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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828056 -

Diecommie, true but that has become a more difficult road to take(rightfully so). Side note, anyone else refinance lately? I thought it was strange that this time I had to have someone from the bank come in and take photos of my home. That was a first, wasn't your normal appraisal.


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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

Edited by love2shpongleIRL (02/18/12 04:22 PM)

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: badchad]
    #15828062 -

badchad said:
zappaisgod said:
The three most important things in real estate are..............................



location, location, location...


I was going to say real estate, money, and having arms. :strokebeard:


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:smoking:

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828064 -

Appeasement is what keeps the proletariat delusional and indifferent to their position.

At the breaking point of collective realization and efforts towards a change, a new war will show up just in time and we'll again be trading patriotism for rationality.

Seems like a stretch, eh? After the Arab Spring protests gradually swung around to Israel, with the largest economic protests in the history of the country gathering in the center, the government "spontaneously" decides it will start swapping prisoners of high profile cases. They ended up trading Gilad Shalit (using the same deal that was made over 5 years ago, that the government just kept on the back-burner). Whenever he was freed, the front pages of all the papers showed him saluting the president. The media gradually changed focus and de-centralized the importance of economic changes while Tel Aviv began forcefully and silently removing all of the tent encampments.

There are different forms of appeasement: in addition to this example, there are "panem et circenses" (Go Tigers, Rah rah rah!) and efforts of patriotic hero-making, as in the cases of protecting ourselves from 'terrorists.'

It's an endless circus.


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828077 -

Jessica Swift said:
It's an endless circus.


Isn't that the point? Constantly keeping us distracted from the reality of our political situation.


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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

Edited by love2shpongleIRL (02/18/12 04:27 PM)

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828082 -

"Then go vote!"

:shoosh:


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828090 -

love2shpongleIRL said:
Jessica Swift said:
It's an endless circus.


Isn't that the point? Constantly being distracted from the reality of our political situation.


I think its more of a lame excuse to justify inaction and indifference.

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828092 -

love2shpongleIRL said:
Diecommie, true but that has become a more difficult road to take(rightfully so). Side note, anyone else refinance lately? I thought it was strange that this time I had to have someone from the bank come in and take photos of my home. That was a first, wasn't your normal appraisal.


That was exactly the appraisal we got.  Twice.  Same woman.  She still took pictures even though she already had them from the first time.  SOP.

By the way, aren't you glad that they were nice enough to lend you money on a promise?


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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift] * 1
    #15828098 -

:lolsy: Diebold ftl


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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: DieCommie]
    #15828103 -

DieCommie said:
I think its more of a lame excuse to justify inaction and indifference.


People constrained by financial concerns are incapable of being proactive.


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: zappaisgod]
    #15828105 -

zappaisgod said:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Diecommie, true but that has become a more difficult road to take(rightfully so). Side note, anyone else refinance lately? I thought it was strange that this time I had to have someone from the bank come in and take photos of my home. That was a first, wasn't your normal appraisal.


That was exactly the appraisal we got.  Twice.  Same woman.  She still took pictures even though she already had them from the first time.  SOP.

By the way, aren't you glad that they were nice enough to lend you money on a promise?


Of course I am glad, that doesn't mean I can't be aware of how fucked things really are.


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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
    #15828109 -

How fucked can they be if you got a loan?


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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: zappaisgod]
    #15828117 -

zappaisgod said:
How fucked can they be if you got a loan?


Not my situation personally, right now I have a great quality of life(I don't see it lasting for me like it did for your generation). The larger picture is what I am trying to gain an honest assesment of.


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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828119 -

Jessica Swift said:
DieCommie said:
I think its more of a lame excuse to justify inaction and indifference.


People constrained by financial concerns are incapable of being proactive.


Bullshit.  That is just a cop out lazy excuse by the fiscally irresponsible.

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: DieCommie]
    #15828141 -

DieCommie said:
Jessica Swift said:
DieCommie said:
I think its more of a lame excuse to justify inaction and indifference.


People constrained by financial concerns are incapable of being proactive.


Bullshit.  That is just a cop out lazy excuse by the fiscally irresponsible.


Why do you sound so angry? You can usually judge the weight of an argument by how emotive the contender is.

Multiple historical examples support suppression by economic control. It's the history of the world, if anything. Chomsky has several lectures exploring this.

As another international example, I have an acquaintance who is working to set up radar security systems in Angola, which are intended to alert authorities should suspicious activity or large gatherings occur in one of cities. It's a reaction to earlier attempts by the people to revolt. As another form of economic control and appeasement, the government recently started providing infrastructure in some of the towns (ironically by the same companies that install security for the ruling class). It's a symbolic token to distract from the true case of resource hoarding by a handful of people.

Is this really such a foreign idea to you?


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828151 -

What does that have to do with your claim that financial constraints lead to an inability to be proactive?

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828166 -

Who constrained them?  They did it themselves.  Tough shit.


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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: zappaisgod]
    #15828171 -

DieCommie said:
What does that have to do with your claim that finances lead to an inability to be proactive?


Depends on which way you wish to analyze the effect. Maslow's hierarchy of needs is another way to conceptualize it: people griped by financial burdens are not only incapable of enacting change on a political system built out of money, but they are ultimately uninterested and unaware due to expenditure of energy on other immediate concerns. Angola, by providing infrastructure, manipulates the people according to their own poverty - which the government itself is creating by resource hoarding. It's a case of fabricating both the problem and the solution. 

Does this make sense now?

zappaisgod said:
Who constrained them?  They did it themselves.  Tough shit.


People born into poor families inherit poor, economic decision-making not due to inherit irrationality and stupidity, but because they lack an educational and supportive environment that is more guaranteed in a financially secure household.


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828178 -

Quote:
Does this make sense now?


Reads like you are defending learned helplessness to me.

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: DieCommie]
    #15828190 -

DieCommie said:
Quote:
Does this make sense now?


Reads like you are defending learned helplessness to me.


Despite my attempts towards rational debate, this is the third consecutive one-liner from you, so I retire.


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http://pavlov77.tumblr.com/
http://futurevspresent.com/

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Re: Peonage and modern society [Re: Jessica Swift]
    #15828200 -

Jessica Swift said:
zappaisgod said:
Who constrained them?  They did it themselves.  Tough shit.


People born into poor families inherit poor, economic decision-making not due to inherit irrationality and stupidity, but because they lack an educational and supportive environment that is more guaranteed in a financially secure household.


How is the day to day endeavor to feed and shelter one's self a constraint?  Is that not the condition of all life?

A lot of people are inherently stupid.  Fully 50% of the population is below average in intelligence.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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