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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9432850 -

A fucking cheeseburger joint is addictive in the same way pot is. You know i meant physically adictive.


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~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Kada]
    #9432883 -

My point is THEY don't mean physically addictive.
I would also be open to an argument against that. I have met many stoners who lose sleep when they try and quit, or even cut down, their use of weed.

Rupert: The terms are hard to define. Not everyone has a hardline reaction to a drug.
Similarly this is why I've come to strongly disagree with the philosophy of BAC laws. I'll tell you right now that my .08 is a much lighter drunk than most other's .08, but that doesn't matter.


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Edited by jewunit (12/14/08 09:06 PM)

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Kada]
    #9432885 -

Cheeseburger is addictive as physcially addictive as pot? I dont understand...

I don't think pot or cheeseburgers are physically addictive, but you could become psychologically addicted to either.

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: rupertbeaner]
    #9432911 -

The issue is that Marijuana is not chemically addicting like nicotine is. People have problems quitting after smoking for prolonged periods because it became a habit-forming part of their lifestyle. In that same context anything could become habit forming and lead to issues when you quit (I.E. chewing ice)

JewUnit: I understand where you come from with the example of BAC. One person's BAC of intoxicated could be another person's sober. My qualm is that I haven't seen any scientific evidence that says marijuana can be addicting therfor anyone's problems when they quit could be attributed to the same problems quitting any habit be it drug or not.

Edited by rupertbeaner (12/14/08 09:13 PM)

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: rupertbeaner]
    #9432939 -

rupertbeaner said:
I don't think pot or cheeseburgers are physically addictive,


I think pot cheese burgers are a great idea


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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: rupertbeaner]
    #9432950 -

I'd like to do a study one day about marijuana "withdrawals."
I think many people would be surprised about how hard it is to quit.

They say once you get past the physical withdrawal of heroin it's still hard to stay clean because you know how great of a drug it is.
I feel like a lot of people get that same feeling (to a lesser degree I'm sure) with weed.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: rupertbeaner]
    #9432993 -

It would just take someone who would be willing to challenge the law. They would have to have barely enough marijuana to be in violation of the law, but not enough to get them really screwed. Then get some competent lawyers and get it rescheduled. I think that a really good group of lawyers. Unfortunately I've learned in my time as a paralegal, that the further you get away from the local level in the court system, the more politicized the courts become. If not legalized, at least rescheduled. but if that where to happen, there could later be a law that bans marijuana specifically without scheduling. What do my fellow Shroomerites think?


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Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9433002 -

jewunit said:
Kada said:
(A) The drug or other substance has a high potential for abuse. -Marijuana is non-addictive.


It doesn't say anything about addiction, it talks about abuse.
If you think weed doesn't have a high potential for abuse then you've smoked yourself retarded.


Schedule II:

(A) The drug or other substance has a high potential for abuse.
(B) The drug or other substance has a currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States or a currently accepted medical use with severe restrictions.
(C) Abuse of the drug or other substances may lead to severe psychological or physical dependence.

Fits a bet better than schedule I doesn't it?
Still covers abuse and addiction, and fits into schedule II.
I don't understand why it is schedule I.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Removal_of_cannabis_from_Schedule_I_of_the_Controlled_Substances_Act


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The Psychedelic Salon -- Erowid -- MAPS -- The Genesis Generation

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: bryguy27007]
    #9433019 -

I was just going to post that. Thank you :smile:


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9433060 -

Interesting, has anyone ever heard of Rat Park ?

It was a study done saying that rats that self-administer drugs to themselves only do it because they are in cages, when they are in an open and healthy rat life-style like the 'Rat Park' then they have no desire to administer drugs to themselves.

I thought it was a very thought provoking study on addiction and made question the relation between lifestyle and drugs.

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: bryguy27007]
    #9433079 -

Luckily for me I didn't quote his whole post.

If you wanna argue whether or not marijuana (or any other drug) should be illegal then you're looking to the wrong guy.

I was just pointing out what I feel is a very commonly overlooked problem.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9433102 -

jewunit said:
I'd like to do a study one day about marijuana "withdrawals."
I think many people would be surprised about how hard it is to quit.


Trust me...it isn't

I was a hardcore, daily pot smoker for 15+ years.
My life changed and I was placed in a situation where I didn't have access to weed.

Within a week, I had no withdrawal symptoms.
The withdrawl from weed aint shit.

tobacco on the other hand.....


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9433104 -

I still feel there isn't clarity on defining words like addiction and abuse.


edit:
My previous employer was also a psychotherapist and told me how long-time pot smokers had withdraw symptoms when they quit. I just don't think its a chemical addition like cigarettes.

Edited by rupertbeaner (12/14/08 09:37 PM)

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: niteowl]
    #9433135 -

Yeah, and I smoked weed multiple times a day from 16-18 and had no problems quitting.
Part of that was I didn't like getting high, so I didn't have the "Damn I'd like to get high right now" problem that many of my friends have had (although as I've gotten older I often think how much I'd love to be stoned.)

Just because YOU had it easy doesn't mean others have.
I have also quit cigarettes on more than one occasion without a problem, but I'm not gonna sit here and say it's easy to get rid of a tobacco addiction.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Kada]
    #9433137 -

It's funny how society has such a double standard when it comes to alcohol. Alcohol better fits the description of a schedule 1 drug than marijuana does. the only difference is that Christian conservatives love alcohol, but hate everything else because it's of the "devil". And with the sway they hold in this nation, the rest of us are forced to live in their psychosis, where one drug is good, and the other is bad.

(A) The drug or other substance has a high potential for abuse. -Alcohol is highly addictive. It's one of the three most addictive substances, along with cocaine and heroin. And alcohol destroys the liver.

(B) The drug or other substance has no currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States. -What medically acceptable use is their for liquor or beer? I've never heard of anyone being prescribed to drink alcohol.

(C) There is a lack of accepted safety for use of the drug or other substance under medical supervision. -alcohol kills more people than all illicit drugs combined.


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Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Jawofmalak]
    #9433149 -

It's funny how often proponents of marijuana decriminalization or legalization or whatever turn to arguing against alcohol being legal.

Find a better argument and maybe you'll get somewhere.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: rupertbeaner]
    #9433150 -

addiction is when you have to have the drug to function

abuse is when you occasionally use but you tend to over use and or act inappropriately.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: jewunit]
    #9433163 -

I agree with you, im just trying to figure out how they can have a patent on something for medical use, but they say that Marijuana has no medical use at all. It's completley rediculous to the point where i just don't get it. How can something be proven wrong, but still be true? By description of a schedual 1 drug, Marijuana should have been forced off immediatly. Who are the people that can make that distinction, and why are they sitting on their hands? How can they legally do that i guess im asking?


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.


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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Jawofmalak]
    #9433175 -

Scheduling is ridiculous anyway most drugs become prohibited for reasons like racism, money, fear or all three.
:evildog:

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Re: The "Marijuana has no medical value" out right lie. [Re: Kada]
    #9433177 -

I guess I've slightly derailed the thread.

I didn't outline all of your points for two reasons.
1) Not all the required qualities for being schedule 1 are met by marijuana
2) Scheduling is fucking dumb anyway.

I just think there are more important issues that could be addressed if one wanted to try and help decriminalize weed.


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!

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