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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: bloodsheen]
    #26176642 -

Nah, we discuss it here

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25185455

and also in the book posted by SunRa. A post-capitaistic system IS inevitable, of course. But to think that it will be revolved around a thin-aired universal income and that's that, is just baseless.


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26176651 -

what legitamizes it in the future when we have the means now and the future will be here in 15 years

it would grow the economy fix all our problems immediately

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: cannabinated]
    #26176661 -

In my opinion we are absolutely no where near in range of being able to feasibly even begin the framework of restructuring society like that.  Wont be for multiple generations, I would argue. And it would likely be much longer than that considering it would be the most drastic society shift of all time and could not be done without some extreme pushback.


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26176684 -

https://www.yang2020.com/what-is-freedom-dividend-faq/

just wanted to throw it up



this song represents society after ubi is enacted

or atlanta in 2004 i cant remember

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: cannabinated] * 1
    #26176780 -

i'd rather be rich and unhappy instead of poor and miserable - immortal technique

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26177000 -

Near Dylan said:
...
I think it is silly to thin that this will inevitably come from a universal basic income, as a society that is run through 'voluntary' working would never be able to sustain a universal basic income. ...


To me, the appeal of Yang's plan is specifically that it is a low-ball basic income
but with no strings attached on how much you can work on top of it

this is where Asante's example really falls flat to me -- Yang isn't proposing you accept 1000 dollars a month and aren't allowed anything more
it's a simple straight-forward 1000 dollars a month on top of whatever you get now, unless you are reliant on government services

it is all kind of moot for me living in Canada
but if being in my current disability circumstances in the US
Yang's UBI would require me to choose between 760$ USD per month + being able to work for around 150-200$ USD on top of that before the government takes all my subsequent income
or to choose 1000$ USD per month + being able to work and be paid for whatever full standard of employment is available to me
The UBI alone is worth more money than disability payment + working can currently net me, so it warrants moving off of disability (thus shrinking the amount of government employees needed to run disability, if anyone were to decide it was something they wanted to stick with)
while the freedom to be employed on top of it means contributing to the system

the real question for me with regards to Yang's UBI proposal is simply
would the expected increase to taxes on the lower and middle class (no increase, according to the platform of taking away Amazon's tax dodging he puts forth) be less than 1000 dollars a month
like, if the UBI system tanked because Bezos bought off all the rest of the government to cripple Yang from taxing him
if the UBI resulted in a hit to me of 400$ per month increase in taxes taken from my paycheques, that is still a net gain of 600$ per month from the UBI

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Tantrika]
    #26177102 -

Yes I get exactly what you're saying

To me, in all honestly, most of what Yang is saying is barely even a good theory, let alone something that could be put into practice feasibly in a 4 year time-frame. I think it is naive to think that he will just fund this with the money he feels the government is owed by these major tax dodging companies. Just honestly sounds like an idea a kid would come up with for a school paper at the last minute. Like what, every other president just WANTED major companies to exploit tax loopholes? Fuckin obviously not lol, though im sure there will be some genius to respond to this with "the gvernment was bought out, mannnnn".

He's not the first one to try and get the money owed by these companies and he certainly wont be the last, and the fact that a substantial amount of his rhetoric REQUIRES his non-existent plan to get their tax money to be executed flawlessly even to begin to be within the realm of slim possibility of putting this into action where it doesnt end up in complete disaster and irreversible damage, is very demoralizing to me in regards to his chances at being president. He is clearly too young and inexperienced to be gunning for an office like this and it is blatantly clear every time he gets any sort of relatively difficult line of questioning instead of every interviewer holding his hand and licking his ballsack, like most seem to do.  I literally have 1000x more faith in Bernie Sanders than Yang and that's saying something.

UBI is not a ridiculous idea. But the way that many people see it, Asante especially (probably by far the most naive yet arrogantly confident perspective ive ever heard of it, good combo) makes it very clear that Yang is not catering to people who know at all what theyre talking about.

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26177104 -

This idea is older than mr Yang.


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Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

Onehomemission.org
truly make a difference

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177107 -

Literally said that in the post. Talked about it in multiple posts. Referenced threads i made and was in that talk about UBI before Yang existed in the eyes of the world. What are u TALKiNG ABOuT???? HoW DOES THAT REFUTE THE POINT ANYWAY??


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #26177109 -

Why are you so pissed off?


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

Onehomemission.org
truly make a difference

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177116 -

Ideally I’d choose health.  Realistically I think it’s pretty worthless to have great health if your living around the poverty line.  It sucks man.  Probably the money.  The highest  paid shortest life


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theRealrollforever said:
That’s not possible; even with computers

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177118 -

:badtrip:


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #26177119 -

Turn off your mind, relax and float down stream It is not dying, it is not dying..


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

Onehomemission.org
truly make a difference

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177120 -

:whateveryousayfreak:

You can tune out all u want bud, go full Leary. Your life, playa. But it kinda just abruptly ended the conversation that you yourself started and then deliberately did not participate in, but ya kno. Whatev, different strokes.


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26177125 -

It doesn't seem to be about the topic at hand, is all. Are you going through a stressful period?


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

Onehomemission.org
truly make a difference

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177134 -

Asante you are the one who brought up UBI and i am the one who said it was off-topic like CMON BRO :lol:Dont play therapist with me cuz i wanna contribute to the talk about economics and use some no-no words in it and you dont feel like having the conversation anymore. Lighten up, man. Not everything is a psychological riddle. Cant ya just have a talk or not, you gotta be questioning my psyche? Like geez man, is it cuz i used caps? :lol: What are the people in ur life typically like? Do they generally not stray from talking about infinite love or something?

Lemme participate, guy, im not breakin no rules. You started the convo and I really dont understand why u gotta be like this home boy


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Asante]
    #26177135 -

SAPs


(Sensitive About Politics) :wink:

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: larry.fisherman]
    #26177141 -

I am just waiting for someone to bring up religion


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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: Near Dylan]
    #26177142 -

Andrew Yang is the new messiah

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Re: Your money or your life? [Re: larry.fisherman]
    #26177147 -

I suppose that makes me Pilate.


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