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Shop: North Spore Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader?
    #22700458 -

Any Carl Jung books to read after you come down from a nice high?


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I am so small I can barely be seen.
How can this great love be inside me?

Look at your eyes. They are small,
but they see enormous things.

(Rumi)

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: LoveLightPeace]
    #22700484 -

Hard cover only. Paperback has no pictures and those MAKE the book:  http://www.amazon.com/Man-His-Symbols-Carl-Jung/dp/B0055RZ9KE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1451117647&sr=8-2&keywords=man+and+his+symbols


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22700727 -

"the red book" is a fascinating insight on jung's personal thoughts. both editions of this book are simply beautiful.
also, "the seven sermons to the dead" - which i believe is also present in the red book series - is a small yet really interesting work written by him as well.


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"the lips of wisdom are closed, except to the ears of understanding."
the kybalion

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: kaaos]
    #22701937 -

Yes, I'd have to agree with you there. That would be a more powerful visual experience. Man and His Symbols in hardcover is the one book someone should own if they never buy another book on Jung.


https://aras.org/sites/default/files/docs/00033Sherry.pdf


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

Edited by MarkostheGnostic (12/26/15 05:19 PM)

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22702944 -

Carl Jung is complicated reading, and generally a lot of his ideas aren't supported today. I don't think modern psychology really takes dreams seriously. That said, every book is full of brilliant words from a brilliant mind.

On top of the already-suggested, try Psychology Of The Unconscious if you want to get a bit more in depth.


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My solitude...
My shield...
My armour...

TESTED
WITH
FULL
FORCE

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: circastes]
    #22703842 -

"Modern psychology" has long been heavily biased in materialistic idioms. Behaviorism denied the existence of mind! I have found dream analysis to be quite revealing at times, but long-term psychotherapy is a problem in this age of managed care. It's the nuts-and-bolts of getting paid that is the problem, not the efficacy of dream analysis.

As for me, I'm a post-Jungian, having been rejected from analytical training as far back as 1991 (along with all applicants from Miami. The interviews were conducted in Memphis. All the TN applicants were accepted). Following that rejection, which required a minimum of 100 hours of analysis (which I received from 3 Zurich-trained analysts over 8 years), not to mention 100 documented seminar hours, I took what was useful for my own growth and whatever I could do for others outside the role of Jungian analyst. Synchronistically, I purchased the complete Collected Works of C.G. Jung in 1980 which cost exactly to the dollar, the amount that I got back from the IRS that year - $629. It was a pricey purchase for a very poor graduate student.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: LoveLightPeace]
    #22721133 -

Get The Portable Jung, which I think Joseph Campbell edited. If you like that, get one of the full publications. If not, you're probably not going to find stuff elsewhere in Jung's work that you'll really enjoy.


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Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: EllisDSox]
    #22725949 -

Terence Recommended to his brother to read "Psychology and Alchemy" before taking LSD for the first time. Dennis said that, after reading it, he understood why Terence recommended it.

Not sure it would be as valuable after coming down though.

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: secondorder]
    #22727793 -

There is also Alchemical Studies. Terrence was probably addressing Dennis' background in biochemistry/chemistry, and wanted him to appreciate some of the archetypal elements that alchemy highlighted. Jung however never addressed the value of doing actual laboratory alchemy along metaphysical lines. He insisted that he could make nothing of metaphysics unless it was translated down to psychology where he could avail himself of its teachings. But, for example, the idea of actually projecting or charging (using both psychological and magickal terms) a plant stone, for example, with one's psychic contents, then imbibing that stone for psychological effects was outside of Jung's purview. Terrance didn't practice laboratory alchemy or spagyrics either that I'm aware of. Maybe he thought Dennis might pursue such practices, or maybe he just wanted to introduce him to Jung's take on alchemy. :shrug:


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: LoveLightPeace]
    #22727810 -

anyone into symbolism might enjoy this possibly related material

regarding: Hieronymus Bosch garden of earthly delights

images and text here

http://www.esotericbosch.com/Garden.htm

overview here

http://www.leevanlaer.com/TheEsotericBosch1.html

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: laughingdog]
    #22728208 -

For people who are really into this triptych, this link below. My 3nd Jungian analyst, Rev. Dr. Roger Radloff (deceased) fell down some stairs at the Prado in Spain, and when he looked up, he was on the floor in front of The Garden of Earthly Delights (a little Jungian story to connect this Jungian thread with your post). :wink:

http://www.talariaenterprises.com/product_lists/parastone/bosch-garden-earthly-deli.html


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22728376 -

Do you know if Psychology & Alchemy, Alchemical Studies and Mysterium Coniunctionis were chronologically compiled or if they all include writings from different periods? He was dead before any were published, I think, and I've seen people complain that the Bollingden series is completely anachronistic at points.


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Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: EllisDSox]
    #22732586 -

That's a good question. I'd have to open those volumes and see if the inclusions are chronological.....

Volume 12, Psychology and Alchemy, Jung wrote a foreward which says that the book contains two major studies that were first printed for the Eranos-Jahrbuch for 1935-1936. 

Volume 13, Alchemical Studies say on the front flap that this volume contains 5 essays tracing Jung's interest in alchemy from 1929 onwards and "may be read both as a useful introduction and a valuable supplement to his major works on the subject, Psychology and Alchemy, Aion, and the monumental Mysterium Conjunctionis."

Volume 14, Mysterium Conjunctionis, says on the front flap that this was originally published in two volumes in German in 1955 and 1956.

Each essay in these volumes is not dated, but I do have the 3 sitting on my lap with the laptop so that I could give you some kind of answer.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22733504 -

Don't worry about it if it's gonna be any effort. I have all three, but they're different editions and I think they only give the dating for the Bollingden publications. Jung is a strange man. A lot of the time he's one of the few people willing to carry out critical analysis in fields dominated by phonies and morons, but some of the time he seems like he was just insane. When he starts getting into the I Ching, things get a bit weird.

You ever read any Kierkegaard? I thought I somewhat understood what he was really about until the last few days.


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Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: EllisDSox]
    #22734072 -

I've read a lot more Jungian material: Introduced by Parapsychologist/Egyptologist Bob Brier in college, formal course in Drew University seminary around 1977, worked under the only Jungian in the state of Maryland at the time as a grad assistant for two years, but was under his tutelage for 3 years, then went into formal analysis for 5 years under two other Zurich-trained analysts in Florida beginning in 1986. I have 100 hours of seminars under international Jungian analysts, but I don't consider myself a Jungian (basically since I, and everyone else who applied for analytical training from Miami was rejected in Memphis. Political bullshit. Just as well, though (read Richard Noll's books Aryan Christ and The Jung Cult. He apparently was dealt with similarly).

Jung's work is seminal and important, but there is a major hole in his thinking. He wrote that consciousness was LOST to the extent that it was transcended (in preface to The Tibetan Book of the Great Liberation by Evans-Wentz). Jung's psychology therefore does not admit of Superconsciousness, samadhi. In fact he refused to meet Ramana Maharshi in India, marginalizing him by saying "I know the type." Sri ramana would've torn Jung a new asshole philosophically. If anything, I've become more of a 'Grofian.' Stan Grof does use Freud's and Jung's contributions, and rightly so, but Transpersonal Psychology goes beyond Jung in its recognition of Superconscious states. Moreover, although Jung didn't speak to the issue of psychedelics (Marie Louise-von Franz commented that she didn't think Jung would've approved of Mescaline), Grof's work lauds the use of LSD and his system is built from his observations of the psychedelic experience. The Jungians I interviewed with obviously held my admitted use of psychedelics in contempt. I believe that was their main objection to me. Fuck 'em.

I was introduced to Kierkegaard in seminary in 1976. The last book I read of his was The Concept of Anxiety during the summer of 2013, just after I lost my job of 28 years, and I was suffering profound anxiety. The book didn't really help my anxiety. (The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle did however, but that book is ontological in nature, whereas Kierkegaard is sometimes called a Christian existentialist).

I have a complete hardcopy set of the Collected Works, but it's the same thing, copyright dates are different all in the same set. You can see the set in black just under the mantle clock in this pic:


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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22734526 -

Were/are you a rabbi/priest/theologian? Seems like you got disillusioned with psychiatric circles and veered more towards religion, based on the few times I've spoken to you. You gave me a ton of gnostic works to read a couple of years ago, so thanks for that.

The only works of Kierkegaard that are really inspiring are the 'indirect' ones and the sermons, really. The psychological analyses are amazingly accurate given that he died around the time Freud was born, but neither of the psychological works are particularly uplifting.

I'm surprised to hear Jung would avoid Maharshi like that. Was it a matter of racism or what? I've never really looked much into Jung's life. I know he was fairly shitty to his wife and had incredibly odd relationships with a lot of his patients (maybe this led to the sort of Jungian cults you encountered), but I've heard some pretty dark things way beyond these. I'm not sure he was any more of a Nazi than the average person of his time and place, but he was certainly no saint.

Either way, Grof definitely seems to have gone further. I tend to take him more seriously than most psychologists because he started from such a cynical, purely Freudian perspective and developed his conceptions entirely from clinical experience. Most well known psychologists seem to have a preexisting view of how the psyche works and then just read all of their experiences in terms of this. Ernest Becker is an interesting one, but he's kind of bleak in his conclusions. Maybe he's entirely right about the state of humanity, but at least in the Denial of Death he seems to basically state that the vast majority of people are cowards who would be shattered to the core if they came anywhere close to apprehending their own condition.

I guess Kierkegaard effectively says the same thing, but at least parts of his work are incredibly motivational. The more I read him, though, the more it seems that he was at least partially insane. The transformation of the self he proposes seems to be more radical than anything psychology or mysticism has ever suggested and it's really not clear whether he deliberately created a view of Christianity that was unattainable or if he thought that this kind of transformation was possible. It's definitely not a hopeful sign that the most eminent scholars who have dedicated their lives to his works tend to admit that they don't really know quite what the fuck he was really driving at.


--------------------
Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: EllisDSox]
    #22737545 -

No, never a clergyman. I was introduced to Gnostic religion at the United Methodist seminary of Drew University in 1976. That was shortly after I had, as a young Jewish man, taking catechism and been baptized at the local Catholic Church. As I moved through seminary, concentrating on psychology and religion, I moved to the discipline of psychology for practical purposes. I had problems getting into a strictly clinical program because I held degrees in philosophy and theology, but I did get licensed as a Mental Health Counselor and got certified some specialty disciplines including Clinical Hypnotherapy. Psychiatry is a medical specialty and over the decades psychiatry has become more a matter of medicine management than psychotherapy.

I wonder if Ken Wilbur read Becker, because Wilber's "Atman Project" as facsimile forms of personal immortality seem to have a foundation in Becker's work. Personal immortality is not the metaphysics of Christian theology, yet the unsophisticated multitudes hold very many fantasies of an after-life, much like an endless church picnic of extended families in a flowered meadow. :puke:

As to Kierkegaard, I had a scholarly professor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_C._Oden who was stoked on him. I still find his book The Structure of Awareness mind-boggling, where leaning heavily on Kierkegard's Fear and Trembling: The Sickness Unto Death, he attempts to illustrate the impossibility of such existential problems as despair, anxiety, and boredom if we view ourselves as God sees us rather than a pure phenomenology of these malaises. Mind-boggling, but heavily based on a faith-stance as put forth by Kierkegaard. A couple other of Oden's books were influential too.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22739052 -

MarkostheGnostic said:
For people who are really into this triptych, this link below. My 3nd Jungian analyst, Rev. Dr. Roger Radloff (deceased) fell down some stairs at the Prado in Spain, and when he looked up, he was on the floor in front of The Garden of Earthly Delights (a little Jungian story to connect this Jungian thread with your post). :wink:

http://www.talariaenterprises.com/product_lists/parastone/bosch-garden-earthly-deli.html


yes those are cute but expensive collectables

Hieronymus Bosch is interesting to me because he functions almost as a Rorschach test,  the interpretations may say more about the interpreter than about Bosch…

for example the
SECRET HERESY OF HIERONYMUS BOSCH by
(editorial review quote: "Lynda Harris offers surprising new insights into Bosch's detailed and cryptic visual fantasies. Drawing on a wide variety of new sources, she deciphers Bosch's symbolism as the hidden expression of his heretical religious beliefs. She argues that Bosch belonged to the Cathar faith, a Manichean religious heresy that was persecuted and driven underground by the Catholic church in the Middle Ages.")

for detailed criticism see

http://www.alchemywebsite.com/bosch/Interpretation_Harris.html

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: laughingdog]
    #22739570 -

Hieronymus Bosch is interesting to me because he functions almost as a Rorschach test,  the interpretations may say more about the interpreter than about Bosch…

for example the
SECRET HERESY OF HIERONYMUS BOSCH by
(editorial review quote: "Lynda Harris offers surprising new insights into Bosch's detailed and cryptic visual fantasies. Drawing on a wide variety of new sources, she deciphers Bosch's symbolism as the hidden expression of his heretical religious beliefs. She argues that Bosch belonged to the Cathar faith, a Manichean religious heresy that was persecuted and driven underground by the Catholic church in the Middle Ages.")

for detailed criticism see

http://www.alchemywebsite.com/bosch/Interpretation_Harris.html


Interesting. I'll look into it. There is also this book:  http://www.amazon.com/Leap-Terry-Tempest-Williams/dp/0679752579/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1452022542&sr=8-1&keywords=leap+terry+tempest+williams
I would have to say that the scatological references abound in Hell, with the Chief Devil is sitting on an elevated commode, eating beings and shitting them into a cesspool below. All very Freudian Thanatos-related psychoanalytical themes where death-decay-defecation are intimately entwined.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Any Carl Jung book recommendations for the average reader? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #22739894 -

"Hieronymus Bosch is interesting to me because he functions almost as a Rorschach test,  the interpretations may say more about the interpreter than about Bosch…"

can one say why this is without becoming an interpreter?

maybe yes and no...

that interpretations, descriptions, and meanings are only a pale generalization of experience is a zen sort of truism

as to why this particular painting fascinates, over the centuries, it would seem precisely because it cannot be authoritatively pinned down…it allows  each person to be tickled differently…

and how Bosch achieved  this wonderful ambiguity, while giving a lot more content than say the surrealist painters, is partly explainable, but fortunately not entirely, imo.

And that he did something so revolutionary, so long ago, (during very repressive times), before modern art became, to a large extent, about pushing boundaries, is also an historical enigma.

Bosch certainly continues to inspire, as in the book you refer to, but I don't think I can stomach a Mormon.

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