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Water Fuel - HHO Gas
    #5628372 -

Very interesting, wish there were more details. No bitching about the wmv.

http://www.rratch.com/Misc/WaterFuel/WaterFuel.wmv

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5628499 -

That is very impressive.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5628950 -

The "HHO gas" is simply a mixture of hydrogen and oxygen in a 2:1 ratio. This is achieved naturally through electrolysis. It is misleading to say his engines run on hydrogen as electricity is needed to release the hydrogen from the water. It would be interesting to know more about his electrolysis method.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5629076 -

http://www.shoutwire.com/viewstory/12433/Car_That_Runs_on_Tap_Water

This guy also had contracts with the military before he was poisoned....


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5629681 -

The movie "Chain Reaction" was just on last night, I stayed up till 5am and watched it.

Good old hydrogen.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5631074 -

Isn't a lot of hydrogen and oxygen together a really good way to blow things up?

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: monamine]
    #5631424 -

> Isn't a lot of hydrogen and oxygen together a really good way to blow things up?

Hydrogen can be very dangerous, but then so can petrol. However, from the look of his system, it generates hydrogen/oxygen "on demand" rather than storing it. Upon an accident, there would not be very much free gas to do damage. Modern day storage systems for hydrogen gas are pretty safe. They use chemicals, such as titanium dioxide, to hold hydrogen like a sponge holds water. If there is an accident, the hydrogen is slowly released reducing the change of an explosion.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5633974 -

That was almost unwatchable on my comp.

I don't get it. So the car runs on water and a whole lot of electricity?

So this is a way to run an internal combustion engine off of electricity?


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #5635610 -

Nobody gets it yet, except him. He's being tightlipped about how it works.

To be fair, people have performed scams along very similar lines as this man's inventions. I'd say it's not impossible that he's a hack. It's too early to know.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Seuss]
    #5635682 -

Would it be possible to design an electrolysis system efficient or innovative enough that the input of electricity was significantly less than the power output of the hydrogen/oxygen engine?

Sorry, I'm a complete idiot when it comes to physics. I guess what I'm asking is, is the stored energy of the hydrogen greater than the energy required to transform it from a component of water to a burnable gas?

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: OJK]
    #5636503 -

Quote:
Would it be possible to design an electrolysis system efficient or innovative enough that the input of electricity was significantly less than the power output of the hydrogen/oxygen engine?


No. At very low power levels, the electrolysis will endotherm, releasing more energy in hydrogen/oxygen than what was used in the form of electricity, but it is very slow at these power levels, and the energy still comes from the heat around the system, not from "magic".

Quote:
I guess what I'm asking is, is the stored energy of the hydrogen greater than the energy required to transform it from a component of water to a burnable gas?


Not a stupid question. Actually, the correct question to be asking, but difficult to answer. There are two ways to "burn" hydrogen... the sun burns hydrogen at the atmoic level while the space shuttle burns hydrogen at the chemical level. At the chemical level, it takes more energy to tear water apart into hydrogen and oxygen than you get back when you burn the hydrogen and oxygen creating water. At the atomic level, you get much more energy when you fuse two hydrogen atoms together forming helium than it takes to release hydrogen gas from water; however, we cannot maintain an atomic hydrogen burn, thus we cannot use the energy. They are currently throwing billions of dollars into R&D trying to solve this problem. If anybody can figure out how to maintain an atomic burn of hydrogen, then the worlds energy problems are solved, quite literally.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Ythan]
    #5637181 -

This is pretty fantastic news if it works out.

I just can't imagine an electric battery big enough and an electrolysis process efficient enough to strip hydrogen and oxygen from water and run a vehicle the weight of a car at a journey of length.

It would of course be ideal to run a hydrogen vehicle on water because you wouldn't have to store combustable gas in the car but can a battery supply enough electricity to seperate enough gas from water to power the engine?

Hmmmm.


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ca'rouse (k-rouz)
intr.v.
To engage in boisterous, drunken merrymaking.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: TODAY]
    #5637976 -

The major issue isn't that the gas is combustible, it's mostly that even when compressed into a liquid it takes a very big tank to store an amount of fuel comparable to a tank of gasoline.

You can (and a university did) shoot a hydrogen tank with an incendiary bullet and not have any sort of explosion, just a violent leak from the hole that dissipates quickly. Hell, the real concern would be the instant creation of freezing temperatures as the gas expanded. But, tanks that store the hydrogen in a sort of absorbent substrate take things up to a higher yet level of safety.

Then again, water is far denser than hydrogen gas is, and it's 2/3 hydrogen (by molar ratio, not weight)... so it is of course a even more space-efficient and safer yet.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: TODAY]
    #5638308 -

Zinc reacts with water to form hydrogen and zinc oxide at a temperature of a few hundred degrees.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #5638401 -

Sorry, but what is your point? Was that a response to my post?

Are you saying that the reaction in this engine is likely zinc and water heated to the temperature necessary to break down water into hydrogen and oxygen?


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ca'rouse (k-rouz)
intr.v.
To engage in boisterous, drunken merrymaking.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: TODAY]
    #5640375 -

Obviously not, because the guy said, it happens by electrolysis. Not by a reaction with a metal.

Sodium produces hydrogen when mixed with water and thats at room temp, but then your left with sodium hydroxide.

Besides, this technology is nothing new, electrolysis has been around for 100 or 200 years.
Its just now people are getting smart enough to take advantage of things we already know.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: OJK]
    #5641047 -

Odiumjunkie said:
is the stored energy of the hydrogen greater than the energy required to transform it from a component of water to a burnable gas?


The electrochemicalaly stored energy of hydrogen is smaller than the energy required to create it from water via electrolysis.


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Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Anno]
    #5642002 -

Anno said:
Odiumjunkie said:
is the stored energy of the hydrogen greater than the energy required to transform it from a component of water to a burnable gas?


The electrochemicalaly stored energy of hydrogen is smaller than the energy required to create it from water via electrolysis.


However, there are sources of electricity cheap enough to input into electrolysis of water with the goal of outputting hydrogen and oxygen gas. The gas could then be stored, shipped, stocked in stores and actually provide better utility than the electricity used to seperate the gas for the reasons of the ease of storing and transporting it.


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ca'rouse (k-rouz)
intr.v.
To engage in boisterous, drunken merrymaking.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: TODAY]
    #5643029 -

> The gas could then be stored, shipped, stocked in stores

All of which subtract from the overall efficiency of the system.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Water Fuel - HHO Gas [Re: Seuss]
    #5645671 -

Yes, but if cheap power is available where electrolysis is run, the whole system of transporting the gas may become economical.

If a company can generate electricity with solar heat (there are solar thermal power plants in at least CA and AZ) where the sunshine is plentiful and the land is cheap and use that electricity for electrolysis then distributing the resulting gas may become economical. Of course I haven't done ample analysis but the principle stands.


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ca'rouse (k-rouz)
intr.v.
To engage in boisterous, drunken merrymaking.

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