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Anonymous

Question on air exchange....
    #535168 - 01/29/02 07:23 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I have a 4 shelf terrarium covered in plastic it is approx. 6' x 4' x 2'
There is a cool mist humidifier attached to two garden hoses..one goes in at the top and the other at the bottom.
I am concerned about inadequate air exchange to the casings, so I put a small fan in at the bottom which hopefully blows the air around in there enough.
Where should I place the fan to get the best airflow? one the top shelf pointing up or down or what?
Should I not even be concerned because the cool mist provides enough air flow (I'm not convinced)

Any insight is greatly appreciated


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Invisiblemycofile
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Posts: 2,336
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ]
    #535176 - 01/29/02 07:30 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Air exchange isn't the problem. Coolmist probably does provide enough fresh air. Problem is air circulation. Problem here is that without going through the trouble of perfecting it, who's to say what is good enough? I guess just do whatever seems to keep air from being stagnant anywhere in the terrerium, especially over any tray. Either that or go through the trouble of acheiving entrainment.


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Offlinecookiewhore
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Registered: 01/03/02
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ]
    #535261 - 01/29/02 09:32 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Ok, dont listen to whoever replied first.
I have a coolmist humidifier too, it has 3 speeds, and a humidistat. i put the fucker right in the terrarium, mines 2x4x6' as well.
for air exchange, get yourself a fish tank bubbler, the smallest one they have.. itd be like $5 american.
put this in the bottom, bubbling out the hose through the side of yer terr, and in the opposite, top corner, slap on a 99.97 filter.
badda boom, badda bing


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OfflineHammerloaf
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: cookiewhore]
    #535273 - 01/29/02 09:46 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Abrasive reply cookiewhore.. he doesn't need that shit.. just take your fan that you already have, save yourself $5 US and put it in the bottom of the enclosure, blowing towards the outside world.. then put a filter patch up near the top (possibly some tyvek material since it's big and cheap)... CO2 should sink to the bottom of the whole shot and get sucked out.. should be all good :smile:


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: cookiewhore]
    #535844 - 01/30/02 01:45 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

**yeah, don't listen to me. I mean who the fuck am I? I certainly havn't been around here very long. I probably haven't even grown my first cake yet. I don't think I know much about growing, especially the complicated stuff you're talking about. In fact I probably had it backwards, circulating air is probably bad for fungus and stagnant air is bad for contams.**


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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OfflineHammerloaf
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: mycofile]
    #535890 - 01/30/02 02:26 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

What a mouthy tit you are mycofile.. who put the pickle in your ass.. I think he was looking for suggestions, not some vague ass "do whatever works" kinda reply.. You start your reply with "Airflow isn't the problem"... and then turn right around and start talking about making sure that no stagnant air is sitting on casings.. hmm.. contradictory.. maybe you should lay off the drugs huh?

and maybe summa the know-it-all attitude too.


Edited by Hammerloaf (01/30/02 02:39 PM)


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Invisiblear393
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: Hammerloaf]
    #536687 - 01/31/02 09:56 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

hammer loaf, he said air exchange isnt the problem. not air flow. his actual post said air flow was the problem and he gave shroomism the perfect answer. cookie whore, im not going to even get into that and stupid posts. also hammer, myco has been here for years, cookie has been here for what, a month?

so hammer, maybe you should lay off the drugs...and maybe some of the attitude too....
peaec, ar393


Edited by ar393 (01/31/02 09:57 AM)


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OfflineHammerloaf
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ar393]
    #536690 - 01/31/02 10:05 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Yes.. my crack habit is becoming overwhelming.. I guess it must be that which gives me this hard on for flaming know it all punks who wear their knowledge like a big flashing banner ad over their heads... but whatever.

Myofile still has a big fat pickle in his ass.


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OfflineXAZIA
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Registered: 08/22/01
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: Hammerloaf]
    #536710 - 01/31/02 10:48 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

*sigh...
getting back to shroomism's delima...as you have stated before shroomism, our set ups are almost identical. i have had the exact same suspicion in the past weeks. i just didn't seem to get the results from my casings as i expected. i am using a ultrasonic humidifier . i think beacause of the amount of real estate we have in our set ups it does create areas that have stagnant pockets of air. i think the humidifiers bring in sufficient 02, but there is too much co2 produced to be displaced quickly enough. heres what i am going to try.
my humidity enters at the side of my shelfs through pvc piping, there is one "exhaust" for each shelf. i am going to cut a circular "vent" at the opposite side of each shelf and put two micron filters(one on the inside one on the out). this will cause a stream of air flow eliminating any stagnant pockets over the casings.
i do believe our set up needs a fan(s). the sheer volume in our setup does not allow simple displacement to woork efficiently.
try this: get one of those clip on fans with the flexible neck(so your fan is not taking up space on the shelf) and clip it close to the top of your terranium. cut a small "vent" like i described above directly behind the fan so it will be sucking in fresh air. then on the bottom shelf do the same thing but face the fan OUT, so it si sucking the air inside (co2 included) out. i bet our casings will thrive much nicer.
let me know what you think!


--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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Invisiblear393
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: Hammerloaf]
    #536741 - 01/31/02 11:32 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

i wasnt argueing the pickel theory :smile: , but back to the point at hand a fan or two  (one for circulation, one for forced exhaust) in the system would definately  help things out.
peace, ar393


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Anonymous

Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: XAZIA]
    #536775 - 01/31/02 12:16 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Ok here's the deal....

I put the small fan on the bottom shelf facing out. (No hole in the plastic, just imperfections in the seal) I put it on a timer to turn on for a half hour four times a day. So far it appears to be working good... The humidity in the tent stays above 95%, and when the fan kicks in it drops to about 85 in a half hour of fan blowing. I can tell by the moving of the plastic that the fan is providing good air flow to the terrarium. I might do some more tweaking for a filtered fresh air intake and possibly another small fan in the top shelf
So far got 6 casings in there on the top 2 shelves. Pinning is imminent...and these coco fiber casings looks like they're ready to explode with fungus. Really wish I had a digi camera... ah well maybe when I'm rich.


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OfflineXAZIA
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Registered: 08/22/01
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ]
    #536784 - 01/31/02 12:27 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

i think the filtered air intake will be the icing on the cake. keep me posted shroomism and i will do the same.


--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ar393]
    #536788 - 01/31/02 12:32 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

It's actually not a pickle up my ass, it's one of those big ass shrooms from my avatar :wink: 
What I said wasn't vague, it just wasn't the standard shroomery, repeat of what everyone else would say, answer.  Someone who didn't know the difference between air exchange and air circulation probably wouldn't have gotten it though.  The ambiguity in the post was due to the fact that what is optimum (a fan with propper cfm distrubuting air in a manner which creates entrainment thus preventing stagnation, and a recirculation box to allow for fine tuning air exchange rates) probably isn't going to be done in this case.  Who's to say what is good enough for you.  I've had more types of setups than have even been described on the OMC.  I've seen differences in performance based on every variable.  Air circulation is often a variable that gets overlooked, because only air exchange is addressed in the cookie cutter replies most often found on this board.  Fresh air doesn't necessarily provide adequate air circulation, and it is circulation coupled with fresh air that prevents contaminates such as trichoderma and cobweb.  These contaminates simply have an extremely hard time developing in systems with proper air exchange and circulation.  A big reason why people who rely on fish bublers for fresh air still have contam issues, they don't get any circulation from the bubblers.

Shroomisms original question.  The coolmist has a fan in it.  That fan if piped into the setup from outside should allow enough fresh air along with the humidity.  As long as there is an exhaust hole for the air to exit from, then air exchange isn't an issue.  (it's probably not technicly optimum, but plenty good enough).  What probably isn't taking place is the proper distribution of that fresh air.  An entrainment creating distrubution method here would be ideal, but in the absence of that, a fan in the setup that circulates air as much as possible without causing too much dehydration from the casings is best.  I haven't seen the setup, so I can't say where such a fan should be placed, but I'm sure shroomism can figure it out by trying it and feeling the air flow or some other simple method.

An ultrasonic humidifier in the same setup would not provide adequate fresh air, nor air circulation.  Ultrasonics just don't blow the volume of air that a coolmist does.  A fish bubler is probably not going to come close either, especially for circulation.  Now, whatever works good enough for you, fine with me as stated in my original post.  But MO is that significant benefits can be gained by optimizing circulation and exchange and thats my advice to anyone wanting to enhance their results.

While on the subject something that nobody around here even considers is air REcirculation, which is a really cool capability when coupled with proper circulation for preventing contamination while keeping CO2 and humidity levels high enough for casing colonization/prepinning.


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Anonymous

Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: mycofile]
    #536792 - 01/31/02 12:42 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for the descriptive response Myco...
I am playing around with the fan to achieve the best air circulation in there that I can, I think I have a good setup for now with the fan on the bottom blowing towards the side. I'm going to add a hole up top with a filter over it and see how that works.

Xazia - Like Mycofile said an ultrasonic just doesnt produce the same volume of air as a cool mist, which is probably why you have stagnant air pockets. I bet you would benefit from putting a small fan in there to circulate the air, and a filter to draw in fresh air.


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OfflineHammerloaf
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ]
    #536819 - 01/31/02 01:01 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Now that is a quality reply mycofile... kudos :wink:
and I am glad you've identified the rectal intruder.


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Invisiblear393
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Registered: 01/27/00
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: Hammerloaf]
    #536937 - 01/31/02 03:29 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

its nice when we can all play nice together :smile:
peace, ar393


Edited by ar393 (01/31/02 03:30 PM)


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OfflineXAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
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Last seen: 14 years, 2 months
Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ar393]
    #536948 - 01/31/02 03:53 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

ahhh... i figured as much but it is nice to have it confirmed. that is why i decided to create the "vents" i speak of.
i kept hearing a faint distant cry in the wind...
fresh air....fresha air....*grin*

i think the vents and the intake/exhaust fans will be a great improvement. thanx a bunch
peace!



--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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Offlinecookiewhore
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Registered: 01/03/02
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Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: XAZIA]
    #536990 - 01/31/02 04:45 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

If you're in a sealed container, it probally isnt even necessary to run an intake, just an outtake will do
think of a computer case, with fans...


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OfflineXAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 14 years, 2 months
Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: cookiewhore]
    #537000 - 01/31/02 05:00 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

he's a little beyond a "sealed container"
here are pics of my set up and shroomism's is similiar.
not to speak for you shroomism but i know you don't have a digi camera so maybe this will help give a mental picture.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=Forum2&Number=520319&Search=true&Forum=All_Forums&Words=XAZIA&Match=Username&Searchpage=1&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=517393


--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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Offlinesillvyr
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Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 125
Loc: under a tree
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: Question on air exchange.... [Re: ar393]
    #559627 - 02/22/02 01:37 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

i'm growing cakes, of course since this is my first time...
here are some of my beautiful babies:
http://shroomery.org/wwwthreads/files/62313-cap_006.jpg
i just wanted to mention that since i forgot!


--------------------
The "Little Mushrooms" are but emisaries to the Overmind.....



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