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Bullshit:: 2012
    #10742144 -

Anyone see that episode of Penn & Teller (aired like 2 weeks ago)? Wondering what everyone thought of the 'Mayan Princess' saying nothing is going to happen since it seems almost everyone here believes 2012 holds any significance at all.

I liked the part about sun flares also since it seems every single Doomsday program out there will have you believe a sun flare will destroy all life on earth.


Anyway it was a good ep and worth checking out if you like the show or believe in the 2012 theories.


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: SHiZNO]
    #10742752 -

I don't need Penn or Teller to let me know the 2012 hysteria is inane. 

Psychologically, however, it's easy to understand why the inanity is so widespread.  People can either be motivated, and they go out and take control of their lives actively, or they can be the 95% who just wait for things to happen, and only take control in a limited, fleeting reactionary way.

It's much for comfortable for people to believe that 'something big will change' in 2012, which will make their little lives better/more exciting/more livable/whatever, then actually putting in the effort to make any of it happen.

I think it's much more likely that the 2012'ers are paranoid, instead of being privy to some sort profound cosmic knowledge.  Just my 2 cents :bongload:


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: SHiZNO]
    #10742959 -

I'm no fan of Penn & Teller, and frankly I don't trust them, but obviously there's a lot of bullshit surrounding 2012.  Whether anything significant will happen we can't say for sure, but we can address what the Maya thought of it.  They most certainly did NOT consider it a "Doomsday" scenario.  The whole concept of the end of time would not make sense to them, since they viewed time as cyclical.  2012 is simply when the cycle starts over.

Another common misconception about 2012 is that it has to do with the solar system crossing the galactic, thus increasing the amount of radiation coming in from space.  This is false.  The Mayan long-count calendar is based on the precession of equinoxes.  It has to do with the sun passing through the dark rift at the center of the Milky Way galaxy(which is visible with the naked eye, and thus does not require any extraordinary speculations about how they figured this out).  This journey of the sun through the dark rift began in the late 1998, will reach its zenith in 2012, and complete its journey in 2016.  We can think of this transition(which we are currently in) as the "2012 era."  To understand the significance of this requires some knowledge of Mayan mythology, which I am only slightly familiar with.  But what I do know is that the dark rift was known to the Maya as "Xibalba Be."  Xibalba, in Mayan mythology, is the underworld -- the realm of the dead.  So the sun's journey through this dark rift would symbolize a sort of rebirth(presumably involving some sort of creative destruction, such as the current economic crisis).

Anyway, if anyone is interested in pursuing this subject further, I find John Major Jenkins to be the most credible expert on this subject.  His hypotheses are grounded in solid research, not New Age fluff.


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Silversoul]
    #10743078 -

Well said!

Here is the channeled entity Bashar speaking of the Ra Material.

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Minstrel]
    #10743762 -

excellent post.


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Taco Chef]
    #10744062 -

I'd put down $$ that nothing will happen but it is fun to speculate/

Minstrell kinda nailed it.  but as a believer in ufo's I can see it maybe being a significant year for them somehow. but probably not    ,    not gonna stop going to college because of 2012 that's for sure  :bongroll:

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: skatealex2]
    #10744143 -

skatealex2 said:
I'd put down $$ that nothing will happen but it is fun to speculate/



It's interesting to see how different people envision 2012... seems like most of the time people are fulfilling "atavistic" memories of past catastrophes.  Or others are more positive and trying to create a self-fulfilling prophecy of mass enlightenment.

The sad truth is that nothing that amazing or interesting will probably ever happen to us.  So you definitely can't fault the people who don't believe or care either.  If nothing else, getting opinions the 2012 topic is a good way to psychoanalyze others as optimistic, pessimistic, misanthropic, apathetic.

Even so, more than half the time other people's doomsday pontificating can become completely annoying.  Myself?  I believe it's just another day, but a small part of me will always hope I'm wrong and something substantial will actually take place, even if it's negative.  But honestly, I don't feel any threat of catastrophe or envision any moralistic shift in humankind.


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: SHiZNO]
    #10744342 -

Its on the news.
A huge comet is coming our way.
The physicians have calculated the time of impact and the consequences will be devastating for all life on the planet.

People freak out.. right ?

When the science comes into play... we are prone to take matters more seriously..
and i guess all im wondering is when the people will start to take into account the science that is going around this whole 2012 issue.

The truth is.. there is an alignment that is due to be complete on the given date.
Another truth is.. that this happens only every 26,000 years.

Ive said this many times..
We have proof of changes within our solar system caused by this.
All planets in our solar system are experiencing climate change , and we still think call it 'global' warming.
Jupiters moon is 200% hotter.

Also.. we have many many prophecies indicating a massive change around this date.
I see a lot of people pointing out the mayans , but  it really doesnt stop or begin there.

If one would be inclined to more thoroughly investigate , he/she would surely find that this a very common theme among many spiritual teachings that have impacted the consciousness of people on this planet.
Even christianity has a thing or two to say .

Although i find a very negative undertone to it... the rapture is most certainly an attempt to describe this event we are yet to experience / or not ?

It really all boils down to what people would like to see... and how ready they are for a change in the first place.

My personal theory comes from taking into account many many theories .. and i have inevitably come to a conclusion that this is related to the evolution of consciousness.

Some might say that this is a slow process.. and it will not have such a profound impact like many believers seem to portray..
I disagree.
I believe.. it will be swift.

There is no other way.
All it takes.. is all people coming together - for one moment.

Its the peak of a trip.
Its the global realization of this one moment.

Its the unraveling of the question we have put off for far too long
>>> What is it that we are doing here ?

What have we been doing here ?

What do we do now ?

>> Notice - The WE.

The answer to these questions will be our collective pursuit.




My 2 cents :mushroom2:


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All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: jivJaN]
    #10744699 -

what huge comet and when is this supposedly hitting?


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: SHiZNO]
    #10744791 -

there is no comet..
at least not that i know of.
it was an example , not to be taken literally.


also..
notice how this is the part of my post you payed most attention to.

"As viewed , so appears "


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---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..

Edited by jivJaN (07/26/09 07:11 PM)

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: jivJaN]
    #10744884 -

http://digg.com/space/First_View_of_the_Dark_Side_of_the_Sun_2

this seems fitting.  the dark side of the sun will appear in 2011 :strokebeard2: 

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: SHiZNO]
    #10758475 -

The 'experts' are as wrong as the 'crackpots' in most of these episodes.

P&T don't understand the astronomical significance of the date and are wrong that the Mayan's didn't say something big will happen.
There is a stone that is quite clear about 'gods decending' on 12.21.2012, the time translations are solid thanks to the cycles of Venus.

Here's my write-up on 2012:

I've heard a lot of misinformation about this and here's what I think I know:

The Sun will not align with Galactic Center, it never does, it passes 'above' it as viewed from Earth every year at Winter Solstice.

Our system is probably not entering a 'photon belt', it moves too slowly and changes in galactic weather occur over hundreds of thousands of years. There could be a nearby super-nova or our Galactic Nuclei could become active but these events follow no predictable cycle.

The Egyptians, Hopi, Hindus, Christians and Muslims say nothing about 2012.

The I Ching says nothing about 2012. T. McKenna superimposed the I Ching over the Mayan calendar and called it 'Time Wave Zero' theory.

Anyway here is what will happen for sure:

On 12/21/2012 @ 11:11AM GMT the Sun will cross the winter solstice point precisely at sunrise as viewed from Mesoamerica. This is what the Mayans were marking.

The Sun never aligns with the center of the galaxy, it always passes 'above' it. It does align with the Galactic Equator as viewed from Earth once a year because our Sol system moves up and down like a Ferris wheel instead of formed sideways along the Galactic plane like most other planetary systems.

The reason for this is might be because our Sun is not originally from our galaxy.

Sol may have entered the Milky Way from above as part of the invading Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy.

Our astronomers say the Winter Solstice point crossed the galactic equator in 1999 but they admit that there is a large margin of error and it's possible that the Mayans were right that the rising Sun aligns with Winter Solstice AND the Galactic Equator on 12/21/2012.

This is why the Mayan Tzolk'in or Tonalámatl Calendar restarts on that date, due to Precession, this event only happens once every 25,765 years.

The Sun becomes active every 11 years, it is less active then it has ever been at this point in it's cycle and scientists are predicting some of the largest solar flares ever. The next Solar Maxima happens to be in 2012.
It's unlikely that a solar flare will destroy the planet but the loss of satellites and power grids is a real possibility. This is why they launched STEREO.

There is only ONE ancient reference to something occurring in 2012, it is on a stone in Mesoamerica, Tortuguero Monument 6.

The Mayan calendar does not end in 2012 it is only the beginning of a new cycle but they do say something 'big' will happen.
Unfortunately, the word on the monument that describes exactly what will happen is effaced.

From David Stuart's recent decipherment of Tortuguero Monument 6 for the UT Mesoamerican Google group:

As promised here's a quick translation of the final passage* of
Tortuguero Monument 6, recording the 2012 Bak'tun ending:

Tzuhtz-(a)j-oom u(y)-uxlajuun pik
(ta) Chan Ajaw ux(-te') Uniiw.
Uht-oom ?
Y-em(al)?? Bolon Yookte' K'uh ta ?.

"The Thirteenth 'Bak'tun" will be finished
(on) Four Ajaw, the Third of Uniiw (K'ank'in). (12.21.2012)
? will occur. (indecipherable)
(It will be) the descent(??) of the Nine Support? God(s) to the ?."

This is it. The term following uht-oom is the main puzzle, and largely
effaced. The "descent" reference is highly tentative, too. The
enigmatic deity Bolon Yookte' K'uh has been known for some time
from many sources, and I suspect that he (or they) has some tangential
relationship to the Principal Bird Deity, as well as war associations.
Interestingly, he is a protagonist in the deep time mythology of
Palenque, as recorded on Palenque's Temple XIV tablet. A
long-lasting character who's still around somewhere waiting, I suppose.

John Major Stenkens:

"One thing about Bolon Yokte's presence in the 2012 text should be emphasized. Apart from symbolizing war, conflict, and the underworld, Bolon Yokte is a god that is often present during Creation events, often referring to the Creation event of 13.0.0.0.0 in 3114 BC, and most notably on the Vase of the Seven Lords. So, what does it mean that a Creation Lord is present on the next 13.0.0.0.0, the one that falls in 2012 AD? Although some scholars have commented that the incomplete text on Tortuguero Monument 6 doesn't tell us much, they have overlooked the obvious: Bolon Yokte's mere presence suggests that 2012 was thought of as a Creation, a worldrenewal that, after all, makes perfect sense in the context of a World Age doctrine that sequences forward in intervals of 13 baktuns. This may seem to go without saying, but in fact my work has been criticized for characterizing 2012 as a "cosmogenesis." Here the scholars are one step closer to understanding 2012 for what the Maya knew it to a be: a rebirth and the beginning of a new World Age.

So, specific prophecy with content for future events are rare in hieroglyphic texts. This may explain why there is a dearth of hieroglyphic texts on 2012—one of the main complaints about my theory. For whatever reason, our expectation that there should be such texts is thus pegged as an erroneous assumption; such a dearth is the norm. This may reveal a Mayan conceptualization of past and future as non-local realities that collapse always in the present moment. We see this in the shifting tense usages when Maya folktales are told. It was, it will be, it is—these temporal locations are interchangeable in mythic time, the space of "everything manifests in the now."

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Middleman]
    #10758742 -

Quote:
The Sun will not align with Galactic Center, it never does, it passes 'above' it as viewed from Earth every year at Winter Solstice.


I looked this up last month using wikipedia's coordinates of the galactic center and 'starry night' computer software and found that the sun would align with the galactic center sometime around 2200.  Obviously take that with a grain of salt...

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: DieCommie]
    #10758778 -

That doesn't make sense, the ecliptic will take a million years to move 6˚.

I'm using Starry Night Pro 5 and the ecliptic never moves.
Turn on Options>Guides>Galactic>Equator+Meridian where they meet in Sag is GC.
Turn on Options>Guides>Ecliptic>Equator, the Sun's path barely changes over thousands of years.

The Sun 'aligns' with GC via the Galactic Equator every year but never passes directly in front of it.

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Middleman]
    #10759013 -

Cool.  So the sun aligns with the GC every year but that doesn't count?

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: DieCommie]
    #10759913 -

Right but what's special about 12.21.2012 is the alignment of the sunrise with the winter solstice point - possibly with the galactic equator as well.

According to Starry Night, the winter solstice point passed the gal. equator in 1999. It is possible to shift the position of the galactic equator without changing galactic center.
The difference is extremely small, our astronomers could be off. There are many galactic centers actually, an infrared, luminous and gravitational center, etc.

Anyway, the sunrise was very important to the ancients for very real metaphysical reasons.

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Middleman]
    #10760880 -

Here are some highlights:

    Sun: More activity since 1940 than in previous 1150 years, combined

    Mercury: Unexpected polar ice discovered, along with a surprisingly strong intrinsic magnetic field … for a supposedly “dead” planet

    Venus: 2500% increase in auroral brightness, and substantive global atmospheric changes in less than 30 years

    Earth: Substantial and obvious world-wide weather and geophysical changes

    Mars: “Global Warming,” huge storms, disappearance of polar icecaps

    Jupiter: Over 200% increase in brightness of surrounding plasma clouds

    Saturn: Major decrease in equatorial jet stream velocities in only ~20 years, accompanied by surprising surge of X-rays from equator

    Uranus: “Really big, big changes” in brightness, increased global cloud activity

    Neptune: 40% increase in atmospheric brightness

    Pluto: 300% increase in atmospheric pressure, even as Pluto recedes farther from the Sun

http://www.enterprisemission.com/_articles/05-14-2004_Interplanetary_Part_1/Interplanetary_1.htm

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: c0sm0nautt]
    #10763248 -

So... what it comes down to is.... 

things tend to change over time?


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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Minstrel]
    #10763341 -

Minstrel said:
So... what it comes down to is.... 

things tend to change over time?


Indeed, so expect more change in the future :smile:

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Re: Bullshit:: 2012 [Re: Minstrel]
    #10763405 -

Personally, I'm ready for anything and everything to happen in 2012. The same thing is true for tomorrow, and the next day, and the next, and the next.....

But i'm not holding my breath, and if nothing happens, then I'm just gonna keep living my life.

I'm not making any adjustments to my life in honor of 2012. Whatever it is, if it happens, is much much bigger than myself. Might as well just let it wash over me like a wave.


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Word to your mom.

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