases to share too? or what's up with that


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: topdog82]
    #20246482 -

There certainly were wars and such things, but one interesting thing is the concept of "counting coup" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting_coup. In these types of situations, rather than one tribe slaughter the other, the outcome of a battle was often more focused around humiliating the head warriors of the other tribe. In this way, disputes could be settled without as much bloodshed.


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #20246523 -

Not savage enough.


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Asante] * 2
    #20246668 -

Asante said:
How savage were the people who conquered the Americas and laid waste to the many nations of its native inhabitants?


White guilt :lol:


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Gilgamesh18] * 1
    #20246675 -

Pointless buzz word :lol:

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Gilgamesh18] * 1
    #20246678 -

Gilgamesh18 said:
Asante said:
How savage were the people who conquered the Americas and laid waste to the many nations of its native inhabitants?


White guilt :lol:


What's so bad about understanding history?


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #20246685 -

The Ecstatic said:
Gilgamesh18 said:
Asante said:
How savage were the people who conquered the Americas and laid waste to the many nations of its native inhabitants?


White guilt :lol:


What's so bad about understanding history?


Nothing at all of course senselessly blaming whites isn't really the answer though. The vast majority about 90 percent of natives died due to virgin soil epidemics that the whites had no control over.


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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: Gilgamesh18]
    #20246692 -

Except for when they were purposely given blankets infected with the small pox virus


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"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

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Re: How savage were the Native Americans? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #20246707 -

nicechrisman said:
Except for when they were purposely given blankets infected with the small pox virus


The Spanish didn't give out blankets and most of the Aztecs died due to disease. I also find it hard to believe that Europeans who had no understanding of germ theory engaged in biological warfare.


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