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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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freebsd?
    #4885970 -

alright, i'm basically a purist. from what i've heard and read it sounds like there are a lot of people who are of the opinion that bsd systems, and freebsd in particular, are the open *nix OS to use. freebsd is supposed to be secure, fast, and most of all, stable as hell.

i've actually had it installed before but i never got the hang of it. the ports tree is supposed to be one of its best features, but i didn't really like it. there were plenty of things that were not available as binaries and coming from debian, that wasn't something i was happy with. i don't like waiting for things to compile. i guess if i could get the package management working well, i might like it.

is it a good system? more unix-like? major differences from linux? worth leaving the user-friendliness of ubuntu? worth simply dual booting?

*sorry for asking all these sorts of questions.... i'd get flamed to death for asking them on a *nix board!


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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4885992 -

As I understand it, BSD is in fact a flavor of Unix - derived from the UC Berkely version, in fact.

Back in the day, just about every university and each corporation had their own hacked unix. BSD comes from one of these, that was open-sourced under the BSD license.

Linux was started from scratch in the early 90s, and is similar to unix but not actually a version of unix.


I've never had BSD on my desktop. I like Ubuntu because I like linux and I like having shit taken care of for me. If you're a little more of the hacker-mentality, then BSD might be for you. :shrug:

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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4886714 -

bsd for linux users

whats different in bsd than in linux

Edited by bi0 (11/03/05 01:08 AM)

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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4889578 -

Mac OSX is built upon a FreeBSD core. I think it stands as a testament to it's design that Apple would trust it's reputation with it.


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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.

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Re: freebsd? [Re: Prosgeopax]
    #4889650 -

What Apple has done with the FreeBSD tools is great, but OS X
does not use the FreeBSD kernel, it uses the Mach microkernel. The FreeBSD kernel is monolithic. I really like FreeBSD. The documentation rocks, but it is impractical as a desktop OS. It will work, but it requires a shit load of work. BSD and Linux are subtley different. FreeBSD makes a better server in my opinion, but Linux is better on the desktop. FreeBSD tends to move much more slowley than Linux so in many respects it is like Linux 2 years ago where drivers are concerned. You can't use a USB keyboard without a kernel compile.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4889830 -

i don't think i'm going to bother with it. if i used it, it would really just be for educational purposes, but i'm not a network or computer expert by trade or by training, and i doubt i ever will be. i have no problems whatsoever with ubuntu. ubuntu works great on the desktop, and it's good to be familiar with the system i recommend to people who want to try linux.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4890552 -

I love freebsd because it is so versatile, quick, and secure. The darwin kernel mac uses is based on the BSD kernel. FreeBSD does not require as much work as people think, the only 'work' I have had to do was create a shell script (all its was is 'dhclient ath0') for my NIC. Also it is ALOT better for wireless than linux, almost every card works with it out of the box.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: ThePredator]
    #4890921 -

Quote:
Also it is ALOT better for wireless than linux, almost every card works with it out of the box.


wow really?

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Re: freebsd? [Re: ThePredator]
    #4891030 -

I will keep the wireless support in mind should I get a laptop. When I install an OS these days I like it ready to go for desktop after the install. I used to go for Gentoo stage 1 installs, but I am tired of that. In Linux I use Kubuntu or Suse. I set up a FreeBSD file server at work and administer it as a headless server. It outperforms the old Novell servers there by leaps and bounds...and the hardware is older.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: freebsd? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4891076 -

the reason it's so stable is because when you compile something for your system, you aren't depending on whatever shmuck decided to start maintaining a package.

if you want it done right, DIY.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: blink]
    #4891388 -

I've looked into FreeBSD, just because I like to get my feet wet with all OSes, but I run Gentoo now, and haven't heard of any significant advantage that FreeBSD has over it.


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Supercollider? I just met her!

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Re: freebsd? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4895043 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
but OS X does not use the FreeBSD kernel, it uses the Mach microkernel.


Can you please elaborate a little, as Apple claims that the version 10.4 kernel is based on FreeBSD 5 and Mach 3.0. I'm interested in OS X because Apple will be going to an Intel based platform next year and I've been thinking about getting away from the MS operating systems.


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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.

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Re: freebsd? [Re: Prosgeopax]
    #4895066 -

i use os x a bit. i'm impressed. it's a solid system. the only edge windows has anymore is that some people need it for applications. most people would probably be best with a mac. it's easy to use and rock solid.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4895071 -

i've had an installation of DesktopBSD on my machine for a while but i haven't booted it for some time. i've been playing around with it a little as of late. it's basically just freebsd with a nice installer and kde installed and ready to go by default.

it seems alright i suppose. my problem is that i just don't get the ports system. there are tons of ports that are not available as binary packages it seems. i'm not ok with that. this computer is meant to do things i want it to, not compile software. i do like the idea of freebsd though and i'd consider running it if i could get the hang of the ports system.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4896044 -

Why would you want ports for anything other than compiling software? What's so bad about compiling? Typical desktop apps take no more than a minute or two, and even then you can do other stuff while you compile.


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Supercollider? I just met her!

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Re: freebsd? [Re: supercollider]
    #4897151 -

yeah, i don't understand your aversion to compiling software either. sure, it is very clean to have a system entirely apt-got or to have binary packages, but for a truly diy system, building from source is the only way to go.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: supercollider]
    #4897735 -

i'm running it right now. doing a portupgrade. only compiling when binaries aren't available.


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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4898697 -

and it's taking FOREVER anyway.

edit: still going. maybe it'll be a little closer to finished in the morning. it'll probably be hung up at a question prompt though.

day 2...


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Edited by wilshire (11/06/05 12:29 AM)

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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4900450 -

i don't think running freebsd on a desktop is for me. linux works very well.

i don't really understand the relationship between the bsd's, linux, and unix. i often see freebsd refered to as 'freebsd unix', while with linux os's, we've got 'gnu's not unix'.

i know that UNIX can mean different things... an actual type of operating system, a development philosophy, or a trademarked name you pay the open group for permission to use.

from the perspective of the latter, neither the bsd's nor linux is unix. they are only unix-like.

what does that mean though? from what i can gather, freebsd is derived from bsd unix, while the linux kernel is derived from minix.

i've heard it said that linux is a unix "clone" which works like unix but doesn't contain any unix code. freebsd on the other hand, is a direct descendent of a true unix.

it's confusing, and it probably isn't that important a distinction anyway, but i'm just curious.

is freebsd unix? is linux unix? what does it mean for linux to behave like a unix but not contain any of the same code?


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Edited by wilshire (11/06/05 01:08 PM)

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Re: freebsd? [Re: wilshire]
    #4902943 -

see the 1st link I posted...

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Science and Technology
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