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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: realfuzzhead]
    #15045961 -

They're all puppets. In representative government, politicians are SUPPOSED TO BE PUPPETS. The problem right now is that all the wrong hands are up those puppets' asses.

Now, I can't see for myself what invisible hands are up Obama's ass, but AFAIK his biggest contributors are universities and unions, and he does not have any wealthy business connections to whom he is serving work on a platter. Remember Bush and all his Halliburton and oil connections that so conveniently got so many billions of our tax dollars reconstructing Iraq? Again, and again, and again? Conflict of interest much? Obama has no such baggage. I've heard a lot of vague conspiracy theories but no solid evidence of how Obama is in his job to do anything but represent the sheep who elected him in a den of wolves.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #15046047 -

Not sure the legitamecy of this but someone's claiming they supposedly muted Ron Paul's appluase at the debate.  would not be surprised though.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Libertarian/comments/k8a07/im_an_audio_engineer_ive_done_live_shows_and_i/

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: skatealex2]
    #15046059 -

Now I want to watch this goddamned thing.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance] * 1
    #15046102 -

The hands up his ass are the banks, the same banks who are up all the other politicians asses. Yeah, universities and unions may give him a large portion of his campaign funds, but it goes deeper than that. It's the same banking institution that owns the media that will convince universities and unions that this or that politician has any merit to be a senator, representative or president. I'm not saying it's a scam by any means, but it is most definitely a very carefully controlled process.

The banks own the universities. They own the companies. They own the media. They own the means of control and use their influence in very indirect ways that wont be seen directly.

In 2007, when Bush was still president and the election was coming up, after the primaries you had two people to pick from like in any election. Once the primaries are done with, and you have two candidates that are completely under the banks whim, it doesn't really matter who wins from there. Cue in Obama and McCain, the two most influential members of the Senate during the election period (mostly because they were the presidential candidates, but they were chosen by the banks for bigger reasons). All of a sudden you see that banks are about to fall under, that war zones haven't been completely controlled, that the entire means of production and stability are in danger of collapsing. The banks need to be bailed out, but neither side in congress or the senate is ready to do that because of what it might mean for their political goals.

In order for them to get government money to prop their banking institutions up, they need to convince both the republican and democrats to vote yes on the bills that will allow the money to be spent. So both McCain and Obama get enormous campaign contributions from the very banks that were about to go bankrupt. And then both senators take a break from their campaigns and vote yes on the bailout bill that then convinces everyone in their respective parties to vote along those lines as well.

There, all of a sudden the bank bailout is no longer an issue of debate during the election, no longer a hot topic for either side, and not the main focus of the election. Instead, any and all criticism of the bailout goes to Bush, who only has a few months left anyway.

It's all a very delicate, finely tuned balance. I'm not talking of some illuminati New World Order crap, this is simply how politics works. Presidents, Senators, Congressmen and Judges generally don't know how far their being controlled (though they do know it). They are just as much pawns in the game as voters are. It's all about who controls the money, and therefore the influence to decide what we focus on from day to day.

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: PatrickKn]
    #15046141 -

I can't really argue with much you just said. :shrug:

The only part that confuses me is the idea that Obama and McCain would receive contributions from the banks and then immediately turn around to bilaterally influence all of congress to throw money at the banks. There's no doubt the influence of the banks is inescapable, but that idea seems pretty far-fetched to me. Both were already very well-off financially before that point so the campaign contributions couldn't have been such a powerful motivator, and furthermore I just can't see all of congress just jumping off the cliff with the two presidential candidates like a bunch of lemmings.

I could definitely be wrong, though. I learn more about the process every day. I'm sure I haven't learned to recognize more of the patterns at play than I have.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #15046260 -

I saw a comment in this article- http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0911/62934.html ; Maybe Ron Paul is right, if the TSA didn't exist maybe 9/11 wouldn't of happened.




"xstek99
Party: Tea Party
Reply #1
Sep. 7, 2011 - 9:27 PM EST
I'm a pilot, and an important feature of FAA Part 91 for private pilots is that the pilot is recommended to have a weapon and a survival kit, for the benefit of his passengers. Still a good idea. Another feature is the pilot has the responsibility not to transport a dangerous person, in his own judgment."

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #15046266 -

You have to realize it's not just through the single campaign contributions though. It's for just about everything they want to get done politically even when they become president, well into their presidency. If they want the influence, they need the funds. If they (presidential candidates turned presidents) want to convince the American people to go one way so that even congress will agree with them, they need the money to do so.

Now I can't sit here and bullshit saying that there are backdoor deals involving the president with some banking exec and their sipping on scotch deciding how to take over certain areas, making trades. I don't see it as going that way. It's too obvious. It's not supportable. It's bound to get you caught for corruption.

Instead, I believe anyone who gets into a high profile position comes to realize this and either plays into the game or goes down in history as a horrible politician (because they will be if they don't play into the bigger game), doesn't get a long career, is erased from memory.

If they prove to be too troublesome, too effective in fighting against that system, too popular to erase from memory, too far down, then yes, assassination, rebel warfare, etc... through fringe groups you as that banking institution purposely created for just that moment. People who don't even like the system play a part in it too.

It's much bigger than just the US. It's most of the world. It's more of a system than it is any one person or group doing it too. It's just what money does. I don't necessarily agree or disagree with it either. It just is what it is.

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: PatrickKn]
    #15046300 -

I don't think that type of backdoor shenanigans actually gets people in trouble, though. Again, look at Bush. Two terms. Though I suppose it's possible that Bush supported his contracting buddies at the expense of the taxpayer through sheer manipulation and gullibility and not through any kind of sinister hot-tub scotch party.

But once again, I think it's fairly clear Obama doesn't run that kind of ship. He's well-established and well-connected, and there's no doubt he is playing the game, but I can't see any clear pattern of cronyism or abuse in his administration. There's no doubt that he is in charge of his administration, even if he is sorely lacking in influence over the rest of the government.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: PatrickKn] * 1
    #15046303 -

I liked hermain cain. idk, I just like the way he sort of cut the bullshit in his responses. I like his delivery.


plus back to back black presidents??






















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Trippin? Click Me...... Me too!


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Anthony]
    #15046310 -

God, would it be strange if Cain were elected president. He's actually blacker than Obama, yet more of an oreo.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #15046327 -

Tchan909 said:
I don't think that type of backdoor shenanigans actually gets people in trouble, though. Again, look at Bush. Two terms. Though I suppose it's possible that Bush supported his contracting buddies at the expense of the taxpayer through sheer manipulation and gullibility and not through any kind of sinister hot-tub scotch party.

But once again, I think it's fairly clear Obama doesn't run that kind of ship. He's well-established and well-connected, and there's no doubt he is playing the game, but I can't see any clear pattern of cronyism or abuse in his administration. There's no doubt that he is in charge of his administration, even if he is sorely lacking in influence over the rest of the government.


No doubt, I agree. However, I would say the exact same thing about Bush (or if you see Bush as corrupt, then I see Obama as just as corrupt). What I'm getting at, is that their ideas are largely controlled by a banking system that polarizes the politics of a country right into their control. Democrats and Republicans, while seemingly ideologically polarized, are realistically the same ideologies put into different wordings. Sure, they might argue about where to allocate money every once in a while, but they will ultimately fight the same wars, support the same corporate systems and teach the next generation to do the same. Those arguments about where to allocate what never get anywhere because the ultimate goal is truly the medium between the two ideas. Not every republican idea and not every democratic idea is a good one, there needs to be balance without a war in order to perpetuate the control over a society. 

It all comes down to consumerism and happiness. Keeping the peace within the boundaries of control really. As long as people are fed, they honestly don't have much to complain about, or at least wont go through civil war to fight about it. I can't say that I ultimately disagree with this system simply because I can't deny that I would be any happier outside of it, despite the bad things it causes.

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: realfuzzhead]
    #15046345 -

realfuzzhead said:
he's a puppet, seriously man


who again?

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: PatrickKn]
    #15046348 -

I do take it for granted that business has far too much influence over the entire political dialogue. Where we once had government by the people, for the people, we now have government by the business owners, for the people. It's being increasingly used as a tool of subjugation by a highly gentrified ruling class.

Obama is by no means immune to that influence, but my point is that it stops there. He works very honestly within the dishonest confines of his work. He's not invading countries on the other side of the world and then hiring his buddies to reconstruct on the dollar of the majority of taxpayers who were opposed to the whole thing. (You can't possibly blame that one on the banks, it comes from an ingrained culture of cronyism and exploitation.) Obama's not perfect but IMO he's doing the best job he can.

My mom compared him to Jimmy Carter. I see where she's coming from but I hope it doesn't mean he won't serve a second term.


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #15046351 -

That's true^

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Re: Anyone Watching the Republican Debate? [Re: skatealex2]
    #15047629 -

skatealex2 said:
Not sure the legitamecy of this but someone's claiming they supposedly muted Ron Paul's appluase at the debate.  would not be surprised though.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Libertarian/comments/k8a07/im_an_audio_engineer_ive_done_live_shows_and_i/


I do remember that blatantly happening at one point.  It was a 'what the fuck?' moment for me for sure.

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