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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #25306856 -

The Ecstatic said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
What was the last war Russia started?  :popcorn:


Georgia?


Nope.  That war was started by Georgia, according to the official EU investigation.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Seriously_trippin] * 1
    #25306928 -

Seriously_trippin said:
I don't see why we pander to tyrants like this to have peace.


What do you mean by "pander"?  How is Trump "pandering"???

Seriously_trippin said:
Putin has served as president since the 90s...


Because Putin is extremely popular in Russia and he wins democratic elections.

Seriously_trippin said:
...and ordered assassinations scare tactics and labor camps for all political opponents.


If you have proof, please share.  :popcorn:

So far, I haven't seen any.

Seriously_trippin said:
Something completely wrong and sick like unlawful invasion and Annexation of Ukraine and their continued push into Eastern Ukraine shouldn't be overlooked in the name of peace.


If you have proof Russia invaded Crimea, please share.  :popcorn:

Crimea voted to leave Ukraine after an unconstitutional US orchestrated coup against their democratically elected President.

Seriously_trippin said:
Otto came back with his teeth pulled out,blind and deaf.


He had no visible signs of torture according to a US coroner's report.

Seriously_trippin said:
The survivors that defect or escape NK have told some heart wrenching horror stories the make Dachau look merciful.


You can't rely on those stories.

Seriously_trippin said:
To sum up of course we want peace with both countries but ravishing Dictators with praise isn't productive for our president to be saying. Diplomacy doesn't have to mean kiss their asses.


Who argued we should be praising Putin or kissing his ass?  And if that gets us peace, I'd say go ahead and praise Putin.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: musiclover420]
    #25306944 -

musiclover420 said:
So you can't come up with a reason and are assuming trump has some secret magical one I see, dear leader can do no wrong I guess :shrug:


First of all, I gave you a reason.
Second, I'm not assuming anything "magic".
Third, I hate Trump, so I don't consider him my dear leader.

You should quit arguing when all you have is straw man arguments and ad hominem attacks.

musiclover420 said:
Let me ask you this, if it was Obama or Hillary meeting Putin (or any other dictator) in private do you think republicans (or even some dems for that matter) would just blindly assume it's for some secret good cause?


I think in today's political environment, neither side trusts the other, and that includes yourself.

musiclover420 said:
trump meeting putin in private seems incredibly shady especially with all the info that has come out about trump and his administrations ties to russia...


Did information finally come out about Trump's collaboration with Russia???  DO SHARE!!!


musiclover420 said:
Obama got shit from republicans for giving a salute while holding coffee, trump praises/salutes Kim and his military and suddenly the GOP loves NK. Really shows the double standards going on.


Nobody loves North Korea.  If you can't argue in good faith, move to the kindeegarten forum.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25306986 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
The Ecstatic said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
What was the last war Russia started?  :popcorn:


Georgia?


Nope.  That war was started by Georgia, according to the official EU investigation.


Yeah I couldnt remember. Hard to say then, I dont much about Russian military history post WW2 (clearly lol). But to be fair, the EU has little to gain by siding with Georgia in a war they lost, especially considering their energy needs from Russia. That said, I dont know much about that particular war. It just wouldnt be the first time Europe blamed the wrong country for starting a war because it suited them politically.

Was there anything after Afghanistan?


--------------------

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #25307013 -

Far as I know, that war is basically some rebels trying to cede from Russia. Minor civil war. Skirmish, really. Thing is, Georgia, and or an actor quite likely funded by Georgia, also did Russia's version of 9/11. Targeting children. You could see why we'd be a bit salty.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #25307108 -

The Ecstatic said:
...to be fair, the EU has little to gain by siding with Georgia in a war they lost, especially considering their energy needs from Russia.


So you're saying the EU had nothing to gain by siding with the US in blaming Russia?

The Ecstatic said:
Was there anything after Afghanistan?


Russia didn't start the war in Afghanistan though.  A new progressive Afghan Governemnt was being terrorized by Islamic extremists, and asked Russia for help defending themselves.  Russia helped the progressive Government, so the US helped the Islamic extremists, which included Osama Bin Laden.  It's the Mujahideen that actually started the Afghan war.

Correct me if I'm wrong.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #25307116 -

Nah youre right. I'm just playing devil's advocate. We all know Russia wants to maintain strategic control of the region, same as we do in our hemisphere. Theyre are demonstrably less adventurous in their imperialism than we are though. The US is the gold standard of fucking with sovereign governments.


--------------------

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Cjmckay]
    #25307186 -

Cjmckay said:
musiclover420 said:
What legitimate reason could trump have to meet with putin alone?...




Hookers


Probably just time for his performance review.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25307281 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Seriously_trippin said:
I don't see why we pander to tyrants like this to have peace.


What do you mean by "pander"?  How is Trump "pandering"???

Seriously_trippin said:
Putin has served as president since the 90s...


Because Putin is extremely popular in Russia and he wins democratic elections.

Seriously_trippin said:
...and ordered assassinations scare tactics and labor camps for all political opponents.


If you have proof, please share.  :popcorn:

So far, I haven't seen any.

Seriously_trippin said:
Something completely wrong and sick like unlawful invasion and Annexation of Ukraine and their continued push into Eastern Ukraine shouldn't be overlooked in the name of peace.


If you have proof Russia invaded Crimea, please share.  :popcorn:

Crimea voted to leave Ukraine after an unconstitutional US orchestrated coup against their democratically elected President.

Seriously_trippin said:
Otto came back with his teeth pulled out,blind and deaf.


He had no visible signs of torture according to a US coroner's report.

Seriously_trippin said:
The survivors that defect or escape NK have told some heart wrenching horror stories the make Dachau look merciful.


You can't rely on those stories.

Seriously_trippin said:
To sum up of course we want peace with both countries but ravishing Dictators with praise isn't productive for our president to be saying. Diplomacy doesn't have to mean kiss their asses.


Who argued we should be praising Putin or kissing his ass?  And if that gets us peace, I'd say go ahead and praise Putin.


There's a lot to unpack here and I still do not understand why you want to do anything to defend russia and apparently North Korea. Let's start with NK. There are thousands of people who have endured real torture,rape,starvation, and to say all the survivors are making this up. That's just twisted :sad:.

Then there's Otto, I can't believe you would tell his family North Koreans had nothing to do with being tortured and died from it.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/otto-warmbier-parents-sue-north-korea-wrongful-death-lawsuit-today-2018-04-26/ The lawsuit says that when Warmbier returned, his parents "were stunned to see his condition. Otto was blind and deaf.

He had a shaved head, a feeding tube coming out of his nose, was jerking violently and howling, and was completely unresponsive to any of their efforts to comfort him." His once straight teeth were misaligned and he had an unexplained, scarred wound on his left foot." That's fucking torture dude.

Where is your proof that there is an actual competitive election after 6 or 7 terms? 
That's bullshit to think every Russian loves Putin that much.

There is barely free press over there little alone free elections and equal news media coverage for any other candidates than him. I'm fact I just checked and he didn't debate one time during this last election. Is that what you want for America?

When you say:
Who argued we should be praising Putin or kissing his ass?  And if that gets us peace, I'd say go ahead and praise Putin. "

Who argued that we kiss Russia's ass by just letting them back in the G7 when most allied countries believe what the Russians did was unlawful?

Also saying Kim is a talented man, skilled and loves his people is pure ass kissing a leader of a silent
Isolated genocide. He didn't need to say those things for peace and also we don't know if next year Nk will be back to a standoff. That's what I mean by pandering to tyrants.


--------------------
R.I.P
Zombi3, Blue Helix
Modest Mouse
Zappa, Jellyfish
Slothie
That Kid With The face
ShLong
Le Canard
split_by_nine
& Big Worm Forever
Etched in the sands of time in the shroomery and ever so beloved and deeply missed by many :heart:

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Seriously_trippin]
    #25307357 -

Seriously_trippin said:
There's a lot to unpack here and I still do not understand why you want to do anything to defend russia and apparently North Korea.


I don't care to defend Russia or North Korea.  What I care about is the truth; I simply want us to get our facts right.

Seriously_trippin said:
Let's start with NK. There are thousands of people who have endured real torture,rape,starvation, and to say all the survivors are making this up. That's just twisted :sad:.


Did I say every single defector made things up?  No, I said many did and I provided an article to back myself up.  Let's get the facts right.

Seriously_trippin said:
Then there's Otto, I can't believe you would tell his family North Koreans had nothing to do with being tortured and died from it.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/otto-warmbier-parents-sue-north-korea-wrongful-death-lawsuit-today-2018-04-26/ The lawsuit says that when Warmbier returned, his parents "were stunned to see his condition. Otto was blind and deaf.


North Korea released Otto when his condition was deteriorating.  And I'm not telling his family he wasn't tortured - the coroner was saying he saw no signs of torture.  Once again, do you believe the coroner report, or do you believe in make believe?

Seriously_trippin said:
Where is your proof that there is an actual competitive election after 6 or 7 terms? 
That's bullshit to think every Russian loves Putin that much.


I don't how many times I've shown this, but here you go again.  Now, let's see your proof that he's not popular.  I'm tired of make beleive.

Seriously_trippin said:
There is barely free press over there little alone free elections and equal news media coverage for any other candidates than him. I'm fact I just checked and he didn't debate one time during this last election. Is that what you want for America?


They have free press and free elections.  You should visit Russia someday as I have done for the last two years and see for yourself how much criticism Putin gets.  I was actually very surprised.  They have Fox News, CNN, and all the Western media that say whatever they like.  And their election process is better than our own.  If we had a system like Russia, we wouldn't be questioning our election results.

Seriously_trippin said:
Who argued that we kiss Russia's ass by just letting them back in the G7 when most allied countries believe what the Russians did was unlawful?


I visited Crimea last summer and I know for an absolute fact that they weren't invaded by Russia.  There was an American orchestrated coup that I backed up with evidence many times, and Crimea voted to leave the country after their democratically elected president was unconstitutionally removed from power.

Seriously_trippin said:
Also saying Kim is a talented man, skilled and loves his people is pure ass kissing a leader of a silent
Isolated genocide. He didn't need to say those things for peace


I'm sure it was more effective than insulting him.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (07/03/18 11:23 PM)

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #25307370 -

I dont really see what the big deal is. Whats wrong with trump meeting with putin alone? Would probably be a good way to ease tensions and have a less formal meeting where actual productivity could take place:shrug:

I wouldn't waste my time fal, they've already drank the anti putin, Russia and trump collision koolaid. I don't blame them, American propaganda is strong and convincing. Plus red koolaid tastes pretty good and is easy to swallow  :electrickoolaid:

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25307371 -

Know we know Putin is an imperalist stooge.  But besides that, it is worth a try to make peace.


--------------------

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: starfire_xes]
    #25307405 -

Can’t make peace with someone you aren’t at war with ... lol ...
  Maybe they are just going to talk about how they have better boats than their political opposition .


--------------------


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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25308038 -

Re: Fal
Seriously_trippin said:
The survivors that defect or escape NK have told some heart wrenching horror stories the make Dachau look merciful.

You said:
“You can't rely on those stories.” You did not say “many of them” so yes please let’s stick to facts.

You said: “They have free press and free elections.  You should visit Russia someday as I have done for the last two years and see for yourself how much criticism Putin gets.  I was actually very surprised.  They have Fox News, CNN, and all the Western media that say whatever they like.  And their election process is better than our own.  If we had a system like Russia, we wouldn't be questioning our election results.”

You missed the point. He didn’t debate one candidate during the last election, there was 0 opposing candidates that got equal media coverage and there’s ALOT of Putin posters,billboard and propaganda. I say you saw what they wanted you to see,Crimea is totally different then Kiev and a continued push into eastern Ukraine. They silence the voices that want them out of the country.  If you want the American elections to not have any presidential debates or have equal time for candidates or feel like you can vote for who you want then I see that as an extremely dark path for America. We have debates because it’s a strong foundation for democracy. I certainly wouldn’t want to live in an America that mirrors Russian elections. Just because you took a vacation to Crimea doesn’t make you an expert, get over that.

Seriously_trippin said:
Also saying Kim is a talented man, skilled and loves his people is pure ass kissing a leader of a silent
Isolated genocide. He didn't need to say those things for peace


You said:
I'm sure it was more effective than insulting him.  :shrug:

Here’s the deal you can successfully be diplomatic without insulting or lavishing horrifically evil people. There is a middle ground and that’s where our president should’ve been. Kim Jong can and will take that sound bite and clips of trump saying Kim is talented and loves his people and use it as “propaganda proof”. I’m highly skeptical of everything
North Korea does. Also I should mention I think having a peace talk was ultimately good but it doesn’t mean it’ll be effective.


--------------------
R.I.P
Zombi3, Blue Helix
Modest Mouse
Zappa, Jellyfish
Slothie
That Kid With The face
ShLong
Le Canard
split_by_nine
& Big Worm Forever
Etched in the sands of time in the shroomery and ever so beloved and deeply missed by many :heart:

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25308292 -

Seriously_trippin said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Seriously_trippin said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
You can't rely on those stories.


...to say all the survivors are making this up. That's just twisted :sad:.


Did I say every single defector made things up?  No, I said many did and I provided an article to back myself up.  Let's get the facts right.


You did not say “many of them” so yes please let’s stick to facts.


I said "You can't rely on those stories", and I backed my point up.  I did not say "all the survivors are making this up"; it was YOU who said that.

Seriously_trippin said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
They have free press and free elections.  You should visit Russia someday as I have done for the last two years and see for yourself how much criticism Putin gets.  I was actually very surprised.  They have Fox News, CNN, and all the Western media that say whatever they like.  And their election process is better than our own.  If we had a system like Russia, we wouldn't be questioning our election results.


You missed the point. He didn’t debate one candidate during the last election


And?  Candidates don't have to debate their opponents here in the US either.  The choice is theirs. 

Seriously_trippin said:
there was 0 opposing candidates that got equal media coverage and there’s ALOT of Putin posters,billboard and propaganda.


So you're saying it's the same as in the US?  Because Bernie sure as hell didn't get fair coverage here.

Seriously_trippin said:
I say you saw what they wanted you to see,Crimea is totally different then Kiev and a continued push into eastern Ukraine.


How are they "pushing into Eastern Ukraine"?  The Eastern Ukrainians rejected America's takeover of their elected President, and are resisting.  That has nothing to do with Russia pushing into Eastern Ukraine, which isn't happening.  Russia may be helping Eastern Ukrainians protect themselves from a Ukrainian genocide.

Seriously_trippin said:
They silence the voices that want them out of the country.


No, they don't.  Please quit make believing.

Seriously_trippin said:
Just because you took a vacation to Crimea doesn’t make you an expert, get over that.


I never claimed I was an expert on Crimea - you made that claim.  I traveled to Crimea to find out from the people there if the US is lying or if Russia is lying, and I found out first hand it's the US that is lying.  Now, please tell us why you think you're more of an expert than someone who's been there.  :popcorn:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #25308406 -

You travelled there? Thats wild. Did you make a thread about it?


--------------------

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: The Ecstatic] * 3
    #25308482 -

I'm starting the think that the entire shroomery political forum is one person with dissociative personality disorder.


--------------------
"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Morel Guy]
    #25308679 -

Morel Guy said:
I'm starting the think that the entire shroomery political forum is one person with dissociative personality disorder.


You're all just a part of my computer's imagination.

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: Kryptos]
    #25308684 -

GET OUT OF MY HEAD :crankynoweed:


--------------------

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Re: Trump planning one-on-one meeting with Putin without aides present [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #25309527 -

The Ecstatic said:
You travelled there? Thats wild. Did you make a thread about it?


and where are the pictures and reports of interviewing people?! 

c'mon, fal.

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