airclay said:

developed countries around the world successfully using single payer systems with happy citizens and yet here in the US we've got internet dorks still crying about obamacare and calling politicians that describe these system jr high level names all the while claiming singe payer systems are a dream that'll never work

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airclay said:

yeah the best effort that could be put forth after the healthcare lobbyist demanded that everyone had to do it because otherwise people would just get healthcare when they were sick

put into place w/o all the editing and efforts to make it worthless, we'd have seen something much closer to a single payer system that doesn't resemble what we got after the gop lead congress and healthcare lobbyist gutted it.

also stop claiming to know exactly what the majority always wants, you're simply projecting your opinion.

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hostileuniverse said:

Liberal policies always fail, but instead of learning, they usually just double down on it.

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hostileuniverse said:

those European nations are struggling under the weight of their welfare systems, Greece was the first to fall, the others will too, it's a process and takes time depending on a number of factors

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starfire_xes said:

airclay said:

yeah the best effort that could be put forth after the healthcare lobbyist demanded that everyone had to do it because otherwise people would just get healthcare when they were sick

put into place w/o all the editing and efforts to make it worthless, we'd have seen something much closer to a single payer system that doesn't resemble what we got after the gop lead congress and healthcare lobbyist gutted it.

also stop claiming to know exactly what the majority always wants, you're simply projecting your opinion.

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Uh, the majority still oppose Obamacare--like they always have.  Please stop claiming you are intelligent, you are merely projecting your biased ignorace.

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

hostileuniverse said:

those European nations are struggling under the weight of their welfare systems, Greece was the first to fall, the others will too, it's a process and takes time depending on a number of factors

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Read my signature - it's always the same with conservatives:

"You just wait - in time liberal policies will fail."

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fivepointer said:

Obamacare has not failed.  Millions who could never afford health coverage are now covered.  They no longer have to choose between treating a health condition in the Emergency Room that leads to bankruptcy or possible death.

The Republicans in the 20 states that did not expand Medicaid have decided to throw millions of people under the bus for no good reason.  The Feds pick up the whole tab in the front years and 90% in later years.  After all is said and done it will cost the states net nothing.

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hostileuniverse said:

fivepointer said:

Obamacare has not failed.  Millions who could never afford health coverage are now covered.  They no longer have to choose between treating a health condition in the Emergency Room that leads to bankruptcy or possible death.

The Republicans in the 20 states that did not expand Medicaid have decided to throw millions of people under the bus for no good reason.  The Feds pick up the whole tab in the front years and 90% in later years.  After all is said and done it will cost the states net nothing.

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You really think that people that are poor can "afford" the insurance? Not even close, those that were too poor to afford insurance still can't, an 8000$ deductible is not something the poor can afford, regardless of how cheap the premiums are. Those who are dirt poor but don't qualify for Medicaid are worse off now because they have the penalties to pay at tax time.

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fivepointer said:

hostileuniverse said:

fivepointer said:

Obamacare has not failed.  Millions who could never afford health coverage are now covered.  They no longer have to choose between treating a health condition in the Emergency Room that leads to bankruptcy or possible death.

The Republicans in the 20 states that did not expand Medicaid have decided to throw millions of people under the bus for no good reason.  The Feds pick up the whole tab in the front years and 90% in later years.  After all is said and done it will cost the states net nothing.

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You really think that people that are poor can "afford" the insurance? Not even close, those that were too poor to afford insurance still can't, an 8000$ deductible is not something the poor can afford, regardless of how cheap the premiums are. Those who are dirt poor but don't qualify for Medicaid are worse off now because they have the penalties to pay at tax time.

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Yes it is affordable after the subsidies and cost sharing reductions.

Based on the second lowest cost Silver plan premium as a percent of Income:
0 to 133% 0% of income (Medicaid, if your state expanded)
Up to 133% FPL 2% of income
133-150% FPL 3 – 4% of income
150-200% FPL 4 – 6.3% of income
200-250% FPL 6.3 – 8.05% of income
250-300% FPL 8.05 – 9.5% of income
300-400% FPL 9.5% of income

There is no penalty if your retarded state did not expand Medicaid and you fall into the the gap they created since coverage would not be affordable there is no penalty.

Also Silver plans have substantial cost sharing reductions for those up to 250% FPL.

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You are only addressing penalties and premiums, care to address the deductibles?

hostileuniverse said:

The very thing libs here are trying to do have failed in Greece and Venezuela, and what about Cuba? Free healthcare, free education, do you want to live in a shithole???

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hostileuniverse said:

fivepointer said:

hostileuniverse said:

fivepointer said:

Obamacare has not failed.  Millions who could never afford health coverage are now covered.  They no longer have to choose between treating a health condition in the Emergency Room that leads to bankruptcy or possible death.

The Republicans in the 20 states that did not expand Medicaid have decided to throw millions of people under the bus for no good reason.  The Feds pick up the whole tab in the front years and 90% in later years.  After all is said and done it will cost the states net nothing.

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You really think that people that are poor can "afford" the insurance? Not even close, those that were too poor to afford insurance still can't, an 8000$ deductible is not something the poor can afford, regardless of how cheap the premiums are. Those who are dirt poor but don't qualify for Medicaid are worse off now because they have the penalties to pay at tax time.

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Yes it is affordable after the subsidies and cost sharing reductions.

Based on the second lowest cost Silver plan premium as a percent of Income:
0 to 133% 0% of income (Medicaid, if your state expanded)
Up to 133% FPL 2% of income
133-150% FPL 3 – 4% of income
150-200% FPL 4 – 6.3% of income
200-250% FPL 6.3 – 8.05% of income
250-300% FPL 8.05 – 9.5% of income
300-400% FPL 9.5% of income

There is no penalty if your retarded state did not expand Medicaid and you fall into the the gap they created since coverage would not be affordable there is no penalty.

Also Silver plans have substantial cost sharing reductions for those up to 250% FPL.

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You are only addressing penalties and premiums, care to address the deductibles?

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