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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: Nokumana] * 1
    #29450803 -

Nokumana said:
Is this conversation strictly about rock drummers? My musical tastes and experience is pretty widely varied but most of my favorite drummers are on the funk/soul side of the spectrum:
Zigiboo Modeliste, Russel Batiste (RIP), Ritchie Hayward (RIP), David Garibaldi (Tower of power), to name a few.



No. Some of the drummers I have mentioned are not rock.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AZ Starman2112] * 1
    #29450808 -

AZ Starman2112 said:
So many drummers that haven’t been mentioned here. There are really some guys that stand out that aren’t mainstream in the popular eyes that are just phenomenal. Also guys in the bands of solo acts that just never even get their name out because their just not out there in front or even get to been seen or acknowledged.



Very well said, AZ. I'm amazed on the regular by relatively unknown drummers (all sorts of musicians actually) I see just posting on TokTok. Couldn't name them to save my life but there are so many talented people out there.


--------------------
-Noku
Eskawata kaya waikiki
HHG
"Shake it like you would a newborn baby" - BeefExtreme

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: Nokumana] * 1
    #29450847 -

Nokumana said:
Is this conversation strictly about rock drummers? My musical tastes and experience is pretty widely varied but most of my favorite drummers are on the funk/soul side of the spectrum:
Zigiboo Modeliste, Russel Batiste (RIP), Ritchie Hayward (RIP), David Garibaldi (Tower of power), to name a few.



Thanks for these, my friend. I've been diggin' funk/soul lately & this helps me expand my listening!

:peace:


--------------------
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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: B Traven]
    #29450882 -

B Traven said:
Gilmour Hendrix said:
Tim Alexander, Terry Bozzio, Ginger Baker and Dale Crover are some of my favorite drummers.

Edit: Ginger Baker should need no explanation. Tim is from early Primus (Frizzle Fry, Sailing the Seas of Cheese, Pork Soda), Terry Bozzio played for Zappa, Dale Crover of Melvins. Houdini, Stag, and Stoner Witch are my favorite Melvins albums. Throw Bullhead in there too.



No love for Gluey Porch Treatments?

I don't know how true this is, but my dad told me that Ginger Baker busted his ass and got real good because he thought he was the worst player in Cream.



I'm not as familiar with that album. I'll listen to it on the way home from work this afternoon.

Check out some of the documentaries on GB. It's very interesting.


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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: Gilmour Hendrix] * 1
    #29450889 -

Gilmour Hendrix said:
B Traven said:
Gilmour Hendrix said:
Tim Alexander, Terry Bozzio, Ginger Baker and Dale Crover are some of my favorite drummers.

Edit: Ginger Baker should need no explanation. Tim is from early Primus (Frizzle Fry, Sailing the Seas of Cheese, Pork Soda), Terry Bozzio played for Zappa, Dale Crover of Melvins. Houdini, Stag, and Stoner Witch are my favorite Melvins albums. Throw Bullhead in there too.



No love for Gluey Porch Treatments?

I don't know how true this is, but my dad told me that Ginger Baker busted his ass and got real good because he thought he was the worst player in Cream.



I'm not as familiar with that album. I'll listen to it on the way home from work this afternoon.

Check out some of the documentaries on GB. It's very interesting.



Oh, yeah, my friend recommended one to me a couple weeks ago.

I don't remember all the details, but I know that some of the songs on Gluey Porch Treatments were re-recorded on later albums.


--------------------


ACAB  🖕🧊


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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: B Traven] * 1
    #29450892 -

B Traven said:
The reality is that Ringo Starr WAS an incredible drummer. He did exactly what needed to be done across their entire catalog, and was able to bring needed art and technique while still remaining largely invisible.

I totally understand all the reasons that people hate The Beatles, including just basic aesthetic ones, but I still think one has to acknowledge WHAT they did, and WHEN. And I mean, specifically, physically, what they did. Touring, recording, and generating that much truly original content was a whole other ball of wax in those days.

I confess that I understand the appeal and technical/artistic genius of Queen, but still can't stand them. I go back and forth on The Beatles. Listened to them a bunch in early adolescence, but I feel like that's mandatory for a lot of kids.



You make a good Ringo point and I’ll concede to that. I guess being in a band with 3 (maybe 4, since Paul is dead) megalomaniacs who were always arguing will make someone fade into the background. I don’t ever say the Beatles suck, just that I never quite got the appeal. I’m also in the minority with this opinion, so it probably stems from being inundated with them during my grammar years.

I’m kinda with you with Queen. Massive talent and wrote amazing stuff, I just never really could get down with it.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AstroSporeFiend]
    #29450893 -

Clyde Stubblefield, Tony Allen, Carleton Barrett

Edit Al Jackson Jr, also

This guy :lol:



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Learn it, know it, live it


Edited by Mackload (01/09/26 01:05 PM)

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AstroSporeFiend] * 2
    #29450907 -

AstroSporeFiend said:
B Traven said:
The reality is that Ringo Starr WAS an incredible drummer. He did exactly what needed to be done across their entire catalog, and was able to bring needed art and technique while still remaining largely invisible.

I totally understand all the reasons that people hate The Beatles, including just basic aesthetic ones, but I still think one has to acknowledge WHAT they did, and WHEN. And I mean, specifically, physically, what they did. Touring, recording, and generating that much truly original content was a whole other ball of wax in those days.

I confess that I understand the appeal and technical/artistic genius of Queen, but still can't stand them. I go back and forth on The Beatles. Listened to them a bunch in early adolescence, but I feel like that's mandatory for a lot of kids.



You make a good Ringo point and I’ll concede to that. I guess being in a band with 3 (maybe 4, since Paul is dead) megalomaniacs who were always arguing will make someone fade into the background. I don’t ever say the Beatles suck, just that I never quite got the appeal. I’m also in the minority with this opinion, so it probably stems from being inundated with them during my grammar years.

I’m kinda with you with Queen. Massive talent and wrote amazing stuff, I just never really could get down with it.



Ive noticed the Beatles are only viewed that way by people after their time.

The Beatles drove a musical revolution. So many firsts came from them


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: tryptkaloids] * 1
    #29450992 -

tryptkaloids said:
AstroSporeFiend said:
B Traven said:
The reality is that Ringo Starr WAS an incredible drummer. He did exactly what needed to be done across their entire catalog, and was able to bring needed art and technique while still remaining largely invisible.

I totally understand all the reasons that people hate The Beatles, including just basic aesthetic ones, but I still think one has to acknowledge WHAT they did, and WHEN. And I mean, specifically, physically, what they did. Touring, recording, and generating that much truly original content was a whole other ball of wax in those days.

I confess that I understand the appeal and technical/artistic genius of Queen, but still can't stand them. I go back and forth on The Beatles. Listened to them a bunch in early adolescence, but I feel like that's mandatory for a lot of kids.



You make a good Ringo point and I’ll concede to that. I guess being in a band with 3 (maybe 4, since Paul is dead) megalomaniacs who were always arguing will make someone fade into the background. I don’t ever say the Beatles suck, just that I never quite got the appeal. I’m also in the minority with this opinion, so it probably stems from being inundated with them during my grammar years.

I’m kinda with you with Queen. Massive talent and wrote amazing stuff, I just never really could get down with it.



Ive noticed the Beatles are only viewed that way by people after their time.

The Beatles drove a musical revolution. So many firsts came from them



You know, you make a good point, Tryp. I’d have to put myself in the mindset of a 1950s soda jerk. Most mainstream culture was pretty watered down at that point. And here come 4 bowl cuts from the UK to shake things up a bit. Looking back on things, I guess it’s easy to overlook their influence on music and culture. But if one was there in that moment, I’m sure it was much more obvious.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AstroSporeFiend] * 2
    #29451034 -

I jumped straight to the bottom and as soon as you said four dudes with bowl cuts I instantly knew you were talking about the Beatles.
"who else would do that?"
:lolsy:

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AstroSporeFiend] * 1
    #29451048 -

AstroSporeFiend said:
tryptkaloids said:
AstroSporeFiend said:
B Traven said:
The reality is that Ringo Starr WAS an incredible drummer. He did exactly what needed to be done across their entire catalog, and was able to bring needed art and technique while still remaining largely invisible.

I totally understand all the reasons that people hate The Beatles, including just basic aesthetic ones, but I still think one has to acknowledge WHAT they did, and WHEN. And I mean, specifically, physically, what they did. Touring, recording, and generating that much truly original content was a whole other ball of wax in those days.

I confess that I understand the appeal and technical/artistic genius of Queen, but still can't stand them. I go back and forth on The Beatles. Listened to them a bunch in early adolescence, but I feel like that's mandatory for a lot of kids.



You make a good Ringo point and I’ll concede to that. I guess being in a band with 3 (maybe 4, since Paul is dead) megalomaniacs who were always arguing will make someone fade into the background. I don’t ever say the Beatles suck, just that I never quite got the appeal. I’m also in the minority with this opinion, so it probably stems from being inundated with them during my grammar years.

I’m kinda with you with Queen. Massive talent and wrote amazing stuff, I just never really could get down with it.



Ive noticed the Beatles are only viewed that way by people after their time.

The Beatles drove a musical revolution. So many firsts came from them



You know, you make a good point, Tryp. I’d have to put myself in the mindset of a 1950s soda jerk. Most mainstream culture was pretty watered down at that point. And here come 4 bowl cuts from the UK to shake things up a bit. Looking back on things, I guess it’s easy to overlook their influence on music and culture. But if one was there in that moment, I’m sure it was much more obvious.



A similar issue arises with a lot of early punk bands now. Bands that sound exactly like the dozens of other bands who copied them.

There's also just the passage of time. People who start off strong and then die young tend to be idolized. People who start off strong and then end up working acwolid career for multiple decades tend to b3come just household names. Those who start off strong and then end up going off the tails tend to be retroactively trashed and villainized. Even though the third option is probably the most common one for artists, aside from just retiring while you're ahead and doing something else.

It's entirely possible that you wouldn't have liked The Beatles much back in rye day, either. I figure if I brought my current self back to those days, I'd probably be most interested in The Animals. But I don't think we could have denied the revolution that was happening.

But in all seriousness, I think that most of the music I listen to has some sort of technical roots in what The Beatles and Sabbath did. Between those two, I think you can find blueprints for a lot of stuff that came much later.


--------------------


ACAB  🖕🧊


Edited by B Traven (01/09/26 04:22 PM)

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: B Traven]
    #29451054 -

Dave Weckl hasn’t been mentioned yet. That guy can play the drums as well.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: B Traven]
    #29451060 -

So I was really thinking this over a lot, because I have down time at work each at different intervals and basically when I work I work alone half the time, so I have time to think. We talked about a lot of drummers. I think that these guys all deserve their place in history. Some rock, some jazz, some session, some touring, other from various types of music. So here is my list of guys that are absolutely phenomenal drummers that we didn’t mention in no particular order…

Billy Cobham
Abe Laboriel Jr
Steve Gadd
Dave Weckl
Simon Phillips
Jeff Porcaro
Cactus Moser
Carter Buford
Matt Billingslea
Vinny Amico
Vinnie Colaiuta
Phil Collins
Ian Paice
Bill Bruford
Steve Smith
Guy Gelso
Max Weinberg
Ed Shaughnessy
Cozy Powell
Kris Myers
Liberty Devito

I know others can be added, but these guys are also definitely tops on their game and schooled musicians. Sometimes the band they were in didn’t showcase their talents because they don’t solo, and the music don’t require the best of what they have. But these guys bring it every time and they can play various styles and or long performances with precise skills. Hats off to these guys, their and individuality! 🥁

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: ambigu] * 1
    #29451061 -

ambigu said:
Dave Weckl hasn’t been mentioned yet. That guy can play the drums as well.



Ha! I just gave him props! Was typing all that out probably as you posted it! 😎

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AZ Starman2112] * 1
    #29451101 -

Camille Bigeault

There are probably less than 10 5 drummers that can polyrhythm like her.




I mean, this is a 5/7 polyrhythm poly meter base that repeats every 35 1/16 notes. Ostinato. One limb is 5/16. Another is 7/16. 6/8 shuffle on the hi hat over the top. Like wtf? How in the hell?


--------------------
You can ignore the truth to your final breath. But trust me, it will meet you there to be ignored no longer.

The answer to your question is almost always 42
“The answer is always grow more shroom.” Mr Piggy
- Those two answers coexist peacefully.

Quick Sterilization Reference for Altitude

Edited by 1NFIN8 (01/09/26 05:41 PM)

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: B Traven] * 5
    #29451165 -

B Traven said:
  quoteAstroSporeFiend said:
  quote]b]tryptkaloids said:
  quoteAstroSporeFiend said:
  quoteB Traven said:
The reality is that Ringo Starr WAS an incredible drummer. He did exactly what needed to be done across their entire catalog, and was able to bring needed art and technique while still remaining largely invisible.

I totally understand all the reasons that people hate The Beatles, including just basic aesthetic ones, but I still think one has to acknowledge WHAT they did, and WHEN. And I mean, specifically, physically, what they did. Touring, recording, and generating that much truly original content was a whole other ball of wax in those days.

I confess that I understand the appeal and technical/artistic genius of Queen, but still can't stand them. I go back and forth on The Beatles. Listened to them a bunch in early adolescence, but I feel like that's mandatory for a lot of kids./quote
----------------------
You make a good Ringo point and I’ll concede to that. I guess being in a band with 3 (maybe 4, since Paul is dead) megalomaniacs who were always arguing will make someone fade into the background. I don’t ever say the Beatles suck, just that I never quite got the appeal. I’m also in the minority with this opinion, so it probably stems from being inundated with them during my grammar years.

I’m kinda with you with Queen. Massive talent and wrote amazing stuff, I just never really could get down with it./quote
------------------------
Ive noticed the Beatles are only viewed that way by people after their time.

The Beatles drove a musical revolution. So many firsts came from them/quote
You know, you make a good point, Tryp. I’d have to put myself in the mindset of a 1950s soda jerk. Most mainstream culture was pretty watered down at that point. And here come 4 bowl cuts from the UK to shake things up a bit. Looking back on things, I guess it’s easy to overlook their influence on music and culture. But if one was there in that moment, I’m sure it was much more obvious./quote
-------------------------
A similar issue arises with a lot of early punk bands now. Bands that sound exactly like the dozens of other bands who copied them.

There's also just the passage of time. People who start off strong and then die young tend to be idolized. People who start off strong and then end up working acwolid career for multiple decades tend to b3come just household names. Those who start off strong and then end up going off the tails tend to be retroactively trashed and villainized. Even though the third option is probably the most common one for artists, aside from just retiring while you're ahead and doing something else.

It's entirely possible that you wouldn't have liked The Beatles much back in rye day, either. I figure if I brought my current self back to those days, I'd probably be most interested in The Animals. But I don't think we could have denied the revolution that was happening.

But in all seriousness, I think that most of the music I listen to has some sort of technical roots in what The Beatles and Sabbath did. Between those two, I think you can find blueprints for a lot of stuff that came much later.



------------
Nice analysis. The same thing happens with books and movies. The stuff that blew our minds when we were kids because it was cutting edge can look pretty mundane through the lens of a modern reader or movie goer.

I read Heinlein and Herbert when they were still writing. Today they get a lot of flak from readers who have been raised on the tropes that were fresh concepts when they were writing. Some of the misogyny and cultural references really suffer from a modern a perspective. Yet at the time they were breaking new ground and leading the charge to escape that kind of thinking. They both lived long enough to see some of that change in the world, but also long enough to fail to keep up with the changes. I love all of their works, including the late stage stuff, but I get why some people don't.

There are so many examples for movies. Anything that is ground breaking and popular will be copied and then satirized heavily. Then when a new comer raised on what came after sees some of the early sources for the first time, they can easily be underwhelmed. That is just the nature of progress, I suppose.

Never was a huge Beatles fan, but I didn't dislike them either. I can appreciate their historical significance without being a fan of their music. I can't think of many (any?) ground breaking artist of any kind that are consistently excellent throughout a life long career. Except Pink Floyd, of course. Kidding, I don't love the Roger Waters dominant years as much. I can happily skip the Wall and Final Cut on most play throughs.

Sorry, I had to break the quote chain to post. It looks like there is a limit to the quote depth.

Edit: because I forgot to add my point.
It was disappointing sometimes when I tried to share the things that I thought were amazing when I was a kid with my son when he was about the same age. He would be like "Okay, dad. Meh."


--------------------
Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
"Psychedelics are powerful substances. Nothing that powerful is completely safe... and nothing completely safe is that powerful!" - Abigail Calder at ALPS 2023
Don't Panic

Edited by ReverendMyc (01/09/26 07:17 PM)

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: ReverendMyc] * 2
    #29451276 -

I was lucky enough my middle son loved the same music i did when he was growing up, now he is turning me onto new music because I stopped looking I guess as i got older. just fell into what are classics today! :rofl:

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: Arkyhog] * 2
    #29451363 -

If you like complex rhythm and harmonic structure:

Punch Brothers - bluegrass-like instrumentation (usually mandolin, guitar, violin, and bass; The Phosphorescent Blues has drums) but musically much more modern and imaginative.

Brad Mehldau - jazz pianist and composer, lots of interesting stuff including some albums alternating Bach or Fauré pieces and his own compositions inspired by them. Jacob's Ladder has a great cover of Tom Sawyer and some trippy fugues. Mehliana and the Chris Thile (Punch Brothers front man) collab albums are fun too.

Steve Reich's "Drumming" is super interesting, maybe not for everyone though (not because it's inaccessible but because it's very long). Not much irregular meter, but lots of 4-against-3 polyrhythm and an interesting "phasing" technique where one of the players speeds or up slows down their tempo for a few bars and then syncs up on the downbeat of another bar.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: ReverendMyc]
    #29451367 -

ReverendMyc said:
I can't think of many (any?) ground breaking artist of any kind that are consistently excellent throughout a life long career. Except Pink Floyd, of course. Kidding, I don't love the Roger Waters dominant years as much. I can happily skip the Wall and Final Cut on most play throughs.




I’m with you on Waters. Never even liked the dude. I do like The Wall though. Curious about your take on The Division Bell?

Also, Rush never made a bad album.

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Re: The Cultivation Confessional Booth - The Unofficial Cultivation Off Topic Discussion. [Re: AZ Starman2112] * 2
    #29451373 -

Punch brothers are amazing. Chris Thiele is a wunderkind I’ve followed since they started Nickle Creek. So good.

Vapor Trails from Rush is not a good album.


--------------------
You can ignore the truth to your final breath. But trust me, it will meet you there to be ignored no longer.

The answer to your question is almost always 42
“The answer is always grow more shroom.” Mr Piggy
- Those two answers coexist peacefully.

Quick Sterilization Reference for Altitude

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