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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store
    #3760728 - 02/10/05 09:21 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)


Damn, I'm posting a lot of stuff today.


http://www.cbc.ca/story/business/national/2005/02/09/walmart-050209.html


Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store

Last Updated Thu, 10 Feb 2005 07:48:57 EST

CBC News
MISSISSAUGA, ONT. - Wal-Mart Canada is closing its store in Jonquiere, Que., the company announced Wednesday ? six months after the store became the first Wal-Mart to be unionized in North America.

Wal-Mart said it was unable to reach a tentative agreement with the union that would "permit it to operate the store in an efficient and profitable matter."

In a news release, Wal-Mart said it had told the United Food and Commercial Workers union during negotiations for a first contract that the store's financial situation was "precarious."

The company said the union's demands would have required more hiring and added hours.

But the union disputed Wal-Mart's contention that the closing was for financial reasons. UFCW Canada spokesman Michael Forman told CBC Business News the closing was "a gross infraction of labour practice" and "an assault on all Canadians" and said the union would continue the fight.

But he acknowledged that it would make other Wal-Mart employees think twice before voting for union accreditation.

Canadian Press quoted one employee at the store, which is 250 kilometres north of Quebec City, as saying many workers burst into tears when managers told them about the closing.

The store, which has about 190 employees, will close in May.

Last week, the union asked the Quebec minister of labour for binding arbitration to reach a contract in Jonquiere. The union said no progress had been made.

Another Quebec Wal-Mart, in Saint-Hyacinthe, won union certification in January.

Wal-Mart, which the UFCW calls "staunchly anti-union," is facing certification applications at about a dozen other locations in Quebec, Saskatchewan and British Columbia ? including applications representing workers at seven Wal-Mart Tire & Lube Express departments in B.C.

Wal-Mart has 235 stores in Canada, employing more than 60,000 people.


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Invisibleniteowl
GrandPaw
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Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3760773 - 02/10/05 09:49 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

We tried to get a Union in our factory.

WOW!

The owners were NOT happpy. They fought the union everyway they could.
The union didnt get in, becaues of LOTS of new employees who were bullied into voting against the union.

The factory needs a union BAD.


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Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
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Registered: 11/08/02
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3761409 - 02/10/05 01:23 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

another PR victory for WalMart!


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3762052 - 02/10/05 03:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

One of my engineering management professors was a retired vice-pres with P&G. He said that he would close a plant down before allowing a plant to go union. He also said that he made absolute sure that non-union plant employees always had better benefits than union plants.


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #3762356 - 02/10/05 04:36 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

When you have uneducated people with no job training or self-motivation wanting to make beaucoup bucks, this is what happens.


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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Offlinecb9fl
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Registered: 06/12/03
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: SoopaX]
    #3762386 - 02/10/05 04:40 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Maybe they just feel if a large company is going to open shop in their town and cause most of the local shops to go out of business it should provide proper replacement positions.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflineJesusChrist
Son Of God
Registered: 02/19/04
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: Seuss]
    #3762492 - 02/10/05 05:00 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
One of my engineering management professors was a retired vice-pres with P&G. He said that he would close a plant down before allowing a plant to go union. He also said that he made absolute sure that non-union plant employees always had better benefits than union plants.




P&G basically created a company union of their own so that they can control both sides. To their credit they pay well and take care of people. If your prof was a VP he made a shit load of coin. They don't have VP's like some banks or other companies. VP at P&G is big time.


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Tastes just like chicken


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Registered: 11/13/04
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3762786 - 02/10/05 06:13 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

They can "feel" however they want. You could "feel" that we should shoot those damn jews that run<insert company ,media or bank here>, but that doesn't mean it's right. If they don't want a wal-mart, don't shop there. If this is so bad for the local community, why are people flocking thre instead of the mom-and-pop stores? If those stores were better, they'd be the ones thriving.


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: SoopaX]
    #3763928 - 02/10/05 09:27 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

why are people flocking thre instead of the mom-and-pop stores?

My guess would be that many people don't think about the consequences of their actions, they only think about short term benefits. I actually don't shop at Walmart even though it costs more to shop elsewhere.

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:NOn...onomy&hl=en

Quote:

After carefully and comprehensively accounting for other local determinants of poverty, we find that the presence of Wal-Mart unequivocally raised family poverty rates in US counties during the 1990s relative to places that had no such stores. This was true not only as a consequence of existing stores in a county in 1987, but it was also an independent outcome of the location of new stores between 1987 and 1998. The question whether the cost of relatively higher poverty in a county is offset by the benefits of lower prices and wider choices available to consumers associated with a Wal-Mart store cannot be answered here. However, if Wal-Mart does contribute to a higher poverty rate, then it is not bearing the full economic and social costs of its business practices. Instead, Wal-Mart transfers income from the working poor and from taxpayers though welfare-programs directed at the poor to stockholders and the heirs of the Wal-Mart fortune, as well as to consumers.




--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Invisibleblacksabbathrulz
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Registered: 05/22/02
Posts: 2,511
Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764022 - 02/10/05 09:45 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Good for Walmart. Seriously.


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.


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: blacksabbathrulz]
    #3764116 - 02/10/05 10:00 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Instead, Wal-Mart transfers income from the working poor and from taxpayers though welfare-programs directed at the poor to stockholders and the heirs of the Wal-Mart fortune, as well as to consumers.

You realize that You and I are paying for these welfare programs?


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764185 - 02/10/05 10:11 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

That's one of the most poorly conducted "research" projects I've seen in quite a while. The methodology described in no way comes even close to supporting the conclusion they quote at the end.

I was reading through it, nodding here and there.. "uh huh... right... mmmm -- perhaps, let's see... uh huh...." and then it just stopped, and this completely unconnected conclusion pops up! Walmart causes poverty. Right out of the blue with absolutely no prior foundation. These guys have no understanding of the concept of causality and how to establish it has occurred. If this was an undergraduate assignment it would receive a failing grade. Who are these schmucks anyway?


Gibberish.



Phred


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: Phred]
    #3764213 - 02/10/05 11:16 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I can understand not agreeing with one study but just do a little research. You'll see that Walmart has programs in place teaching it's employees how to receive federal and state aid for low income families. Cheap prices don't magically occur. Walmart takes advantage of societies whether they reside in the US or on foreign soil.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764255 - 02/10/05 11:26 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
I can understand not agreeing with one study but just do a little research. You'll see that Walmart has programs in place teaching it's employees how to receive federal and state aid for low income families. Cheap prices don't magically occur. Walmart takes advantage of societies whether they reside in the US or on foreign soil.



I'm sure they do, but it is not Wallmart's fault that these programs exist. A business will do whatever it can to make a profit. When the government enters the market (labor or otherwise) business will try to profit from it if they can.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: z@z.com]
    #3764287 - 02/10/05 11:34 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

And that continues a bad cycle of more government involvement through more welfare programs because of decreased employee benefits. How is it right for the employer to benefit from government welfare programs while having lobying groups to fight for their rights while it is wrong for the employees to band together forming a Union fighting for their rights?

(btw is Union supposed to be capitalized in that sentence?)


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764336 - 02/10/05 11:48 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

You'll see that Walmart has programs in place teaching it's employees how to receive federal and state aid for low income families.




And why do you see this as bad? WalMart didn't create those programs, the government did. All WalMart is doing is advising its employees on how to obtain benefits the government has made available to those knowledgeable enough to apply for them. Advocacy groups and social agencies for the poor do the exact same thing -- without providing actual jobs.


Phred


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: Phred]
    #3764377 - 02/10/05 11:58 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Well it is Walmart's right and I won't dispute that but I do dispute the programs.

As for finding it bad that is because I do not want to support Walmart. If Walmart is employing people based on their ability to use tax payer dollars then even though I openly disagree with Walmart they are still able to use my money to help their employees. By doing so they are able to pay their employees less and increase profit, my money is helping increase their profits against my express will.


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764521 - 02/11/05 12:46 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
How is it right for the employer to benefit from government welfare programs while having lobying groups to fight for their rights while it is wrong for the employees to band together forming a Union fighting for their rights?



It isn't right, but it is also unavoidable. If wallmart wants to fire all union workers I have no problem with it. If wallmart workers want to try and unionize I have no problem with it. If the government wants to try and forcibly take my money and give it to others I have a big problem with it. I have absolutely no problems with unions as long as they don't use the government to force businesses to accept them.


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: cb9fl]
    #3764538 - 02/11/05 12:51 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
As for finding it bad that is because I do not want to support Walmart. If Walmart is employing people based on their ability to use tax payer dollars then even though I openly disagree with Walmart they are still able to use my money to help their employees. By doing so they are able to pay their employees less and increase profit, my money is helping increase their profits against my express will.



Any social program does the same thing. My money is frequently used to pay people too lazy to work. I don't want them to have my money. So what do you think we should do with these social programs?


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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Offlinecb9fl
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Registered: 06/12/03
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Re: Wal-Mart to close unionized Quebec store [Re: z@z.com]
    #3764563 - 02/11/05 12:57 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Hah I knew that would come up.

I definately feel the federal government should abolish all social programs and eliminate income taxes. Without federal involvement we would have 50 different states acting as 50 different experiments in the best policies.

When it comes to State policies I honestly can't say what I feel is "right" or best. For example since We live in a representative government I feel each person needs to be educated. If there was not public education then many people may end up with no education. I don't want uneducated people making decisions which may affect my life so I can understand the reasoning behind public education.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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