mikeisapro said:

Would you respect my belief that an invisible dragon shits on my house every day at 3:00pm?

Not all beliefs deserve respect. My example there is a lot less harmful than religious beliefs, too.

---

THIS!!
I'm sick of people being so PC "ohh, we have to respect all beliefs" Genital mutilation in Africa is part of their "beliefs". Muslim women in Saudi Arabia have to have the permission of their husbands to do pretty much anything - but that's just their "beliefs" right? 

Kamikaze said:

mikeisapro said:

Would you respect my belief that an invisible dragon shits on my house every day at 3:00pm?

Not all beliefs deserve respect. My example there is a lot less harmful than religious beliefs, too.

---

THIS!!
I'm sick of people being so PC "ohh, we have to respect all beliefs" Genital mutilation in Africa is part of their "beliefs". Muslim women in Saudi Arabia have to have the permission of their husbands to do pretty much anything - but that's just their "beliefs" right? 

---

Genital mutilation happens here in America to.  Let's derail this thread and talk about circumcision.

Kamikaze said:

mikeisapro said:

Would you respect my belief that an invisible dragon shits on my house every day at 3:00pm?

Not all beliefs deserve respect. My example there is a lot less harmful than religious beliefs, too.

---

THIS!!
I'm sick of people being so PC "ohh, we have to respect all beliefs" Genital mutilation in Africa is part of their "beliefs". Muslim women in Saudi Arabia have to have the permission of their husbands to do pretty much anything - but that's just their "beliefs" right? 

---

DivineIntensity said:

Kamikaze said:

mikeisapro said:

Would you respect my belief that an invisible dragon shits on my house every day at 3:00pm?

Not all beliefs deserve respect. My example there is a lot less harmful than religious beliefs, too.

---

THIS!!
I'm sick of people being so PC "ohh, we have to respect all beliefs" Genital mutilation in Africa is part of their "beliefs". Muslim women in Saudi Arabia have to have the permission of their husbands to do pretty much anything - but that's just their "beliefs" right? 

---

There's a difference between the mainstream Christian and the average Christian. The mainstreams you see on Tv the crazies yelling "God hates fags" are not the majority.

They believe a dude came to save them from hell, and they try an tell you so you don't go to hell. Not many of them are overbearing and shove it down your throat bible thumpers.

What else are Christians really guilty of? All the level headed people from my Church are pro-choice, don't have anything against gays, and are just to ignorant to form an opinion on drugs.

That's so much different from genital mutilation and having women basically be servants. It's not even a comparison...

And to be honest conversion from Christianity to Agnosticism/atheism isn't so "liberating" when you think you've had someone to talk to your whole life who's helped you through everything.

I've never felt so alone than the minute I became agnostic..

And I'm pretty sure most of my family can't handle the non-existence of God, or the fact that they might not live forever. So, you suggest that I try and swipe that from them for no reason whatsoever other than self-gratification?

No thanks.

---

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

mikeisapro said:

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

So what if they are liberal? Do they believe the bible is the literal word of god and everything in it is gods pure truth? Probably.

At the very least, they believe in a god with rules who sacrificed his son in the flesh to save his own creations from eternal damnation?

How level headed are they, really?

---

DivineIntensity said:

Going with the majority? This only applies to my family - My friends know that I'm not religious.

And I'm a liberal, and again read what I said about most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Dude I totally hear you DI, 100%.  Like I find all of your experiences to be strangely similar to my own

I just took a shower and got to thinking,

How advanced is our communication now, really?

As far as instructions go, describing things, etc, our communication is about as good as it gets.  5 minutes.  10 miles.  Half a tablespoon.  All exacts, can't really be interpreted wrong, etc.  It's why our systemic society functions so well I bet.

Now get to ideas, thoughts, feelings.  I can do a decent job at explaining to people how to throw a football, or how to do their work correctly at my job, or the number of times I've smoked weed in the last 3 days.  Now it gets incredibly more difficult when I have to describe my FEELINGS, or complex IDEAS I've had to others.  I've felt "WHOOSH WHOOSH WHOOSH ~build it up~ crack snap" on intense acid trips.  To someone that hasn't taken acid, they have NO IDEA what the fuck that means.  To someone who has done LSD, they still might have no idea wtf that means..  Or my feelings, explaining how I feel about certain people, how I "feel" about certain ideas, objects, laws, etc.. I could say one thing and it can be seen a hundred different ways by a hundred different people with a hundred different contexts, based on their own ways of being brought up, their own intelligence, their own application, etc.

I learn the most from this I think just trying to describe the way I feel to certain women.  Some of them will just go nuts over the things I say and I don't even know how lol, but it's a combination of all the things that make communication what it is, past just simple words with simple meaning.

I mean we all even know one statement can have 2 completely different interpretations, all based on context.  Things written in text can so easily be taken out of context and I don't know if people even realize how often this really happens.

~~

Just got done eating Easter dinner with the family.. while the rents prayed I sat there silently with my head down as usual.  Then I went HAAM on a very large meal and now I'm super full.  If it wasn't for religion, I wouldn't get big awesome meals on Holidays

Then again, maybe I'd get big awesome meals on random days instead

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

Lol the irony,

what i've been typing up over the last half hour could be summarized ^^

OP acts as he should around the Christians he knows, just like I do, and we all get alone.

Kamikaze is more of a bitch to the Christians she knows, but it's justified since they are in turn more irrational than most.




In the end, the world still spins.

Happy Easter everyone!

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

I understand where you're coming from honestly.

It's just I used to be Christian and I saw how the majority of them were and to see them get bunched up with the  fundy westboro baptist type Christians irks me.

And I didn't mean to come off as offensive if I did by the way

extreme said:

DivineIntensity said:

Going with the majority? This only applies to my family - My friends know that I'm not religious.

And I'm a liberal, and again read what I said about most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Dude I totally hear you DI, 100%.  Like I find all of your experiences to be strangely similar to my own

I just took a shower and got to thinking,

How advanced is our communication now, really?

As far as instructions go, describing things, etc, our communication is about as good as it gets.  5 minutes.  10 miles.  Half a tablespoon.  All exacts, can't really be interpreted wrong, etc.  It's why our systemic society functions so well I bet.

Now get to ideas, thoughts, feelings.  I can do a decent job at explaining to people how to throw a football, or how to do their work correctly at my job, or the number of times I've smoked weed in the last 3 days.  Now it gets incredibly more difficult when I have to describe my FEELINGS, or complex IDEAS I've had to others.  I've felt "WHOOSH WHOOSH WHOOSH ~build it up~ crack snap" on intense acid trips.  To someone that hasn't taken acid, they have NO IDEA what the fuck that means.  To someone who has done LSD, they still might have no idea wtf that means..  Or my feelings, explaining how I feel about certain people, how I "feel" about certain ideas, objects, laws, etc.. I could say one thing and it can be seen a hundred different ways by a hundred different people with a hundred different contexts, based on their own ways of being brought up, their own intelligence, their own application, etc.

I learn the most from this I think just trying to describe the way I feel to certain women.  Some of them will just go nuts over the things I say and I don't even know how lol, but it's a combination of all the things that make communication what it is, past just simple words with simple meaning.

I mean we all even know one statement can have 2 completely different interpretations, all based on context.  Things written in text can so easily be taken out of context and I don't know if people even realize how often this really happens.

~~

Just got done eating Easter dinner with the family.. while the rents prayed I sat there silently with my head down as usual.  Then I went HAAM on a very large meal and now I'm super full.  If it wasn't for religion, I wouldn't get big awesome meals on Holidays

Then again, maybe I'd get big awesome meals on random days instead

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

Lol the irony,

what i've been typing up over the last half hour could be summarized ^^

OP acts as he should around the Christians he knows, just like I do, and we all get alone.

Kamikaze is more of a bitch to the Christians she knows, but it's justified since they are in turn more irrational than most.




In the end, the world still spins.

Happy Easter everyone!

---

Sounds a lot like de-constructionism It's a pretty interesting topic  but I don't know much about it.

And happy easter to you to buddy

mikeisapro said:

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

So what if they are liberal? Do they believe the bible is the literal word of god and everything in it is gods pure truth? Probably.

At the very least, they believe in a god with rules who sacrificed his son in the flesh to save his own creations from eternal damnation?

How level headed are they, really?

---

You know how many religious people live in this world of ours, right?

And when you've only been taught ONE way since the day you were born, what you believe, no matter how crazy, doesn't seem THAT crazy.

Again, this is a fucking psychedelic community.  Psychs are pretty awesome tools for showing individuals how conditioning/decondintioning works.  Most "ignorant/stupid" believers have been conditioned to think one way and have never had the opportunity, or will, to be deconditioned.  Just let 'em live with their beliefs for now IMO.  You can call it stupid, and honestly the way their beliefs effect others is 10x more important than WHAT they actually believe, but I think we're best off changing the things that actually matter first, and then letting people believe what they want can just follow suit

DivineIntensity said:

Sounds a lot like de-constructionism It's a pretty interesting topic  but I don't know much about it.

And happy easter to you to buddy

---

The only things I know about it are the things my first hand experiences have taught me

And thanks!

DivineIntensity said:

mikeisapro said:

Kamikaze said:

DivineIntensity said:

most of the Christians I know being level headed and being, Pro-choice, and being completely fine with gay marriage.

---

Ok, well good for you then. Most of the Christians I know aren't. Since I'm surrounded by irrationally conservative Christians, I feel it's important to stick to my beliefs

---

So what if they are liberal? Do they believe the bible is the literal word of god and everything in it is gods pure truth? Probably.

At the very least, they believe in a god with rules who sacrificed his son in the flesh to save his own creations from eternal damnation?

How level headed are they, really?

---

Is that affecting you? If they're not limiting scientific research or shoving shit down your throat, what is the point of honestly trying to take away their faith?

Just so you can pat yourself on the back for proving you were right?

I just don't understand it, I really don't. It's cruel in a sense...

And a lot of them have varying beliefs, from literal interpretation to metaphorical - from Armenian to Calvinist etc etc.

---

qman said:

A question to the OP, how much longer will you live the "lie" in front of your parents? 

I understand wanting to protect your parents feelings, but you also have feelings and beliefs.

At some point down the road, this information about your beliefs will surface, so you will have to face the music.

Do you think your parents would really want you to live a "lie" by going through the motions to keep them happy?  I don't think so.

---

Don't be so sure.. they just might be happier thinking their baby will always be by their side into infinity and beyond, rather than maybe just the next ~50 years or so when they both part ways to two distinctly different forms of life-after-death

One of my really close friends is a pretty recently turned atheist, but he still hides it from his mom, at least until he moves out.  He's not going to put that on her right now.  The link below is a link he showed me a few days ago.. linked it to me since we had talked about similar things about a week ago

I mean really think about it.  Maybe half the people here don't even have a concept of heaven, but just PRETEND it's real.  Pretend it's super awesome, and all of your best friends and family will be there.  Pretend one of your kids, siblings, parents, best friends, spouse, etc, that you love dearly doesn't share the same beliefs, which according to your belief system, will separate you for eternity.  Honestly it doesn't make sense, but if it did and it was true, that would really really suck I would imagine.  Heaven wouldn't even feel "complete" I don't think.  Now for the people who really believe this though, this is devastating to them!!!  This is a really hard concept for them to get over, as it's a pretty large implication

http://imgur.com/RWlb6

Guess we'll find out when we die

And dude DI like I realllllllllyyy hear you man, even with your mom and how it's the one thing that has kept her going too.  SAME WITH MY MOM

My mother is an amazing human being.  She's just really ignorant too

Seriously isn't always that easy