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Shop: Myyco.com Isolated Cubensis Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Icelander]
    #12217762 -

Just highlights the importance of individual effort.
No one is gonna do it for ya.


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Kickle]
    #12217949 -

I agree that one must do it themself to really see, but i gotta say that all this stuff, like effort to attain happiness, attaining happiness, then losing happiness, all has an 'I' behind it, and unless one gets behind this 'I' there will never be lasting happiness.

Attachment to objects is the root of suffering, alot of us can agree, but its attaching to this 'I' (the most subtle object) that is the cause of all attachment


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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12217966 -

Well if losing this attachment to "I" is freedom then the rest of the animal kingdom must be there. Any attachment they would have would likely be instinctual only.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12217976 -

Hey Chronic
what about non-attachment of non-attachment?
or a letting go of happiness?

Equal opportunities for all :thumbup::thumbdown:


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Kickle]
    #12218126 -

Yes :thumbup: letting go of letting go etc...

Although its gotta actually be feeling/seeing that letting go
Not just a clever zen phrase

Cause i talk about it so much, it may seem to an onlooker 'this guys just attached to non-attachment'
Although if im talking about non-attachment, that includes non-attchment to everything, including non-attachment itself :wink:


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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12218160 -

But wouldn't letting go of non-attachment mean you're allowing yourself to be attached?
Thereby negating any purpose of non-attachment in the first place?

I'm not just talking about the words/thoughts of non-attachment.
I'm talking about actions and experiences as well.

e.g. I feel attachment to this post arising... I feel non-attachment coming to counter... I release my attachment to both -- where am I?


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Kickle]
    #12218185 -

where am I?

Back at the Shroomery.:tongue:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Icelander]
    #12218239 -

Icelander said:
where am I?

Back at the Shroomery.:tongue:


:lol:


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Icelander]
    #12218252 -

Kickle said:
But wouldn't letting go of non-attachment mean you're allowing yourself to be attached?



Quote:
e.g. I feel attachment to this post arising... I feel non-attachment coming to counter... I release my attachment to both -- where am I?



I deleted my post, you just answered your own question
You are beyond attachment & non-attachment


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Edited by Chronic7 (03/17/10 02:03 PM)

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12218292 -

For the average every day person, who is not Buddha, and who HAS attachments...

there has to be a better way to deal with his suffering then telling him to "cease being attached to I".

The more and more I hear it, the more and more I feel like it is like trying to catch air in a net. You can attempt it all you want, so you are trying to cease all your attachments, but at the end of the day you are still just like your next door neighbor. You still suffer, just like you did when you were a child.

Wouldn't it just be easier to accept that suffering is a part of all of our lives? Why are we trying so hard to avoid it in the first place?


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Word to your mom.

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12218317 -

Chronic777 said:
I deleted my post, you just answered your own question
You are beyond attachment & non-attachment


Yeah, I noticed that as I typed it. I found it humorous.
And I think Icelander is right, you're right back where you started :lol:


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218323 -

All of this learning how to cease all your attachments....how does one do it? If it were so easy that you could just clap your hands and do it, then we would all be Buddha's.

Instead people strive to achieve it, like a form of escapism. They try to escape from reality being ceasing attachment to reality.

Doesn't it take more courage to FACE reality as "I'?


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Word to your mom.

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218344 -

No one can escape facing reality as "I" if you ask me.
But non-attachment is pretty simple. You just observe what is happening and then let it happen.
You don't get caught up on descriptions of what is happening (thoughts) or what led to it and what will come of it.
You just let it happen, right here, right now -- and you watch.

All those things -- thoughts, projections into the future, comparisons to the past... they will happen. But you needn't attach to them.

So really, you are facing the I. You're turning to face it utterly. You're watching it whir.
As you watch it, you needn't believe you are it. You needn't buy into it.
You needn't attach to it as you.


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218356 -

BrainChemistry said:
Wouldn't it just be easier to accept that suffering is a part of all of our lives? Why are we trying so hard to avoid it in the first place?


If you can truly accept it then it wouldn't even be labelled suffering

Quote:
there has to be a better way to deal with his suffering then telling him to "cease being attached to I".


There is no better way (that i can suggest) because any other way is just a temporary bandaid, not a cure
If i was to talk about a longway round i'd be consciously lying to you & to myself

Quote:
The more and more I hear it, the more and more I feel like it is like trying to catch air in a net.



It is, the mind is the net trying to catch something, but you are not the mind, you are the air


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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12218442 -

Quote:
But non-attachment is pretty simple. You just observe what is happening and then let it happen.


Its more complicated then that though.

Say I really like my car. I spent a lot of time working to save up for that car. I drive it everyday, clean it everyday, sometimes I have sex in the back seat. I fucking love this car.

Then one day it gets stolen. Well, naturally I'm a bit angry....but instead of suffering that much, I just say Well fuck, that is life, and then I move on. Secretly it still bothers me that my car is gone, but I just set the goal to buy a new one, and I'm ok.

So what is that? Am I actually not attached to my car? Or have I just learned to deal with suffering, or to put suffering behind me?


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Word to your mom.

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218463 -

So what is that? Am I actually not attached to my car? Or have I just learned to deal with suffering, or to put suffering behind me?

The way you described it, you've lost attachment to the car and replaced it with an attachment to a conceptualization of what life should be. Swapping one attachment for another.

Both of those are thoughts that arise.
Non-attachment is seeing them just as thoughts and not attaching to them as reality.
Thoughts can describe reality, and thoughts can describe expectations, and thoughts can describe desires...
but thoughts are not reality.


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218488 -

You've attached to getting a new car! :lol:

You may not beleive me but when stuff that seems random like falling off my bike (hard), stubbing my toe, dropping a glass, having a car accident, my mobile phone screen cracking, i honestly see it as the universes unfolding

I can no longer be all attached like 'maaan why is this happening to ME'
I've lost that capacity to feel victim to anything
Send in the tigers, let's see... :shrug:

You can have you car stolen, then go about getting a new one, without being attached at all
You can also have your car stolen, then go about getting a new one, and bitch & moan along the way being very attached


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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Chronic7]
    #12218494 -

I'm loving the tag-team

:highfive:


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: Kickle]
    #12218504 -

I'm so important that I drive a Lambo!

And all the bitches want me.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Becoming unimportant. [Re: BrainChemistry]
    #12218512 -

Hey man I agree with you more than them. Suffering isn't something that's easy to overcome. But non-attachment is pretty simple.Statements like that are pure bs for most if not all humans who have a long history of culture training. Nobody here is enlightened imo and being fully non attached is enlightenment in my book. So somebody is preaching but not practicing. :wink:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Shop: Myyco.com Isolated Cubensis Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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