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What the 'bleep' do we know?
    #4953802 -

Has anyone else seen this movie? Alot of it is about quantum physics and just weird shit that I seemed to think of whenever I trip. I especcially liked the part where that Dr.Emoto from japan(i think) did a study and concluded that water can be changed from thoughts and feelings.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: Tangerines]
    #4953806 -

Its rubbish.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: DieCommie]
    #4953834 -

Well it is true that matter is 99% empty. And when you add up all the quirks of an atom they do not add up to the mass of the atom so something is missing.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: Tangerines]
    #4953844 -

Ive seen it.

Its basically a guide on how to use "the force".

"If you want it to be there, and you close your eyes and you can hear it...then how isn't it there? Its all your perception. How can any one else tell you its not there...when its your perception against theirs?"

BECAUSE PHYSICS DOESN'T ALLOW IT!!!

I thought it was a stupid movie.

Edited by I_was_the_walrus (11/18/05 10:18 PM)

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: Tangerines]
    #4953859 -

Im sorry that doesnt make any sense to me. All particles can be expressed as probability waves, so i dont know what you mean by 99% empty. Also Ive not heard of the "quirks" discrepancy.

Irregardless, the makers of the film have no training in the mathematical rigor of quantum mechanics, this has been documented. Bottom line, the film is bullshit from a physics point of view.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: DieCommie]
    #4953881 -

DieCommie said:
Its rubbish.



:thumbup:

Btw, Omoto has been debunked several times in the past, once by me.

Do a search for "Emoto" in S&P

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: I_was_the_walrus]
    #4953883 -

Seriously, what's up with the water crystal thing. The man has published 2 books of them. Has anyone ever repeated this experiment? I looked for info, but I couldn't find much besides some general things, no criticisms, nothing. Has anyone else seen this?



http://www.whatthebleep.com/crystals/


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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: Tangerines]
    #4953886 -

I just saw this last week.  I got about 20 minutes into it before I had to shut it off.  I ran like an infomercial for quantam mechanics.  :thumbdown:


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:crankey:
/    l    \__:thumbup: ... Hi, I'm Crankey, and I approve this message.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: mycogirl]
    #4953897 -

Do a search for my post on "Emoto" in S&P. People have repeated his experiment with no success. He lied about having peer reviewed journals and scholarly articles. He also admitted to being selective on the results, he filtered out anything that wouldn't support himself.


Quote:
In a double blind study of Emoto's claims, designed to enhance credibility by reducing the potential for bias, experimenters would photograph and record snowflakes formed from different water samples before learning which samples had been sent which messages. Without double blinding, the photographers are free to hunt through the diversity of snowflakes in each sample to look for snowflakes that match their expectations of what the snowflake should look like, because they already know which message was attached to which container. Indeed, the creativity of photographers rather than the rigour of the experiment is the explicit policy of Emoto:

Extract from a February 2, 2005 interview of Emoto by Maui Newspaper

Interviewer: Any criticism about your work that I have read suggests it's not valid because there are no double blind studies. What is your response?

Emoto: When I consider hiring a new researcher to take crystal photography, I first give that person a blind test on water crystals. For example, I will provide some samples of water that we know will definitely form crystals, and some samples that will not produce any (such as Tokyo's tap water) without telling the candidate. Depending on the test result, I will register that person according to his or her level. However, I do not require any blind test on any samples after that. I believe that the researcher's aesthetic sense and character is the important aspect when taking crystal photographs. Therefore, I try to make sure that they can take photographs in a relaxed and positive atmosphere. I urge each one of them to try their best because beauty exists in everything.

Apparently, Emoto uses blind tests to screen the photo-taking skills of his photographers, but not systematically in the actual experiments, leaving the potential for selection bias.

The James Randi Educational Foundation has offered to give Emoto 1 million U.S. dollars if he can demonstrate his claims with a double blind procedure. Emoto has not responded to the offer.



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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: spud]
    #4953904 -

spud said:
Do a search for my post on "Emoto" in S&P. People have repeated his experiment with no success. He lied about having peer reviewed journals and scholarly articles. He also admitted to being selective on the results, he filtered out anything that wouldn't support himself.


:lol: 
basically, a real credible scientific guy  :rolleyes:

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: spud]
    #4953922 -

Have you seen the bacteria experiment?



http://www.life-enthusiast.com/twilight/research_emoto.htm

I want to do the bacteria one, especially since I work in a lab, and its kind of funny how people go through 'periods' of high contamination.


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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: mycogirl]
    #4953937 -

If you do enough research, Emoto has been debunked on pretty much every level.

He admits to using bias friendly screening for all results he makes public.

When questioned on his fake credentials and non existing journals, he has no response.

I don't waste my time on quacks, sorry.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: Tangerines]
    #4954079 -

The whole damn part of Quantum Physics is all hype, and no show. All talk, and no walk. This is a hallmark of BullshitTM.

All that jazz is rooted in yet another attempt to advocate the Primacy of Consciousness, that seems to be part of Ramtha J. Knight's agenda.

There were some other basic, underlying, essential philisophical principles that were fine, but the movie seemed quite intent on trying to support the Primacy of Consciousness with QP, which shows a poor misunderstanding of what QP is really saying about the Universe. Most of the misunderstanding comes from observation or observables. Most people read that, and think "Oh, that means a person i.e., a consciousness, is looking at that object." That isn't how it really works. Without getting into what consciousness really is, observation can occur when, say, a photon interacts with an electron. So it's physical stuff doing the observing. This is why we can't really alter the metaphysically given facts of reality with our consciousness.

And believe me, it's not like I would mind being able to alter reality, making trees grow $100 dollar bills, and using the "force" like the Jedi.



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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

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Re: What the 'bleep' do we know? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #4955481 -

I've seen much better on PBS

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