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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #6538356 -

Hahaha thats great im not trying to be "deep". Im trying to get thoughts processed and analyzed. Its sorta like a WIP and i just want some C&C. Also about the time thing being static really nothing is not moving and the only thing getting close to being not moving is absolute zero.


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"The dream is dreaming itself"--Kalahari Bushmen

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: Salvia_Antics]
    #6538377 -

heh, I didnt mean you specifically, but you have to admit you are pushing the envelope;)

Im sure you are aware of the uncertainty principle.  If we were able to achieve absolute zero, then the uncertainty principle would be refuted, and I believe quantum mechanics would be in trouble.  Not likely considering the great success of this theory.

edit - to respond to your original post...
Quote:
We have clocks that measure time but are they really measuring anything?

They are measuring that which causes clocks to move periodically.  What they are measuring is periodicity.  I think this is the most basic and lay definition of time you can have.  Humans have observed things happening at regular intervals since the beginning.  For some reason we have tried to get more and more accurate measures of various periodic motions.  Now with modern mathematics and science it just so happens that this notion works out and produces valuable results.







Also I would like to reply to z@z's future post... Hello from the past! :laugh:

Edited by Qubit (02/07/07 08:48 AM)

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #6539127 -

Time doesn't exist. To prove this please reply to this post before this post.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: z@z.com]
    #6541064 -

Asking whether or not "time" exists is kind of like asking whether or not "direction" exists. No, I can not put a slice of direction in a bottle and hand it to you. It is a concept, not a thing, but it certainly exists.

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #6541954 -

Why would getting to absolute zero, or really all we can do is get extremely close to it, be violating the uncertainty principle?

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: TheCow]
    #6542160 -

Because the uncertainty principle states that you can not know the momentum and the position of a particle at the same time because measuring one changes the others output. If you got to absolute zero you would know both which by that principle is impossible.


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"The dream is dreaming itself"--Kalahari Bushmen

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: Salvia_Antics]
    #6542202 -

Hes right ^^ Getting close to it doesn't violate the uncertainty principle, only being right at it.

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #6542313 -

At absolute zero I imagine that a particle would enter its ground state energy. The ground state energy lets say of an electron, in a potential well, is n^2*h^2/8mL^2 where L is the dimension of this fictional 1-d box. n is your quantum number, so if you put in a value for the ground state energy you would not get zero. I think that even at absolute zero a particle would not be violating the uncertainty principle, as you would not be aware of the particles position or momentum with greater then an hbar/2 knowledge. There would still be energy in the system, just not any thermal energy, but fluctuations would still exist. However Im a bit intoxicated and would have to think about this more.

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: TheCow]
    #6542418 -

your right, ill stop posting crap until I get my degree  :blush:

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: DieCommie]
    #6542564 -

I thought that absolute zero was zero energy in the system which would be impossible because mass is directly related to energy through e=mc2. Since i guess there is zero point energy it only looses all thermal energy. This sorta makes absolute zero seem boring now and we have no need to reach it.


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"The dream is dreaming itself"--Kalahari Bushmen

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: Salvia_Antics]
    #6542575 -

im thinkin absolute zero is the particles lowest energy state, not a zero energy state.

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: Salvia_Antics]
    #6542577 -

E=mc^2 is a bit different then what we are talking about here. But we still have need to reach it, if only to study it.
However we cant actually reach it exactly, only sort of approximate it.

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Re: Has time been proven to exist? [Re: TheCow]
    #6543269 -

isn't that so that absolute zero is when there's no kinetic energy between electrons, neutrons, and protons. That's way there's no thermal energy. In normal conditions the electrons, neutrons, and protons are speeding in tn the atom with very high speeds and impacting with each other giving it it's thermal energy.
I might be completely wrong, because I have never been into physics (had MAJOR problems in school with it),


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THE PHILOSOPHY OF LIBERTY <---                                               


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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