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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11422136 -

dude, from my point of view i AM the most important collection of atoms in the universe

this is the ONLY of collection of atoms in the universe which, if taken apart, would result in my death
why WOULDN'T i think it's important?


i mean technically the atoms are being changed out all the time but you get what i'm saying


--------------------
Weedmaster P knows the truth.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: laserpig]
    #11422181 -

laserpig said:
dude, from my point of view i AM the most important collection of atoms in the universe

The universe does not make value judgments, so, from an objective point of view, no atom is more or less "significant" than any other atom.



laserpig said:
this is the ONLY of collection of atoms in the universe which, if taken apart, would result in my death
why WOULDN'T i think it's important?

There's a difference between subjective value judgments and objective reality--in objective reality, there is nothing to give value to the collection of atoms that comprises your body.



laserpig said:
i mean technically the atoms are being changed out all the time but you get what i'm saying

Yeah, I get what you're saying! :thumbup:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11422224 -

the feel i'm getting is that you're okay with my stance towards the atoms of me

my question is: how does this differ from other people's "narcissistic cosmic significance?"
is your beef that i acknowledge my judgement to be subjective and others don't?
either way, the judgment IS subjective, so why get hot-'n-bothered?


--------------------
Weedmaster P knows the truth.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11422256 -

Poid said:
This is an idea Ernest Becker presented in his book Denial of Death that I sort of find to be extremely true; that most humans are so narcissistic to the point that they believe that the collection of atoms that constitutes their bodies is more significant, in a cosmic sense, then any other collection of atoms.


So, basically, most humans think they're special. But they're really not. :nonono:


well that's from your subjective standpoint, innit?


--------------------
[quote]Oweyervishice said:
[quote]Icelander said:
What is at the bottom of it?[/quote]

Death anxiety? :flirt:[/quote]

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: laserpig]
    #11422267 -

I think the issue is not whether you think you are all important but how you act out in the world.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Icelander]
    #11422292 -

Icelander said:
I think the issue is not whether you think you are all important but how you act out in the world.


i think there's no issues.


--------------------
[quote]Oweyervishice said:
[quote]Icelander said:
What is at the bottom of it?[/quote]

Death anxiety? :flirt:[/quote]

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: laserpig]
    #11422319 -

laserpig said:
the feel i'm getting is that you're okay with my stance towards the atoms of me

I don't have any problem with your stance towards the atoms that comprise your body. :shrug:



laserpig said:
my question is: how does this differ from other people's "narcissistic cosmic significance?"

Well, obviously, every human's narcissism is different, so the literal answer to this question is, well, obvious.

From an objective point of view, though, any belief held by any individual that the atoms which comprise their bodies are more significant than any other collection of atoms is a delusional one. :crazy2:



laserpig said:
is your beef that i acknowledge my judgement to be subjective and others don't?
either way, the judgment IS subjective, so why get hot-'n-bothered?

My "beef" is with delusional beliefs...:crazy2:



nootropic said:
Poid said:
This is an idea Ernest Becker presented in his book Denial of Death that I sort of find to be extremely true; that most humans are so narcissistic to the point that they believe that the collection of atoms that constitutes their bodies is more significant, in a cosmic sense, then any other collection of atoms.


So, basically, most humans think they're special. But they're really not. :nonono:


well that's from your subjective standpoint, innit?

Technically, yes, but I've tried my best to put this phenomenon under the lens of rational objectivity. :shrug:

Either you have an argument to present, or you don't. :lol:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

Edited by Poid (09/22/12 08:46 AM)

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: nootropic]
    #11422329 -

If that was true you wouldn't be posting.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Icelander]
    #11422348 -

Icelander said:
If that was true you wouldn't be posting.


Burn! :septemberlol:

:highfive:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Icelander]
    #11422380 -

:vineclimb:
there's no escape  :omgz:


--------------------
[quote]Oweyervishice said:
[quote]Icelander said:
What is at the bottom of it?[/quote]

Death anxiety? :flirt:[/quote]

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: nootropic]
    #11422412 -

There's one...:uptosomething:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11422501 -

Poid said:
From Wave function collapse - Wikipedia:
Quote:
In quantum mechanics, wave function collapse (also called collapse of the state vector or reduction of the wave packet) is the process by which a wave function, initially in a superposition of different eigenstates, appears to reduce to a single one of the states after interaction with an observer. In simplified terms, it is the condensation of physical possibilities into a single occurrence, as seen by an observer. It is one of two processes by which quantum systems evolve in time according to the laws of quantum mechanics as presented by John von Neumann. The reality of wave function collapse has always been debated, i.e., whether it is a fundamental physical phenomenon in its own right or just an epiphenomenon of another process, such as quantum decoherence. In recent decades the quantum decoherence view has gained popularity. Collapse may be understood as a change in conditional probabilities.




Fraggin said:
One cannont simultaneously experience and understand a subjective system objectively.

So why can one not simultaneously experience & understand a subjective system (e.g.- wave function collapse)? What about experiencing a subjective system prohibits one from understanding said system? Why does understanding a subjective system prohibit one from experiencing said system?


You did not quote me correctly.

Quote:
One cannont simultaneously experience and understand a subjective system objectively.



It's that simple. I'm sorry you don't understand.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Fraggin]
    #11422518 -

Fraggin said:
You did not quote me correctly.

I literally pressed 'Quote' on that quote, so I really don't know why you are saying this...:confused:



Fraggin said:
Quote:
One cannont simultaneously experience and understand a subjective system objectively.



It's that simple. I'm sorry you don't understand.

So basically, you are not prepared to defend your assertion here? :strokebeard:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Fraggin]
    #11422646 -

Quote:
One cannont simultaneously experience and understand a subjective system objectively.


uhm. i think he is saying that an individual cannot understand a subjective system (like the experiencing life through the mind) because that individual is simultaneously subjectively experiencing that system.

wow that's a bad explanation. here i'll try again:
i'm a person. i'm limited to my subjective perceptions/experiences/etc. i cannot understand the system objectively because i'm a subjective being in this subjective system.

maybe i'll just be quiet now...


--------------------
[quote]Oweyervishice said:
[quote]Icelander said:
What is at the bottom of it?[/quote]

Death anxiety? :flirt:[/quote]

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: nootropic]
    #11422671 -

Poid said:
This is an idea Ernest Becker presented in his book Denial of Death that I sort of find to be extremely true; that most humans are so narcissistic to the point that they believe that the collection of atoms that constitutes their bodies is more significant, in a cosmic sense, then any other collection of atoms.


So, basically, most humans think they're special. But they're really not. :nonono:


:imspecial:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11422693 -

Poid said:
Fraggin said:
You did not quote me correctly.

I literally pressed 'Quote' on that quote, so I really don't know why you are saying this...:confused:



Fraggin said:
Quote:
One cannont simultaneously experience and understand a subjective system objectively.



It's that simple. I'm sorry you don't understand.

So basically, you are not prepared to defend your assertion here? :strokebeard:


So basically, I don't feel like taking the time to do your homework for you. :facepalm:

If my statement is false, Tell me it is false and tell me why. :yesnod:

IF you don't understand a one sentence description of a very basic rudamentary concept of modality in plain english form, then you lack comprehension. :confused:

Apparently everyone else understood it...:shrug:

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Fraggin]
    #11426377 -

deCypher said:
Poid said:
This is an idea Ernest Becker presented in his book Denial of Death that I sort of find to be extremely true; that most humans are so narcissistic to the point that they believe that the collection of atoms that constitutes their bodies is more significant, in a cosmic sense, then any other collection of atoms.


So, basically, most humans think they're special. But they're really not. :nonono:


:imspecial:

:yesnod:



Fraggin said:
So basically, I don't feel like taking the time to do your homework for you. :facepalm:

If my statement is false, Tell me it is false and tell me why. :yesnod:

I asked you a set of questions, and you failed to respond to them. :shrug:
Poid said:
So why can one not simultaneously experience & understand a subjective system (e.g.- wave function collapse)? What about experiencing a subjective system prohibits one from understanding said system? Why does understanding a subjective system prohibit one from experiencing said system?


Instead of answering my questions, you dodged them and claimed that your sentence is "...a very basic rudamentary concept of modality in plain english form..." (Nice spelling skills! :smile:), so much so that it doesn't need any further explanation due to the fact that "..I lack comprehension...". Nice!
:highfive:



Fraggin said:
Apparently everyone else understood it...:shrug:

Well, then, I guess I'm a flowstone. :flowstone:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11426499 -

Did you ever find that dictionary?

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Fraggin]
    #11426509 -

No, I'm too fucking stupid to read and/or spell correctly! :tard:


Also, I fucking suck ass at debating. :shrug:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Delusional Narcissistic Cosmic Significance [Re: Poid]
    #11426574 -

I'm sure someone will debate that...

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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