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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Where does John Kerry stand?
    #2593571 - 04/23/04 03:23 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)


Pick a topic and go.

There aren't many are there.


It's too bad nobody better than Bush came along.  :nonono:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,712
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2593832 - 04/23/04 05:46 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Where does John Kerry stand?



Why.... that would depend on many things...
Where he is.
who he's talking to.
Who he's talking about.
What day it is.
What the moon phase is.
What side of the bed he got out of.
What he thinks he can get away with.... and so many more, including...
What his bankroll wife wants him to say.

If you don't like his stand on an issue.... wait 10 minutes.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleRavus
Not an EggshellWalker
 User Gallery

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 7,991
Loc: Cave of the Patriarchs
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2593841 - 04/23/04 05:57 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

It's better than Bush though, eh? At least with Kerry it's all dependent on chance; with Bush it's all anti drug militaristic liberty-grabbing rhetoric.

I'd rather gamble with my $100 bill than have it robbed from me, so to speak.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,712
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Ravus]
    #2593844 - 04/23/04 05:59 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

It's better than Bush though, eh?



Ummmm, no.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2593882 - 04/23/04 07:11 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

where does he stand? Hopefully in front of a train.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisiblewhiterasta
Day careobserver
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1,780
Loc: Oregon
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2594015 - 04/23/04 09:29 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

On feet that were in Viet Nam while GW was whiffing blow and AWOL.
Nuff Said?
Those that prefer the rhetoric of chicken hawks should have the opportunity to fight their battles instead of our children.For a group of men who mostly had excuses for NOT going to Viet Nam to be sending kids to war is BULLSHIT! Kerry is many things bad and good but do not even dare compare him with our quisling GW.Even if he hid in a fox hole for his whole tour(which he didn't)he is ten times the man GW is.
Personaly I do not LIKE Kerry but at least I see a man when I look at him, I look at GW and see a spoiled,smug child of enormous privelidge.
As far as politicly...The corporations decide policies not presidents any more so the more appropriate question is "Where do John Kerry's corporate backers stand?"We already know that Bush/Cheney are oil shills eh?
peace
WR


--------------------
To old for this place


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2594374 - 04/23/04 12:18 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Murex said:
Where does John Kerry stand?



On a teeter-totter, one leg on each side.

On a side note, I saw his picture on a box of waffles.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
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Registered: 05/10/03
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Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Evolving]
    #2594406 - 04/23/04 12:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

On a side note, I saw his picture on a box of waffles.




Plain or fruit?

I find it interesting that although most everyone agrees he can't be trusted to take a stand on issues, they still believe he'll be a better choice than Bush. How do they know?


--------------------
I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlinephi1618
old hand

Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 4,102
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2594415 - 04/23/04 12:32 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Kerry, like most democrats, is backed by unions and trial lawyers.

Thus, one of is positions is to change corporate tax laws to make it less advantageous for American corporations to ship jobs overseas. Right now, a corporation that makes money from products exported from another country doesn't have to pay taxes on that money untill it is brought back into the US. So, right now, many corporations have large amounts of money overseas that is likely to stay there, to avoid taxation. Kerry would give a grace period to bring that money in to the country, during which time it would be taxed at a lower rate (15% or so?). After that, all money made by export from other countries (by American corporations) would be subject to immediate tax.
The money that this program would bring in would, in part, be used to lower the tax rates on all american corporations. This program is designed to encourage corporations to keep jobs in the US by eliminating part of the incentive to ship them overseas. I'm not sure it's really a good idea, but it would probably accomplish its stated objective.

So, Kerry has stances on lots of other issues, but isn't really that well known yet. Bush is trying to define Kerry as a waffle who doesn't stand for anything at all, and keeps changing his mind. This isn't really the case, but is accepted by many because most people don't really know what he thinks, and so it sounds reasonable that he thinks nothing.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
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Registered: 05/10/03
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Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: phi1618]
    #2594441 - 04/23/04 12:39 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Bush has not tried to define Kerry, there's no need. He's merely pointed to his record.


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I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: HagbardCeline]
    #2594453 - 04/23/04 12:44 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Bush's record is horrible, I don't see how Kerry could be any worse, especially if an opposing party is in control of congress. It is a good idea to have opposing parties in the executive vs. legislative branches - checks and balances.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineMagus
Dazed

Registered: 01/28/04
Posts: 36
Loc: Midwest USA
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2594504 - 04/23/04 01:04 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Kerry is not worse! Where does he stand?

1. Bush supports loss of ALL federal financial aid for college if you get caught with even possession of 2 oz or less of marijuana!
/Kerry wants to probe into legalizing medical marijuana and abolishing the loss of federal aid!!!

2. Bush and Kerry's stances on the environment couldn't be more different! Kerry has a long record of looking out for good old mother Earth while Bush doesn't give a rip (ANWAR anyone?)

3. Bush's tax cuts go significantly in favor of the rich unless you are a 1 man, 1 woman, 2 children family of $40,000 a year. Other than that, the rich get proportionately way more. Additionally, Bush wants to repel the Estate Tax (which applies to estates worth only $1,000,000 or more, and which democrats are willing to raise to about $10,000,000), and turn income tax into a tax on Salary, while making investment income tax-free! For a middle class family, investments make up 20% versus 80% salary, lower class has almost 0% investments, and rich have over 50% investments! Who's going to benefit from no taxes on investments while passing $10,000,000+ estates to their children for free? Not 90% of Americans! Additionally, these tax cuts will do one of 2 things: 1. Pass the wonderful burden of a tremondous national debt to the America of 2040, or 2. Increase taxes and fees elsewhere, like State taxes, sales taxes, and college costs, etc. which will harm who? The middle class!
On the other hand, Kerry wants to repel all tax cuts on the wealthiest Americans and restructure the Bush's tax code to benefit the middle class. In fact, Bush's tax cut on the rich at the time of war leads to the last point:

Iraq. Kerry voted to authorize the war on Iraq because Bush lied and said they DEFINATELY HAVE WMD! Also, Kerry had reason to believe Bush was going to exaust weapon's inspectors and then build an international coalition. Bush fucked it up. So then what about the funding? Kerry voted to fund the troops by taking the burden off the middle class and repeling the rich tax cuts. When the republicans told him to fuck off, he voted against the bill to fund the troops to protest their irresponsible spending. (As a side note, had his vote been the difference between funding for soldiers and no funding, he would have voted in favor, but his vote against funding was more of a symbollic gesture).

TO ALL THOSE HE THINK HE IS A FLIP-FLOPPER:

YOUR MINDS ARE BEING CONTROLLED! For real! The Bushies have used the term "flip flopper" and like worded terms SO OFTEN it makes me sick. You know why they're doing that? Because it's easy to do to ANY senator, and because the repetition is a subtle form of BRAINWASHING. Just listen for those accusations in anti-Kerry ads and Bush public relations spokesman. It'll make you puke!

You must keep in mind that his stance on issues is being defined by the Bush administration as his votes on issues. This is COMPLETELY BOGUS! A lot of things work their way into bills that senators dont like... it's all strategic. It may be a source of funding (would you vote to give more money to preserve the everglades if the funding was going to come from a new oil rig operation in the Artic Wildlife Refuge that would be setup with the same bill???) He may look like a flip flopper but he's not.


--------------------
Disclaimer:

1. When I use the word "I", it means a friend of a friend wants me to ask. The word "I" simply cuts down on the amount of letters I need to type.

2. I do not engage in illegal activities. I am appaled by all of you and your apparent disregard for the law.


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Offlinephi1618
old hand

Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 4,102
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: HagbardCeline]
    #2594516 - 04/23/04 01:07 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I notice you don't mention a specific point. I suspect you have no idea what Kerry stands for, simply because you would prefer to buy the Bush line that he doesn't stand.

If I'm wrong, please start a thread to prove me wrong. I just put up a post addressing the Iraq war. If you want to talk about the PATRIOT Act (where he really made a mistake by voting for it, but did so under great pressure), sanctions in Cuba and his record on the Helms-Barton Act, or any other issue, then lets talk.

Just repeating an unqualified statement over and over is a good way to reinforce belief in that statement, but it is a bad way to get to the truth.


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Offlinephi1618
old hand

Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 4,102
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Magus]
    #2594526 - 04/23/04 01:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:


YOUR MINDS ARE BEING CONTROLLED! For real! The Bushies have used the term "flip flopper" and like worded terms SO OFTEN it makes me sick. You know why they're doing that? Because it's easy to do to ANY senator, and because the repetition is a subtle form of BRAINWASHING. Just listen for those accusations in anti-Kerry ads and Bush public relations spokesman. It'll make you puke!





YES!
This is what I am trying to say.


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Magus]
    #2594529 - 04/23/04 01:10 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

The envy argument (#3) doesn't work for me. It's not that taxes aren't high enough on people that make more money than you or I, it's that government spending is out of control especially when the same party controls the legislative and executive branches. I have no illusions that if Dumbocraps were in the same position as Repooplickens that we would be any better off, fiscally speaking - we wouldn't.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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InvisibleXochitl
synchronicitycircuit
Registered: 07/15/03
Posts: 1,241
Loc: the brainforest
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Murex]
    #2594774 - 04/23/04 02:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Where does John Kerry stand? http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/


--------------------
As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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OfflineHagbardCeline
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Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: phi1618]
    #2594821 - 04/23/04 02:44 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Certainly a reasonable request.  I'm always aprehensive of throwing up one-liners, it understandably creates the impression of a lack of insight or depth.  I mostly do it as an attempt at humor - Please refrain from criticism, my fragile ego can't handle it. :laugh:

I must make a trip to the office, though when I return I'll substantiate my claim.  If someone doesn't  adequately beat me to the punch first (then I'll just co-sign the post  :yesnod:).

Just repeating an unqualified statement over and over is a good way to reinforce belief in that statement, but it is a bad way to get to the truth.

WOW.  I couldn't agree more.  We'll touch on that too.


--------------------
I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
Male

Registered: 10/19/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: phi1618]
    #2595422 - 04/23/04 05:25 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

phi1618 writes:

Just repeating an unqualified statement over and over is a good way to reinforce belief in that statement, but it is a bad way to get to the truth.

You mean like Kerry's demonstrably false statements that the US economy is in the worst shape ever?

pinky


--------------------


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InvisibleXochitl
synchronicitycircuit
Registered: 07/15/03
Posts: 1,241
Loc: the brainforest
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Phred]
    #2595442 - 04/23/04 05:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

You mean like Kerry's demonstrably false statements that the US economy is in the worst shape ever?




Please provide references to where Kerry said the economy is "in the worst shape ever." Thanks.


--------------------
As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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InvisibleLucidDream
Hungry BlueFiend
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Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 1,488
Loc: Planet of the Stupid Peop...
Re: Where does John Kerry stand? [Re: Magus]
    #2595586 - 04/23/04 06:13 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Magus said:
YOUR MINDS ARE BEING CONTROLLED! For real! The Bushies have used the term "flip flopper" and like worded terms SO OFTEN it makes me sick...




$200 million buys a lot of propaganda. And there are a fair number of people on this board who lap it up with a smile and ask for more. It cracks me up to hear the GOP talking points spewed verbatim by people who like to pretend they think for themselves.

The whole flip-flop business is classic projection on the part of Flight-suit Boy anyway, but what is he gonna do but tar his opponent. He has NOTHING to run on. Jobs? Nope. Security? HA! He slept through 9-11. All he's good at is kicking sand in the faces of powerless has-been tyrants like Saddam. And he still has no clue what to do about Osama, who has been a free man for almost 900 days since 9-11. Anyone who can't imagine a better future than what Bush has to offer is just too fucking clueless to get it in the first place.


--------------------
Sarcasm just one of my many talents.



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