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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Shpongle1] * 1
    #23598531 -

I give no thoughts to being a hippie or not a hippie.  As far as I am concerned that is an arbitrary distinction, which I realize makes me a hippy, but herbalism is a pseudoscience for the most part, even tho all the drugs I take are herbs.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: moonrockmushy] * 1
    #23598559 -

How can you call it a pseudoscience when there is tons of clinical research being done on it that shows how effective it is in many cases?  I mean... that's exactly what SCIENCE is haha.  Now if you guys go believing clueless practitioners rather than trained and educated botanists and herbalists, sure that's foolish.  But I am not advocating such behavior in the slightest.  You guys doubt the healing properties of reishi mushrooms as well (as one example)?  Educate yourselves.


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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined.  Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens. :crankey: 

- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Shpongle1] * 1
    #23598574 -

How do you cite clinical research without providing sources.  That's exactly what BULLSHIT is.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #23598655 -

I just provided a source that proved my point that there is much clinical research being done that sides in favor of the benefit of herbs and plant medicine.  I'm not doing more than that.  There is a much to search from.  Try Google, they're pretty good.  I'm not going to spoonfeed you information that is readily available.  That is the most annoying thing about internet discussion and disagreements.  If I was quoting some obscure idea that needed a specific source to verify, then sure.  If you don't know how to verify the legitimacy of the use of herbs and extracts in medicine then it's just not worth having a  discussion with you, no offense.


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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined.  Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens. :crankey: 

- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Shpongle1] * 1
    #23598693 -

I'll admit I wasn't really following.  I didn't realize you posted a bullshit source.  Doxycycline ftw lyme disease survivor here real truth.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #23598715 -

K you're missing my point bro.  I'm talking about long term treatment.  AKA people with chronic lyme disease.  You can't just take doxycycline for the rest of your life, you will fuck yourself up immensely.  Lyme does not always just go away, it depends how soon it is diagnosed.  If it's diagnosed late stage, a lot of people cannot kill it with antibiotics.


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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined.  Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens. :crankey: 

- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Shpongle1]
    #23598730 -

Yeah I don't know what I'm talking about.  Gerbalism actually sounds pretty cool.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: moonrockmushy] * 1
    #23598935 -

The buhner protocol has helped a lot of people and is herbal. I am going to be doing combo antibiotic therapy in cunjunction with herbal. I l've had lyme for a couple of years before getting tested and having it show on the western blot. So I am a little more fucked. I also tested positive for babesis which sucks.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Othyem]
    #23598945 -

Simpson oil has been a god send for managing symptoms. I'd recommend it for anyone with lyme. There have been anecdotal cases were people have become complety symptom.free from its use.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Othyem]
    #23599056 -

I had neuroborreliosis, which is basically Lyme disease in your brain, and then some.  I did about a year and a half of varied antibiotics, including a PICC line to my heart with Rocephin.  It's important to use medicines that cross the blood-brain barrier.  I had numerous brain lesions.  I could not remember how to drive home.  My head shrieked every day in pain. 

It did NOT get better for a long time.  Subsequent testing revealed I also had Babesia WA-1, a brutal little bitch of a coinfection requiring entirely different medications, not antibiotics (anti-malarials are used).  Beginning treatment made it so much worse I wouldn't have minded dying, frankly.

I could barely string sentences together.  I could not remember the beginning of a conversation long enough to follow it to the end and respond meaningfully.

My advice is:  Find a lyme-literate doctor.  They're called LLMDs.  They know their shit. 

It's not fast and it's not pretty. 

Lyme is a clinical diagnosis based on symptoms and history.  Tests can rarely be relied on.  The ELISA (the usual "first tier" test) is wrong over 50% of the time (per a Johns Hopkins study).  Mine was negative despite a known bite and rash.  The western blot I fought for (the 'second tier test') was CDC positive.  You don't need to try to figure this out if you get a good doctor.

You CAN get better from this shit.  I can now think of two things at once and I remember where shit is (mostly).  It's not a short road.  I didn't do any crispy-hippie remedies - there's no shortcut around the real deal.  You need antibiotics that can cross the blood brain barrier.  That can kill encysted B. burgdorferi bacteria where it hides in cells.  It's not an easy route but find a good doctor and don't give up.  If I had stayed with my idiot neurologist I'd be vegetative by now with a diagnosis of MS. 

I hate effing ticks.  Take care of yourselves.  Our love of mushrooms puts us squarely in the path of this evil shit.

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Queen of Kings]
    #23599062 -

shoulda drank more herbal tea duh


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A Hella Heady List of My Favorite Shroomy People - Click Here!

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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: Queen of Kings]
    #23599153 -

Queen of Kings said:
I had neuroborreliosis, which is basically Lyme disease in your brain, and then some.  I did about a year and a half of varied antibiotics, including a PICC line to my heart with Rocephin.  It's important to use medicines that cross the blood-brain barrier.  I had numerous brain lesions.  I could not remember how to drive home.  My head shrieked every day in pain. 

It did NOT get better for a long time.  Subsequent testing revealed I also had Babesia WA-1, a brutal little bitch of a coinfection requiring entirely different medications, not antibiotics (anti-malarials are used).  Beginning treatment made it so much worse I wouldn't have minded dying, frankly.

I could barely string sentences together.  I could not remember the beginning of a conversation long enough to follow it to the end and respond meaningfully.

My advice is:  Find a lyme-literate doctor.  They're called LLMDs.  They know their shit. 

It's not fast and it's not pretty. 

Lyme is a clinical diagnosis based on symptoms and history.  Tests can rarely be relied on.  The ELISA (the usual "first tier" test) is wrong over 50% of the time (per a Johns Hopkins study).  Mine was negative despite a known bite and rash.  The western blot I fought for (the 'second tier test') was CDC positive.  You don't need to try to figure this out if you get a good doctor.

You CAN get better from this shit.  I can now think of two things at once and I remember where shit is (mostly).  It's not a short road.  I didn't do any crispy-hippie remedies - there's no shortcut around the real deal.  You need antibiotics that can cross the blood brain barrier.  That can kill encysted B. burgdorferi bacteria where it hides in cells.  It's not an easy route but find a good doctor and don't give up.  If I had stayed with my idiot neurologist I'd be vegetative by now with a diagnosis of MS. 

I hate effing ticks.  Take care of yourselves.  Our love of mushrooms puts us squarely in the path of this evil shit.


God thats horrible your incredibly strong just fro surviving that congratulations.
May I ask what antibiotics you used? Also I dont think anyone needs to think herbal medicine cant be effective for some treatments in conjunction with antibiotics whether its Lyme or some other illness many conventional medicine thats used today was derived from a plant or herb or whatever the fuck you want to call it its not hippy bullshit.
It can save lives and real doctors do recommend that occasionally depending on the situation. Think of all the amazing alkaloids discovered in plants that have been shown promising results in destroying cancer or helping other illness in such a significant way its pretty much a miracle.
Wish I could think of some examples right now but I am tired lol and I dont think its healthy to downplay it by calling it hippy bullshit or something similar to that.
That being said im not arguing that Lyme requires a course of antibiotics nor am I trying to recommend anyone follow some untested protocol. But no need to put a stigma on plants that could save someones life thats not healthy or a safe thing to do and its kinda offensive. ( I was trying to format that in a short block didnt really do a good job sorry if thats hard to read)


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Re: Lyme Disease Anyone Recovered? [Re: 2141zach]
    #23599442 -

It's been fortunately quite a few years since I had lyme and babesia.

I did a long course of doxycycline.  (Blech, plus sunburn.)  I did about a month of IV Rocephin.  Then a period of high dose amoxicillin + probenecid, then Zithromax/Biaxin combination. Some Flagyl too but I could barely tolerate it. Treatment for babesia is a standard Mepron/Zithromax/Artemisinin regimen. It had to be repeated twice to clear the infection from my blood.  I was on antibiotics about a year and a half.  It was a good six months in before I began to get better. 

I believe there is a place for alternative medicines.  Artemisinin is one such and it's an important part of treating babesiosis.  I took heavy duty probiotics all through treatment.  I grow and consume lion's mane capsules and also reishi and shiitake extracts.  I believe they boost your immune system and help you stay well, and lion's mane can actually re-grow damaged neural connections. However, without antibiotics I seriously doubt you can cure lyme disease. 

Finding a doctor who treats according to ILADS guidelines might be the most important thing you can ever do for yourself.

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