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Vegetarian protein intake?
    #14945504 -

I would just like to get some facts, please. From unbiased opinions and publications. I have both sides of the arguement, arguing with me, but no one seems to be able to provide any factual proof that either; A) Veggies *can* get plenty of protein, or that B) They cannot.

Well which is it? From my own research and opinions, the human body most certainly *can* survive on a proper veggie/vegan diet.

But I could be wrong. Probably missing a lot of variables. So, which is it hivemind?


:bliss:


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"One has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws. I would agree with St. Augustine that, an unjust law is no law at all.” -- Martin Luther King Jr.

"Seek not abroad, turn back into thyself, for in the inner man dwells the truth." -- St. Augustine

Edited by urbanwolf (08/19/11 01:56 AM)

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: urbanwolf]
    #14945519 -

See Book: "The China Study"

Yea, vegetarians can get plenty protein from non animal sources, but not if you a lazy ass sweet toothed vegetarian I guess.


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:huxleyfacepalm:


Plant Trees

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: Nymphaea]
    #14945568 -

That's a great publication, lots of info here to dig through. Thank you!

Still, I'm sure the opposite team has some great sources too. :popcorn:


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"One has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws. I would agree with St. Augustine that, an unjust law is no law at all.” -- Martin Luther King Jr.

"Seek not abroad, turn back into thyself, for in the inner man dwells the truth." -- St. Augustine

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: urbanwolf]
    #14945657 -

Yes veggies have plenty of protein, the only predicament tho is tha you're not getting your essential amino acids that make the proteins complete and useable by your body. There are some ways to do it, but I can't remember. If you are vegan, you are hard pressed to be healthy unless you know what foods have the 8 EAAs which are required for proper body function. I think it would be healthier if you ate all veggies +fish or something, cuz come on, fish aren't real people.


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I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: fngbronco]
    #14945834 -

I gotta hand it to vegetarians and vegans. Its not a war or anything imo. I commend you for having the will power not to eat meat. I just enjoy it too much to give up. Maybe in another in another universe, cows eat humans, I just hope they make my death quick and painless as possible, as I would theirs.

Ive heard soybeans are an excellent source of protein, though they might slightly raise estrogen when consumed in large quantities consistently. I mean obviously people do it all the time. I know the guy from rage against the machine, the bass player, who was cut like a motherfucker, was a vegetarian, and ate like a monster


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notapillow said: "you are going about this endeavor all wrong. clear your mind of useless fear and concern. buy the ticket, take the ride, and all that.... "

ChrisWho said: "It's all about the journey, not the destination."

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: Mickalopagus]
    #14946230 -

I've always heard soy was not a good source of protein, something to do with poor bioavailability and the promotion of estrogen.

Try adding Hemp seeds and quinoa to your diet. They are the two plant based sources of all 8 essential amino acids that i am familiar with. There are also ways of combining foods (like rice and beans) in order to take two incomplete proteins and have your body make it into a complete protein.

Eggs are a fantastic source of protein if your a lacto-ovo vegetarian? Fish is great for those amino acids..

Google Mike Mahler - he's a vegan strength trainer and has written extensively on the topic of vegetarian nutrition.

Lastly, VEGA makes a vegetarian protein supplement.


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GO OUTSIDE.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: PDU]
    #14946707 -

Hemp seeds and quinoa are very good foods for vegetarians, and vegans for that matter.

I am picking up a book soon called "the live food factor" which will in some ways aid me in my vegetarianism. Though I am not full vegetarian because you can not get properly usable sources of vitamin b12 according to my research.

I eat meat or eggs between 2 and 10 times a week, usually on the lower scale, though if I buy fresh meat and eggs I can't waste them :smile:


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The future is an untold circumstance like the next page in a book. And skipping ahead would throw off the entire flow of its existence.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: TRyTOfind]
    #14947186 -

I was going to mention quinoa.  I think it's the only vegetarian complete protein source, meaning it has everything you need from one source.  I don't know of the bioavailability. 

But you don't need to get all your amino acids from one food source.  For example, if you eat beans with rice, the proteins in those two different sources combine to make a complete protein.  You don't even need to combine in the same meal.  I read somewhere that you can make proteins complete by combining food sources over several meals.

You're body doesn't need a huge amount of protein to survive.  I think the WHO said 5% of your diet is adequate.  You can easily get that much and more as a vegetarian with just a little planning.


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No knowledge can be certain, if it is not based
upon mathematics or upon some other knowledge
which is itself based upon the mathematical
sciences.  -Leonardo da Vinci (1425-1519)

Speak well of your enemies.  After all, you made them.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: pothead_bob]
    #14947527 -

^ knows what he is talking about


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The future is an untold circumstance like the next page in a book. And skipping ahead would throw off the entire flow of its existence.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: TRyTOfind]
    #14949545 -

i wouldn't be too concerned about your protein intake unless your going through a growth period e.g. childhood, adolsecence or pregnancy. the quality of protein from plants is said to be less than than of animal sources because individual plant amino acid composition isn't as close a match to the bodies requirement as aminal sources are. grains are a good source of methionine and tryptophan but fall short of isoleucine and lysine. legumes are the opposite, being a poor source of methionine and tryptophan but a good source of isoleucine and lysine. as mentioned above comsuming both regularly (but not necessarily at the same time) will take care of most of your protein needs. the only other amino acid you really need to consider is threonine which can be obtained from nuts, lentils and sesame seeds.

combine a mix of grains, legumes, nuts and seeds and fresh vegetables and fruit in your diet and you'll be fine.


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If you drink much from a bottle marked 'poison' it is almost certain to disagree with you sooner or later

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: atom_boy]
    #14966541 -

Vegetables have a surprisingly high amount of protein to calorie ratio.  You kinda need to eat a shit ton of veggies to get enough calories, but if you do you'll probably have enough or close to enough protein for the day.

I also eat fish, so I'm not completely veggie.


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:huxleyfacepalm:


Plant Trees

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: Nymphaea]
    #14971368 -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_protein

Wikipedia is your friend.  Even contains a list:

Quote:
Some foods contain all the essential amino acids on their own in a sufficient amount to qualify as a "complete protein". Complete protein foods that also obtain the highest possible PDCAAS score of 1.0 are certain dairy products (including whey), egg whites, and soy protein isolate. Other foods, such as amaranth, Aphanizomenon flos-aquae[citation needed], buckwheat, hempseed, meat, poultry, soybeans, quinoa, seafood, and spirulina also are complete protein foods, but may not obtain a PDCAAS score of 1.0.[1][6]


Also, the "3 sisters" where very important to the Americas pre-Columbus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Sisters_(agriculture)

Interesting way of approaching both vegetarianism and gardening.

www.nutsonline.com

A great site for nuts and snacks (good price for hempseeds).  They even trow in a random sample of something with each order.  Don't want to sound like I'm advertising them, or anything, just recommend them highly from personal experience.  I can also "refer" you for a 10% discount for me and anyone who is interested.  :pm:


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"Sacrifice is the Christian way of life.  Theft is the Socialist way of achieving all ends.  Together they represent an awesome evil for this nation to confront."  Marc Emery.

People who receive medical cannabis trough the federal government.

Edited by MidRange (08/24/11 02:52 PM)

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: MidRange]
    #14988310 -

It makes me laugh when people are asking "how do I get this vitamin? " what about the omegas?"(great question, but usually it's coming from someone trying to persecute you for being vegan or whatever)... psh. Most people I know don't give a fuck what they eat. A steady diet of mcdonalds and taco bell. It' ironic how those junk food eaters are the ones busting my balls with the "you don't get enough protein bro".

If you are going to stop eating meat and dairy, just be sure to eat well round. Not just beans and you will be fine.

I know tons of vegans and along with myself, we have never worried about getting this or that in our diets. We are all healthy and active people. I know 90% of vegans don't have a total perfect diet, but who in the hell does ?  Even if you are lacking some amino's and omegas's, it sure beats the hell out of living off of mcdonalds.

I hope you follow through with this. Instead of trying to stop eating meat, you should stop eating dairy. Dairy is complete shit and I feel bad for people who drink milk and scarf cheese. I wish you would give being "vegan" a shot. That would kick ass !

Try it for a couple of months and if you don't like it then just go back to your other diet. whats the worst that could happen ? :ripebanana:

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: CounterCulturest]
    #14988556 -

something to consider when you start recommending veganism to people: if you are going to stop eating animal products entirely you MUST eat b12 fortified foods of take a supplement as this vitammin can only be obtained naturally in the diet from animal products.


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If you drink much from a bottle marked 'poison' it is almost certain to disagree with you sooner or later

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: atom_boy]
    #14988759 -

Most vegans make good use of nutritional yeast, a non-animal source of B12. Soy milk and many processed vegan foods tend to be fortified with B12.

As for protein, it's actually difficult not to get enough protein unless you eat mostly junk food or you just don't eat enough food. Nearly all whole plant foods have a greater proportion of calories from protein than the recommended proportion of protein intake.

OP, if you're concerned about amino acid proportions, (although I think the issue is overstated) this site shows you what foods contain (or lack) which, and you can click a link to find other foods that complement the amino acid balance.

It is not difficult to make a vegetarian or vegan diet work, if you do a bit of research. So good on you.


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Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #14988866 -

The protein isn't an issue with you veggies, it is the amino acids required to make them useable where they need to be (as whiskey addressed) in order to be utilized by the body. Protein synthesis is pretty amazing stuff.

Don't bag my McDonald's either, it's a great anti constipation tool, though I guess I could just drink a bottle of olive oil for the same effect...well greased machine!


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I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: fngbronco]
    #14991592 -

fngbronco said:
The protein isn't an issue with you veggies, it is the amino acids required to make them useable where they need to be (as whiskey addressed) in order to be utilized by the body. Protein synthesis is pretty amazing stuff.

Don't bag my McDonald's either, it's a great anti constipation tool, though I guess I could just drink a bottle of olive oil for the same effect...well greased machine!


I feel sorry for you considering Mcdonalds to be medicinal... Good luck with that though :P.

Also, about the whole amino acids and protein debate....

http://altmedicine.about.com/cs/dietarytherapy/a/Vegetarian.htm


And as far as requiring meat in order to get your b12... Read this.

http://www.earthsave.ca/articles/health/b12.html


I hope this helps!!! I am sure there are a lot of god books on the subject, maybe you could consider picking one up? I have a book on raw foods coming in the mail, which I am excited to read!


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The future is an untold circumstance like the next page in a book. And skipping ahead would throw off the entire flow of its existence.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: atom_boy]
    #14991644 -

> if you are going to stop eating animal products entirely you MUST eat b12 fortified foods of take a supplement as this vitammin can only be obtained naturally in the diet from animal products.

The amount of B12 needed in the diet is insanely small.  There are a few non-animal sources of the vitamin, including some specialized yeast strains.  A vegetarian will be hard pressed not to get enough B12 due to all of the B12 fortified foods on the market.  Try finding bread or breakfast cereal that is not B12 fortified.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: Seuss]
    #14991678 -

The article just states it doesn't need to be done each meal, which it doesn't, just like carbs or fruit. That's the only issue with vegetarianism is that you're not getting all your EAAs, and it needs to be supplemented. I do love my meats though, especially wild game, and would take a natural meat over store bought any day, only problem is getting enough for the year is almost impossible.


--------------------
I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek

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Re: Vegetarian protein intake? [Re: fngbronco]
    #14991842 -

I know people that eat deer/bear year round... Get a weapon and kill your food.


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My past post are not necessarily reflections of my current opinions.

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