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InvisibleLysergium
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Registered: 07/18/04
Posts: 70
Loc: Canada
Mercury amalgam fillings *DELETED*
    #4038038 - 04/10/05 07:45 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lysergium

Reason for deletion: ...



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OfflineRetired
Registered: 03/01/05
Posts: 635
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Lysergium]
    #4038043 - 04/10/05 07:46 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

i dont know what a mercury amalgam filling is so? cant help


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Retired]
    #4038080 - 04/10/05 07:52 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Silver looking fillings in your mouth. Older fillings were made of a mercury amalgam. I believe newer fillings are made of ceramics or some other non-metal.

Fortunately mercury amalgams used in dentistry are insoluble thus not a health threat.

Are we to believe that marijuana is bad simply because pH Up uses Sodium Hydroxide a caustic chemical? No. Likewise simply because a filling used in dentistry uses mercury does not mean of it's own accord that it is unhealthy.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Offlinecb9fl
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Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4038098 - 04/10/05 07:56 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dental_amalgam_controversy

Quote:

Mercury amalgams have been suspected by some practitioners of integrative or alternative medicine of causing many (often multi-systemic, vague) physical problems. They reason being that, since mercury is poisonous, so must be anything containing mercury; hence, amalgams are poisonous. This argument however ignores the difference between a metal and an alloy.




--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleLysergium
Shroom
Registered: 07/18/04
Posts: 70
Loc: Canada
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings *DELETED* [Re: cb9fl]
    #4038185 - 04/10/05 08:23 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lysergium

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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Lysergium]
    #4038224 - 04/10/05 08:34 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Also they are banned in Sweden, Germany, Denmark, and Austria but still used by over 90% of denists in the US.




http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-common-practice.html

Shrooms are illegal in many countries, does that make it right?


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleLysergium
Shroom
Registered: 07/18/04
Posts: 70
Loc: Canada
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings *DELETED* [Re: cb9fl]
    #4038357 - 04/10/05 09:14 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lysergium

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InvisibleDNKYD
Turtle!

Registered: 09/24/04
Posts: 12,326
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Lysergium]
    #4038423 - 04/10/05 09:35 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I got way too many fillings, both metal and those newfangled ones that look like they're hardly there. Haven't had any problems with them except when I chew balls of aluminum foil.


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Offlinefresh313
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: DNKYD]
    #4038455 - 04/10/05 09:44 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

i wouldnt put any heavy metals into my body willingly, ask for composites if you get a filling, i dont think they pose any danger though, of the small amt of vapor that is released most of it will not go into the lungs and it is not readily absorbed in the gut


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Offlinecb9fl
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Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Lysergium]
    #4038601 - 04/10/05 10:19 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

You a dentist or something?




Not at all. If a person can provide multiple sources from the applicable sources which I would consider to be from bias such as chemistry and human biology then I will reconsider my position.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Invisiblebadchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 12,027
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040090 - 04/11/05 08:45 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Well, from a quick medline search it seems this is similar to other environmental health risks: Mercury fillings certainly don't seem to be good for you (which is why I don't believe they're being used anymore).

However, the extent of "How bad" they are for you is somewhat controversial.


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...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436


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OfflinetrendalM
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040138 - 04/11/05 09:32 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I have first-hand evidence that mercury amalgam fillings DO break down and even disintigrate over time. My mother has had to get most of her mercury fillings replaced over the last 5 years because they were literally falling apart in her mouth. I have other older family members who this has happened to. I think this is because the mercury slowly dissolves out of the amalgam, and when enough has left the amalgam the other alloys become brittle and powdery.

Now that quote you posted with the highlighted part is rather silly, because we are not talking about mercury ALLOY here at all, we are talking about LIQUID MERCURY mixed into another metal alloy. That doesn't make it a mercury alloy, it makes it a mercury amalgam. The mercury is not really bound to the other alloy, just dissolved into it.

You can make a mercury/copper amalgam pretty easily: just dip a copper penny into some mercury. It will come out silver, and NO ammount of scrubbing will take the mercury off - it is not simply plating the copper, it has dissolved INTO the copper. It's almost as easy though to get the mercury out of the copper, once you realise that it ISN'T bound to the copper, just dissolved into it. Heating the penny over a flame will cause the mercury to vaporize and leave the copper the way it was.

So if mercury is THAT easy to get out of a mercury/copper amalgam, what makes you think it is so hard to get it out of a dental amalgam?


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: trendal]
    #4040259 - 04/11/05 10:47 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

So if mercury is THAT easy to get out of a mercury/copper amalgam, what makes you think it is so hard to get it out of a dental amalgam?

A=B does not mean C=B.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflinetrendalM
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040278 - 04/11/05 10:55 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

So what is C?

And what makes you think one amalgam is fundamentally different from another?


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: trendal]
    #4040305 - 04/11/05 11:08 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

C is a different mercury amalgam than A.

The burden of proof doesn't rest with me. You're the one making the claim.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Offlinecb9fl
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Posts: 3,104
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040324 - 04/11/05 11:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I'm not advocating the use of mercury amalgam fillings since their are alternatives. However someone that currently has mercury amalgam fillings doesn't need to worry about it.

http://www.dentalwatch.org/hg/atsdr.html

However, it should be kept in mind that exposure to very small amounts of mercury, such as that from dental amalgam fillings, does not necessarily pose a health risk.

Whether the levels of exposure to mercury vapor from dental amalgam are sufficiently high to cause adverse health effects, and exactly what those effects are, continues to be researched and debated by scientists and health officials. U.S. government summaries on the effects of dental amalgam conclude that there is no apparent health hazard to the general population, but that further study is needed to determine the possibility of more subtle behavioral or immune system effects, and to determine the levels of exposure that may lead to adverse effects in sensitive populations.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: Lysergium]
    #4040331 - 04/11/05 11:17 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Lysergium said:
Then go to www.pubmed.com and type in "mercury amalgam". Tons of studies done on the shit.




Did you read the results of the studies? A lot of them seem to be finding no problems. I can't find any that make a conclusive link between mercury fillings and disease.

And just because Google has lots of stuff, doesn't mean anything. Just because lots of people know about something, doesn't mean it's not bullshit.


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OfflinetrendalM
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040351 - 04/11/05 11:23 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

One of the basic tenets of science is that physical phenomena happen under the same framework, no matter where they are in time/space. Concluding that one mercury amalgam will function in a fundamentally different manner from another mercury amalgam (or ANY amalgam, for that matter) is to take a step outside the bounds of science.

If you have taken that step, than nothing I can say will prove a thing to you.

I suggested a simple experiment to demonstrate the properties of amalgams in general, and mercury amalgams in specific. That was the proof, though it now seems unlikely that you will even read about similar experiments, let alone attempt it yourself.


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OfflinetrendalM
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: cb9fl]
    #4040358 - 04/11/05 11:25 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Please note that I am not arguing that mercury fillings will cause health issues.

Just that the mercury DOES leak out of the fillings over time.


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InvisibleYidakiMan
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Re: Mercury amalgam fillings [Re: trendal]
    #4040416 - 04/11/05 11:47 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Not that I am your mothers dentist or omnipotent, but I think it is much more likely that your mothers' fillings were falling out because of further decay of tooth around the filling.

I personally have never had a filling fall out on its own as it "disintigrated", it always fell out because of decay around it.

But then, my childhood dentist was a bleeping moron. He'd only half fill cavities and leave decay behind the filling. I really think that a lot of dentists in the U.S. are scam artists.


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