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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2679124 -

do you watch the news? there is a scandal unfolding involving the saudi prince and bush. ya know, the one about bush fixing the gas prices then lowering em at election time?? its all about money big guy :laugh:

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679129 -

Really!? Good! I know who to vote for now, at least I will be able to fill my truck come election day.

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679156 -

Gee Einstein, you think maybe it might have something to do with the fact that a war with China would be about 200 times the expense, and kill 1000 times as many people?

Oh, and of couse China doesn't have any other valuable resources.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #2679181 -

Baby_Hitler said:
Gee Einstein, you think maybe it might have something to do with the fact that a war with China would be about 200 times the expense, and kill 1000 times as many people?

Oh, and of couse China doesn't have any other valuable resources.


well duh, i just hate these republicans saying how great it was we toppled this violent dictator...my point is there are many worse dictators we dont bother with, cuz they dont have resources

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679196 -

I'm telling you it's not because they don't have resources.

It's because they have too much resources. A war with China would be WW3.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #2679199 -

yeah i know, you're missing the point

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679211 -

KingOftheThing said:
well duh, i just hate these republicans saying how great it was we toppled this violent dictator...my point is there are many worse dictators we dont bother with, cuz they dont have resources


We don't bother because they aren't making threats at us, they aren't paying suicide bombers, harboring terrorists, OR because it's too late to do anything as with North Korea. Your argument is foolishly simplistic and uninformed.
By the way, WHICH countries are so much worse than Iraq, besides Syria, North Korea, Iran, and Sudan, all of which the US is highly critical of as well? What evil dictatorships are we giving the thumbs up to because they don't have oil?


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679224 -

Well, China was a shitty example. Maybe you'd like to look in Africa for some better ones.


If I thought Bush would send us to liberate one of those countries, I'd be tempted to vote for him. Right now though I don't think we're ready for another liberation.


Maybe in 2008.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2679226 -

oh, what threat did iraq have? oh yeah bush thought he had some ICMBs with nukes :lol: even the UN told us he had shit

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679373 -

Do you have proof that the UN said that there were no WMD in Iraq?


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #2679384 -

well i saw hans blix on bill oreilly and he said he told the usa, they had no evidence sadam had any weapons and he filed reports saying no weapons....then oreilly jumped down his throat about the UN being corrupt and blah blah blah, i fucking hate oreilly

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2679405 -

They sure were acting like they had something to hide. There's no way the inspections could have really determined anything. Saddam led them arround by the nose.


In their defense, they appear to have been correct.

Their means for making that assessment however were about as reliable as consulting a psychic.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2679424 -

Ok so you think it was all over oil? Explain gas prices?

*Naivete alert!* The was was to make money for the ELITE, not you and I.

How did Bush make his fortune? By getting the TAXPAYERS to foot the bill for his (and other investors') stadium even though it was promoted at "helping the community".

How much return will the average joe get on his $300,000,000,000 investment? Next to nothing for a few hundred million man-hours of work. It is called funneling, sweetheart deals and kickbacks.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #2679431 -

Oh, and of couse China doesn't have any other valuable resources.

I love shrimp in black-bean sauce and Kung Pao beef.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Swami]
    #2679435 -

So what's in it for bush?


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: afoaf]
    #2679904 -

afoaf said:
it's quite on topic...

the poll is a 'no shit' question.

I don't think anyone here doubts that anyone around
the world, muslim or not, probably wants democracy
even in the face of short term instability.


I disagree. I'm sure you'd have no problem finding those who still think a number of other systems would work better. You don't even have to leave this forum.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2680552 -

This just in: Ice is cold!

-------


Ok so you think it was all over oil? Explain gas prices? You need to read up on some economics. If we wanted the oil we would have 'given peace a chance', given Sadam a big bear-hug, dropped our sanctions and BOUGHT IT for about 300 billion dollars cheaper..

Such insight into the intricate workings of international politics.

I would recommend reading up on economics yourself. Reserve currencies, the dollar vs. the euro, petro-currency... Throw some rudimentary business theory in there too. Let the fairy tales die.


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If you want a free lunch, you need to learn how to eat good advice.

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2680889 -

We don't bother because they aren't making threats at us,

What "threats" were those? Precisely what threat was Iraq to the US?

they aren't paying suicide bombers

Do you have any solid, reliable independently verifiable evidence about the suicide bombers stuff? Like a precise figure of how many (if any) he actually paid any money to? Interviews with any of those who recieved the cheques and what they did with the money? Anything like that?

I've heard lots of stories about this but they remind me an awful lot of the WMD stories.

harboring terrorists

Which terrorists were those? What threat did they pose to the US? Was he harbouring anymore terrorists than any other country in the world? Do we invade Ireland because they are "harbouring terrorists"? How about South Africa? That place is led by a "terrorist". Israel has had several leaders who carried out terrorist atrocities.

What evil dictatorships are we giving the thumbs up to because they don't have oil?

US looks away as new ally tortures Islamists.

Uzbekistan's president steps up repression of opponents

Independent human rights groups estimate that there are more than 600 politically motivated arrests a year in Uzbekistan, and 6,500 political prisoners, some tortured to death. According to a forensic report commissioned by the British embassy, in August two prisoners were even boiled to death.

The US condemned this repression for many years. But since September 11 rewrote America's strategic interests in central Asia, the government of President Islam Karimov has become Washington's new best friend in the region.

The US is funding those it once condemned. Last year Washington gave Uzbekistan $500m (?300m) in aid. The police and intelligence services - which the state department's website says use "torture as a routine investigation technique" received $79m of this sum.

Hakimjon Noredinov, 68, agreed. He became a human rights activist after a morgue attendant brought him his eldest son, Nozemjon. He had been left for dead by the security service but was still alive despite having his skull fractured. Nozemjon is now 33, but screamed all night since they split his skull open. He is now in an asylum, Mr Noredinov said. "People's lives here are no better for US involvement," he said.

"Because of the US help, Karimov is getting richer and stronger."


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2683085 -

WHICH countries are so much worse than Iraq, besides Syria, North Korea, Iran, and Sudan, all of which the US is highly critical of as well? What evil dictatorships are we giving the thumbs up to because they don't have oil?

Turkey
Uzbekistan
Turzmekistan
Kyrgyzstan
Tajikistan

although, I should admit, that the *stans may actually have
their own oil, but are also critical to caspian sea pipelines.

they also may not be worse in terms of body count, but
are notoriously brutal states run by folks with a pension for
state murder and torture.

Turkey is the best example...

2nd largest arms client to the united states that uses most
of those arms to...drumroll...exterminate armenians and kurds.


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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Re: Surveys: More Iraqis Want Democracy [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2683806 -

Quote:
I disagree. I'm sure you'd have no problem finding those who still think a number of other systems would work better. You don't even have to leave this forum.




Yes... you will. Yet will the majority of the world want a democracy? There will always be those who want communism, but I have travelled to Mediterranean countries and as far down south as the Sahara, and I can tell you that the majority of the vast majority of people do want to live in a democracy from my experience, and I would guess the rest of the world. This survey is no surprise, and you probably would've had the same results if it was taken before the War on Iraq


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.

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General Interest > Political Discussion
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