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Re: hi [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22903398 -

akira_akuma said:
$ is backed by 0 currency, therefore, to be paid for employment is to take money from a non-existent supply of currency derived of thin-air, and thus to be paid for employment i'd have to put myself in debt, to pay for the non-existent money i am owed, and using as fiat currency.

i'm not really going to be paid without my payment being backed by no currency, and therefore place me in debt for the money i am owed, whilst taking from a non-existent supply of fiat currency, and putting this fiat into trade; if that is the case, why would i pay taxes?

why should i.

i'm merely paying for my release from a non-existent debt.


Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
hostileuniverse said:
A flat tax would be much better.


A flat tax would be a HUGE burden on the bottom 50% of the country, and a HUGE break for the wealthy.

Why is so important to conservatives that more and more people be pushed into poverty?  :tongue:


Why is it so important for the liberals to confiscate everyone's wealth?

Every flat tax has cut offs, even progressive rates for incomes...


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http://www.countdowntotrump.com




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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22903440 -

hostileuniverse said:
Why is it so important for the liberals to confiscate everyone's wealth?


Because the rich are currently confiscating the wealth of the working class.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: hi [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #22903447 -

bingo.

PS: way to NOT address what i said, whilst misusing the quote, Hostile! :congrats:

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Re: hi [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #22903608 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
hostileuniverse said:
Why is it so important for the liberals to confiscate everyone's wealth?


Because the rich are currently confiscating the wealth of the working class.


No rich person has stolen from me, maybe you should call the cops:shrug:


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com




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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #22903628 -

It's not illegal for them to underpay me.  That's why I'm calling the Government.  :smirk:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22903630 -

first off: "confiscating wealth" is not what is happening here. i'm sure Falcon is just tired of dealing with your gymnastics and can't help himself to just start using your language to try and make a point to you, of course, in vain.

the "rich" aren't "confiscating" anything either. the rich are rigging the system. that's what they're doing.

and liberals have just as much tenacity in that department, as any conservative or republican, or democrat.

it's those who want the rigging to end -- those are the people who aren't running on the ovicidal tendencies of the super-entitled.

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Re: hi [Re: akira_akuma]
    #22903649 -

akira_akuma said:
the "rich" aren't "confiscating" anything either. the rich are rigging the system. that's what they're doing.



I thought that was the same thing?  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: hi [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #22903687 -

meh, i just don't want him thinking his language is prevalent to the discussion, so he can frame another rhetorical argument.

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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #22904531 -

hostileuniverse said:
Why is it so important for the liberals to confiscate everyone's wealth?




I def agree with akira and falcon above and would like to add that this is a wholly selfish way of looking at things. This view comes from the neo-libertarian viewpoint of negative liberty. It negates the fact that to reach these high points of wealth you rely on all of society in the first place.


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: hi [Re: airclay]
    #22904562 -

:awesomenod:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: hi [Re: airclay]
    #22904632 -

airclay said:
hostileuniverse said:
Why is it so important for the liberals to confiscate everyone's wealth?




I def agree with akira and falcon above and would like to add that this is a wholly selfish way of looking at things. This view comes from the neo-libertarian viewpoint of negative liberty. It negates the fact that to reach these high points of wealth you rely on all of society in the first place.


If all that was necessary for success was "society" wouldn't everyone then become wealthy? Everyone has the same opportunity as everyone else, give or take some small adbanyages or disadvantages... Only a few become wealthy because their smarter and work harder, not because "society" props them up...

Its a ridiculous assumption that because a business owner didn't build the roads to his business, that his business is then the result of "the state and society"


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com




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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22904643 -

society is a fiction. those in power CREATE society.

blaming "society" for propping anyone up is null, when you consider that it's not anyone's choice to prop anyone else but themselves up, but they HAVE TO prop SOMEONE ELSE UP, BY DESIGN. you can't vote YOURSELF into office.

...which is just merely an explanation, don't get crazy now.

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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22904752 -

hostileuniverse said:
Its a ridiculous assumption that because a business owner didn't build the roads to his business, that his business is then the result of "the state and society"



is it though? and even to not take it that far; it is fair to say that the business could not sustain itself at the level it pleases w/o the infrastructure that all of society provides.


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: hi [Re: akira_akuma]
    #22904758 -

akira_akuma said:
society is a fiction. those in power CREATE society.

blaming "society" for propping anyone up is null, when you consider that it's not anyone's choice to prop anyone else but themselves up, but they HAVE TO prop SOMEONE ELSE UP, BY DESIGN. you can't vote YOURSELF into office.

...which is just merely an explanation, don't get crazy now.


I kinda get it but don't can you expound?


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: hi [Re: airclay]
    #22904783 -

power structures. standing on the backs of giants. society is just a closed-end management, and "the power", the mutual fund. whoever gives you "the power", is really in power, but you're just a figurehead, to promote the experience; which is the experience of leading, and taking control of the power structure. which is a facade to have people working for you.

and in exchange, you get to control a certain percentage. it's basic business, but done in the way it was done before currency and systems.

before that it was mere promulgation, and assuming the role of 'leader' -- then appointing your second in command. it carries on from there and builds and builds.

even the relationship between two lovers...power struggle. dominance. being able to scout for further objectives past your lover to keep them IN CHECK, so they don't do EXACTLY the SAME THING. :wink:

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Re: hi [Re: airclay]
    #22904801 -

airclay said:
akira_akuma said:
society is a fiction. those in power CREATE society.

blaming "society" for propping anyone up is null, when you consider that it's not anyone's choice to prop anyone else but themselves up, but they HAVE TO prop SOMEONE ELSE UP, BY DESIGN. you can't vote YOURSELF into office.

...which is just merely an explanation, don't get crazy now.


I kinda get it but don't can you expound?


It basically means govt built a road, put cops on the street, and have a military to protect you from invasion. That means when you work 18 hours a day with little to show for it building a business, if you do become successful, the govt owns your ass and you should bow down to them


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com




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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #22904817 -

all basic conservatism^

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Re: hi [Re: akira_akuma]
    #22904856 -

akira_akuma said:
power structures. standing on the backs of giants. society is just a closed-end management, and "the power", the mutual fund. whoever gives you "the power", is really in power, but you're just a figurehead, to promote the experience; which is the experience of leading, and taking control of the power structure. which is a facade to have people working for you.

and in exchange, you get to control a certain percentage. it's basic business, but done in the way it was done before currency and systems.

before that it was mere promulgation, and assuming the role of 'leader' -- then appointing your second in command. it carries on from there and builds and builds.

even the relationship between two lovers...power struggle. dominance. being able to scout for further objectives past your lover to keep them IN CHECK, so they don't do EXACTLY the SAME THING. :wink:



this is interesting, I've generally considered all of society as just the web of inter-connectivity of people at all levels (state, media, personal, monetary). I've never really looked at it in this sort of, I'd say, Foucault lens.


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: hi [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #22904888 -

hostileuniverse said:
...govt built a road, put cops on the street, and have a military to protect you from invasion. That means if you do become successful, the govt owns your ass and you should bow down to them you should pay a little back in taxes to cover the roads, cops, protection, etc that allowed you to succeed.


This version is more honest.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: hi [Re: airclay] * 1
    #22904900 -

it sounds like Foucault. :lol:

i dunno, i do think that society might be one of those things that...we think it's one thing but it's many. like, as in, what we know as society now is exactly the robust definition of "society" that we've grown into, but not necessarily the origin of the concept.

like, maybe it existed as an even more robust concept, and we just broke it down to make it fit into the schema of the whole of classes, which had eventually broken out into civilization.

maybe what it meant before is something we are only now, these days, starting to come to understand -- i suppose philologically speaking, it's POSSIBLE.

but either way, that's how i see the...breakdown of the psycho-sociological aspects within the power structure, and how it's established. just based on my own human interactions and some odd information here or there. i really should study more on the subject, as it's quite interesting.

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