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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: Konyap]
    #19917467 -

Cannabis isn't necessarily a cure, but cannabis is nearly 500 different cannabinoids currently grown expressly for getting high, not for medicinal use (barring CO and WA). Cannabidiol is the more effective anti-oxidant/anti-inflammatory cannabinoid and is minimally psychoactive, and is cited by a number of NIH studies for it's cancer killing properties, amongst other uses including anxiolytic and neuroprotective effects. It's not necessarily intentional malevolence on the part of the government, more than likely it's just ignorance and fear. We didn't have science about this stuff really until the last decade, and frankly, all research science takes a while to get implemented even into technology or medicine, and policy takes longer than that. If cultivated to maximize cancer fighting properties, I could see it being very effective on its own or as a complementary treatment to current methods. In its present form, you're probably better off taking large doses of cannabidiol extracts than getting stoned. It's expensive, but chemo/radiation is as well.

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: Xingu]
    #19917481 -

I believe that some natural substances are a threat to big pharma, such as kratom, and cannabis.

just as hemp, was a threat to some industries, thus it was made illegal.


i do not however, think that big pharma is hiding the  cure for cancer.


--------------------
No sympathy for the devil, keep that in mind.
[url=
]Buy the ticket, take the ride. [/url]
Are you lost?

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19918195 -

plambe said:
....and ignores the possibility to use cannabis since it can't be patented.


I really don't have any clue as to how patents and what not work, what can or can not be patented....but the U.S.Health and Human Services holds "US Patent 6,630,507 Cannabinoids as Antioxidants and Neuroprotectants" .






Quote:
The U.S. Patent Office issued patent #6630507 to the U.S.Health and Human Services filed on 2/2/2001. The patent lists the use of certain cannabinoids found within the cannabis sativa plant as useful in certain neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, and HIV dementia.


United States Patent and Trademark Office

http://www.google.com/patents/US6630507

US Patent 6,630,507  Cannabinoids as Antioxidants and Neuroprotectants

"Cannabinoids have been found to have antioxidant properties, unrelated to NMDA receptor antagonism. This new found property makes cannabinoids useful in the treatment and prophylaxis of wide variety of oxidation associated diseases, such as ischemic, age-related, inflammatory and autoimmune diseases. The cannabinoids are found to have particular application as neuroprotectants, for example in limiting neurological damage following ischemic insults, such as stroke and trauma, or in the treatment of neurodegenerative diseases, such as Alzheimer's disease, Parkinson's disease and HIV dementia. Nonpsychoactive cannabinoids, such as cannabidoil, are particularly advantageous to use because they avoid toxicity that is encountered with psychoactive cannabinoids at high doses useful in the method of the present invention."








-OM


.


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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: Pretty Lights]
    #19920031 -

fee said:
Gorlax said:
Stupid. You know how much money a cure for either would make?! but of course no matter how much you explain to someone they will continue to blanket everything with it's a "conspiracy". That shit is for simple minded people.



There's far more money on treating someone compared to curing them.


Thats the kind of conspiracy type thinking I'm talking about. I keep wondering why drug users are the most likely to believe this line of reasoning. Consider company A develops a cure for cancer, they may choose to keep it secret, never reveal it to the public and keep pushing their therapy medication. However if company B discovers the cure and choose to sell it then company A would lose money big time. Also why on earth would anyone choose to pay for mind numbing, spirit crushing therapy when they can go and buy the cure Either way people get cancer at an alarming rate and they will continue to get cancer especially seeing how the average life expectancy has increased over the past decades (the older you get the more likely you are to get cancer). I think cancer is far too complex set of diseases to cure with a one shot medicine, thats why suppression therapy is more prevalent at this stage. Again this line of reasoning is offensive to the scientists who have dedicates their lives and career to cancer research.

TheGreenArrow said:
Rick Simpson had something like a 94% efficiency rating with topical application on skin cancer.


Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Internet anecdotes and youtube videos are not extraordinary evidence.

TheGreenArrow said:
That's why forums like this and across the internet are going to change the sociopolitical landscape.  Because people can talk to each other without fear of reprisal.


No, thats why the NSA will continue with its path towards establishing a totalitarian society. Tho I agree that online forums and chatrooms provide a false sense of security and heightened self-esteem in regard to saying things that you normally wouldn't consider mentioning IRL.

TheGreenArrow said:
It's an effective treatment.


It may be a treatment. I wouldn't go as far as saying its effective. If it was effective pharmaceutical companies would have developed hydrophilic cannabinoids that can't pass the blood-brain barrier so that they won't get you high but still exert their therapeutic action on a cancer thats outside the CNS. Even tho I don't believe its an effective treatment I do think that patients undergoing chemotherapy could benefit immensely from cannabis preparations from what I've read in peer-reviewed journals.

Pretty Lights said:
If these companies and governments really cared they would let people be happy with a choice that could be debated until their end, rather than torture them with meds that are far from perfect and annihilate any happiness to be had in those trying times.


No one is forcing you to take cancer meds, its your choice but the law ain't gonna change just because you're dying. How much do you actually know about cancer meds and their mode of action as opposed to cannabis and its effectiveness?


--------------------
Barbiturate Research Division

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920049 -

Quote:
Thats the kind of conspiracy type thinking I'm talking about. I keep wondering why drug users are the most likely to believe this line of reasoning


Breaking Bad?


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http://bunkpolice.com/basic-test-kit/
Vienna Declaration
Salvia Divinorum The Docudrahma

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920078 -

plambe said:
fee said:
Gorlax said:
Stupid. You know how much money a cure for either would make?! but of course no matter how much you explain to someone they will continue to blanket everything with it's a "conspiracy". That shit is for simple minded people.



There's far more money on treating someone compared to curing them.


Thats the kind of conspiracy type thinking I'm talking about. I keep wondering why drug users are the most likely to believe this line of reasoning. Consider company A develops a cure for cancer, they may choose to keep it secret, never reveal it to the public and keep pushing their therapy medication. However if company B discovers the cure and choose to sell it then company A would lose money big time. Also why on earth would anyone choose to pay for mind numbing, spirit crushing therapy when they can go and buy the cure Either way people get cancer at an alarming rate and they will continue to get cancer especially seeing how the average life expectancy has increased over the past decades (the older you get the more likely you are to get cancer). I think cancer is far too complex set of diseases to cure with a one shot medicine, thats why suppression therapy is more prevalent at this stage. Again this line of reasoning is offensive to the scientists who have dedicates their lives and career to cancer research.



There is some truth to the idea that drug companies won't want to deal with substances that require one time use. Many companies don't want to put funds into R&D for vaccines because they require a one time use and are not as profitable. Plus there are super viruses and shit so they need to perpetuate their research as they come along.

I honestly don't know what to think when it comes to these cancer claims. It isn't just all youtube anecdotes but its not like people are being cured by the thousands.

Stamets claimed to have cured his mothers cancer with turkey tail and I wonder the efficacy of this as well.

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920130 -

So basically your line of reasoning is that if it worked, big pharma would pick it up?  You sound like you haven't looked anything up.  All it would take is googling Rick Simpson's hemp oil; nobody here is your intern man, go do your own research its not that hard to find.  Don't be afraid to be wrong just go into it with an open mind.
Its not as if there aren't other exmples of effective treatments for cancer that are suppressed.  Look up the Gerson (I think) treatment that they have to do in Mexico, even though its mostly diet change they still will not let it be done in the US.  Why do you think that is? 

This is just one example of how pharma stops effective treatment.  Look up ibogaine addiction therapy, ask yourself "why wouldn't pharma look into a drug that basically stops opiate addiction in its tracks?".  There isn't any money in the cure, but there is a buukoos of cash in treatment.
Look the moment my whole outlook on cannabis took on a new light was when I was in Vancuuver.  I watched a man with MS struggling to hobble down the hastings street.  Saw the pain in his eyes as he opened the door to the Amsterdam Cafe.  I knew the man was familiar with the constant agony of just trying to walk.  I also saw the relief in him once he got a bowl going.  Since that day I've looked at my own Cannabis use and decided to only use it medically when I needed it.  Whether or not you believe it, it is effective medicine.  And :facepalm: to the fact you can't do a little research. When people like that are suffering in the US.  I guarantee if you had cancer you'd look into it. Honestly shame on you.  Just because it doesn't effect you personally, you can't be bothered?  This will be an important landmark in history if we can make cannabis legal.  Don't be part of the gaggle of asshats.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #19920173 -

I am not convinced by claims regarding Rick Simpsons' achievements. We don't know the medical diagnosis those patients had, what stage the cancer was at, the disease outlook, what other medications they had received, the composition of the cannabis preparation they got etc. Also you hear about success stories but what about failures. I think people who claim to have cured cancer with cannabis preparations skew the picture by presenting only their best cases. You need to reconsider your ability to look at evidence critically.

And stop telling me I'm not doing research because what you consider research is a biased, flawed approach at best relying on internet anecdotes. As a matter of fact I do my research in the lab and I can tell you with 100% certainty that without proper controls and statistically significant values them results are completely useless. For example I take cancer cells and give them drugs then look down the microscope and look at how many have responded. I can ALWAYS find cells in the treated population that have a response opposite to what the drug actually does and vice versa but I do not choose to present what I fancy, I count thousands of cells and repeat the experiment several times before I make any claims.

Also why are you talking about MS, what does it have to do with cancer? Cannabis has been widely recognized as a means of alleviating MS symptoms (and so has cannabis in terms of negating chemotherapy side effects but not actually treating cancer on a statistically significant scale).

I suggest you start reading peer-reviewed publications about cannabinoid action on cancer cells as a starter.


--------------------
Barbiturate Research Division

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920187 -

There are none because the DOJ won't approve the release of federally regulated cannabis for research.
  And no I found out about rick simpson before I ever had the internet and personally have helped my grandmother beat cancer with it.  It does work.  We do know the level of cancer these patients had as a lot of them this was their last stop before the grave.  We know exactly how the cannabis extract was made and what went into it so we do know the composition.
Like I said just because you haven't done research doesn't mean others haven't at their own expense.  Why are you so afraid of it even being an option?  I'm not making I up, go look. :facepalm:


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #19920191 -

And I threw out the MS because it should be mentioned.  People go through horrible suffering, its definely pertinent to this topic.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920204 -

plambe said:
Some of you argue that the pharmaceutical industry is actively suppressing the development of a cure for cancer and ignores the possibility to use cannabis since it can't be patented. I think this is absurd and offensive to all the researchers, health care professionals, nurses and patients dealing with cancer.

So are you one of those people?


We respect the researchers, health care professionals & nurses but we want to see the private pharmaceutical industry burned to the ground. For the simple reason that more bad than good can come from a pharmaceutical whose main goal is profit.
Drugs are like arms, electric, water, communications. U cannot leave them in private hands 100%.

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19920231 -

The fact that its still a schedule 1 substance is staggering.  The fact the research is suppressed points to the realization that somebody has financial interest in keeping it illegal.  But its not as if pharma are the only ones to gain, look at the privitized prison complexes we've built to house those inmates.  Its modern day slavery, and if you'd seen the atrocities pulled in places like Texas and Louisianna it'd make you cringe that humans are so fucking callous.

Its Dope-ism, much like racism in the US.  If it proved anything in the civil rights era its this; Untill people stand up and take your rights nobody will just hand them to you.  Part of that is seeing the propaganda machine for what it is.  Go enlighten yourself.  Cannabis has been used medicinally and shamanically for thousands of years at this point.
Shit look at it, the simple gangeese river flower has evolved alongside of us.  Look at how far its come even in the past 30 years, and most of that was through black market growers.  Its going to be huge when people finally take back their birthrights as humans on this earth.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #19920342 -

Cannabis should be legal nationally, end of story. The fact that it's still schedule 1 is a sad sad joke :sadyes: Same goes for psychs


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Pull the blinds and change their minds....

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: TheGreenArrow]
    #19921667 -

TheGreenArrow said:
There are none because the DOJ won't approve the release of federally regulated cannabis for research.



You do realize that the US is not the only country in the world, right? Cancer Research UK has been funding cannabinoid experiments and some promising results have emerged but nothing ground breaking.

TheGreenArrow said:
We do know the level of cancer these patients had



Level of cancer? Do you mean grade or what? Also I seriously doubt you know how many people who took cannabis actually benefited from it. If you're going to make claims and want to be taken seriously you might as well include links to your source.

TheGreenArrow said:
We know exactly how the cannabis extract was made and what went into it so we do know the composition.


Uhm what? Thats ridiculous, you can't tell whats inside just by knowing how it was prepared. Thats just plain, unadulterated BS. IMO you're a troll so either post links to see what you base your 'research' on or stop trolling.


--------------------
Barbiturate Research Division

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19921700 -

Quote:
So are you one of those people?


Best question of the year award.

:einstein:

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: lazyfingers]
    #19921792 -

Quote:
I seriously doubt you know how many people who took cannabis actually benefited from it. If you're going to make claims and want to be taken seriously you might as well include links to your source.


You are a troll. I pulled this off of the national cancer institutes website:

Quote:
The potential benefits of medicinal Cannabis for people living with cancer include antiemetic effects, appetite stimulation, pain relief, and improved sleep. Although few relevant surveys of practice patterns exist, it appears that physicians caring for cancer patients in the United States who recommend medicinal Cannabis predominantly do so for symptom management.


And thats coming straight from the government.

What is being debated is the curative properties of marijuana vs. cancer not if people benefit because thousands of people benefit from using cannabis.

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: cannabinated]
    #19921847 -

cannabinated said:
Quote:
I seriously doubt you know how many people who took cannabis actually benefited from it. If you're going to make claims and want to be taken seriously you might as well include links to your source.


You are a troll. I pulled this off of the national cancer institutes website:

Quote:
The potential benefits of medicinal Cannabis for people living with cancer include antiemetic effects, appetite stimulation, pain relief, and improved sleep. Although few relevant surveys of practice patterns exist, it appears that physicians caring for cancer patients in the United States who recommend medicinal Cannabis predominantly do so for symptom management.


And thats coming straight from the government.

What is being debated is the curative properties of marijuana vs. cancer not if people benefit because thousands of people benefit from using cannabis.


And you're retarded because I already acknowledged this part about cancer management and cannabis.


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Barbiturate Research Division

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19921876 -

you mentioned MS and chemo not alleviation of symptoms.

anyway you're a tard for using the word retarded in a debate  :shrug:

nuthurt

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: cannabinated]
    #19921921 -

Do you know why cancer patients have a fucked up appetite?


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Barbiturate Research Division

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Re: Cannabis, cancer and global pharmaceutical conspiracy [Re: plambe]
    #19921966 -

cause of chemo. I thought you knew that?

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