Crystal G said:

I consider myself pretty liberal, and this doesn't make any sense to me. If you give every single person 800 Euro's, then everything remains exactly the same as before.

The fuck????

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Prisoner#1 said:

Crystal G said:

I consider myself pretty liberal, and this doesn't make any sense to me. If you give every single person 800 Euro's, then everything remains exactly the same as before.

The fuck????

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what kind of change would come from giving it to only the poor, the ability for the
wealthy to get upset and say it's not fair that they poor get a stipend and they do
not. this is how socialism is actually supposed to work. it's genuine equality

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zappaisgod said:

Patlal said:

Well... When your nation is rich enough to be able to build that kind of safety net, you're doing something right and should definitely implement it.

It eliminates extreme poverty. That fact alone reduces crime, improve health, increases education. It's level up. The rest is just an increase in quality of life in general.

But yes, you will have to sacrifice roughly the cost of a new car through taxes every year if you're making good money

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Why should I have to sacrifice anything?

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sonamdrukpa said:

Outlaw308 said:

sonamdrukpa said:

I agree that war is never in the best interests of the people, but the boom in military spending during WWII and the Cold War did a lot economically for the U.S.

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What about Europe, though? How much was spent replacing indutrial equipment that would have been productive for years longer had it not been destroyed in the first place? How much was spent reconstructing homes, commercial properties, etc that could have been better spent on other areas of the economy? Yes, war is good for certain sectors, but it is never a net gain.

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Well of course.  But the argument was about the economic effectiveness of government spending and tax cuts, not whether militarism is good for the economy of the whole planet.

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zappaisgod said:

Patlal said:

Well... When your nation is rich enough to be able to build that kind of safety net, you're doing something right and should definitely implement it.

It eliminates extreme poverty. That fact alone reduces crime, improve health, increases education. It's level up. The rest is just an increase in quality of life in general.

But yes, you will have to sacrifice roughly the cost of a new car through taxes every year if you're making good money

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Why should I have to sacrifice anything?

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sonamdrukpa said:

Government debt is not some horrible thing and when people get up in arms about it it is generally hysterical nonsense.

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Outlaw308 said:

Yeah, I've never been able to wrap my mind around the logic that debt and deficit spending are good things.

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hostileuniverse said:

sonamdrukpa said:

Government debt is not some horrible thing and when people get up in arms about it it is generally hysterical nonsense.

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Tell that to Greece, their govt debt almost destroyed their country...

As for getting a check every month, why not? If you're gonna give out free money, give it to everyone, not just the poor...

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Prisoner#1 said:

Crystal G said:

I consider myself pretty liberal, and this doesn't make any sense to me. If you give every single person 800 Euro's, then everything remains exactly the same as before.

The fuck????

---

what kind of change would come from giving it to only the poor, the ability for the
wealthy to get upset and say it's not fair that they poor get a stipend and they do
not. this is how socialism is actually supposed to work. it's genuine equality

---

sonamdrukpa said:

Greece is an extreme case and was brought down the confluence of getting the worst of the global recession and France and Germany deciding that bailing out their retarded/evil banks was more important than the livelihoods of an entire country.  And then all that austerity BS was/is the cherry on top of a shit sundae.

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sonamdrukpa said:

Outlaw308 said:

Yeah, I've never been able to wrap my mind around the logic that debt and deficit spending are good things.

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Economics at massive scales is definitely a weird and completely unintuitive thing.

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DieCommie said:

Outlaw308 said:

Yeah, I've never been able to wrap my mind around the logic that debt and deficit spending are good things.

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Its not an all or nothing situation.  It can be good, it can be bad.  A country is not the same as a household and people often apply the principles of their household to a country.  A difference is that a country gets money if more money is spent by its people, a household gets money if less money is spent by its people.  I'm sure the austrian gold bugs will come marching in at this point...  So let me say that, though I do believe in the power of keynesian economics I also acknowledge that it has its limits.  The big limit I see that people of either side often neglect in economic discussions are ecological and environmental constraints.

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