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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17991103 -

Look at all you tough guys arguing with one another over the internet. :laugh2:


--------------------


Fuck the King's Guard. Fuck the city. Fuck the King.
-The Hound

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Kavince]
    #17991132 -

Kavince said:
Look at all you tough guys arguing with one another over the internet. :laugh2:

The life of a keyboard-warrior is one of glory and satisfaction.


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All of my posts are works of fiction, and any questions I might have are hypothetical.

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17992400 -

Neurons don't produce consciousness, consciousness is all there is. If you take a lot of psychs you should realise by now that science has no idea. Not putting science down, but it had no idea in the 16th, 17th, 18th etc. century, it has no idea in this century.

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17992474 -

Awww...

Another youngster coming to The Shroomery to tell us how things really are.

Morals are a human creation. In that sense they do exist. Society is built upon moral standards.

Is there right or wrong? Well? They too are human creations.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Rose]
    #17992568 -

i could sift through all of the pages here, & have a couple... but really, OP?.. yr gonna take a stab at folks open-mindedness, then  declare your truth to be undeniable, all within the title of a post you ostensibly wanted people to read?.. not really a solid philosophical model...

as for right & wrong, sure they can be subjective... a man may decide that it's not wrong to steal from me... but then he better be prepared to accept the rightness of me knocking the fuck out of him... that isn't the world i want to live in, so i chose to stick to a higher ground,& call myself doing good...


--------------------
“I read somewhere that 77 per cent of all the mentally ill live in poverty. Actually, I’m more intrigued by the 23 per cent who are apparently doing quite well for themselves.” 
  ~ St. Jerome of Marin
:gd_icon:the bus come by & i got on, that's when it all began:gd_icon:


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Rose]
    #17992613 -

Cervantes said:
Awww...

Another youngster coming to The Shroomery to tell us how things really are.

Morals are a human creation. In that sense they do exist. Society is built upon moral standards.

Is there right or wrong? Well? They too are human creations.

Shudup you I'm the boss.


--------------------
All of my posts are works of fiction, and any questions I might have are hypothetical.

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17992758 -

Ganjustice said:
There is no universal moral code that we should all live by. There is no such thing as right and wrong, good and evil. There are no good people or bad people. It's all subjective. Your standard of morality is something you were taught, not a crucial part of your psyche that needs to be preserved and nurtured. Give up on those primitive ideals and truly  set your mind free.


But what do you propose to do now that your mind is free? Are you planning to implement nihilism incorporate it into your life and follow the likes of Hitler, Ian Brady, leopold and loeb, and countless other exponents of the Nietzschen nihilistic philosophy down the merry road to Treblinka? If so you might want to check first how it all turned out for those guys!

If not, then what benefit is there to be gained from freeing your mind beyond perhaps the over-compensatory, smug belief that you are highly intelligent -for knowing all this- and the rest of the world a contemptuous bunch of mindless sheep? You might have a free mind, but what good is that if like the rest of mankind you cant act freely?

Many people do indeed adopt this philosophy and fashion it into a soothing balm and superiority complex from which they derive pleasure, but then you could hardly declare that these people are any more free than the so called slaves of morality!

Have you never once been moved to tears by some act of kindness or love, or even a touching movie that you once saw? Have you never watched a mother on the news begging for the return of her kidnapped child, or weeping over her own murdered child's death? Did you not ask yourself in disbelief how in Gods name someone could possibly destroy a child that a poor mother loves just as deeply as your own mother loves you, and more importantly as deeply as you love your own mother?

And is that not what we mean by good and evil- love and hatred, or love and utter indifference?

Great debate you've started though bud!


--------------------
"I'm every nightmare you ever had. I am your worst dreams come true. I am everything you ever were afraid of."

Pennywise the dancing clown


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: wolf8312]
    #17992793 -

Then I guess you won't mind if I call you a retard, OP.

:prettyflyforawhiteguy:


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"But I don't want comfort. I want God, I want poetry, I want real danger, I want freedom, I want goodness. I want sin."

"In fact," said Mustapha Mond, "you're claiming the right to be unhappy."

"All right then," said the Savage defiantly, "I'm claiming the right to be unhappy."

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Pelidc]
    #17992798 -

Pelidc said:
Then I guess you won't mind if I call you a retard, OP.

:prettyflyforawhiteguy:

What is this? I'm furious!


--------------------
All of my posts are works of fiction, and any questions I might have are hypothetical.

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17992802 -

Ganjustice said:
Pelidc said:
Then I guess you won't mind if I call you a retard, OP.

:prettyflyforawhiteguy:

What is this? I'm furious!


:laugh: High five!


--------------------
"But I don't want comfort. I want God, I want poetry, I want real danger, I want freedom, I want goodness. I want sin."

"In fact," said Mustapha Mond, "you're claiming the right to be unhappy."

"All right then," said the Savage defiantly, "I'm claiming the right to be unhappy."

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: wolf8312]
    #17992806 -

wolf8312 said:
Ganjustice said:
There is no universal moral code that we should all live by. There is no such thing as right and wrong, good and evil. There are no good people or bad people. It's all subjective. Your standard of morality is something you were taught, not a crucial part of your psyche that needs to be preserved and nurtured. Give up on those primitive ideals and truly  set your mind free.


But what do you propose to do now that your mind is free? Are you planning to implement nihilism incorporate it into your life and follow the likes of Hitler, Ian Brady, leopold and loeb, and countless other exponents of the Nietzschen nihilistic philosophy down the merry road to Treblinka? If so you might want to check first how it all turned out for those guys!

If not, then what benefit is there to be gained from freeing your mind beyond perhaps the over-compensatory, smug belief that you are highly intelligent -for knowing all this- and the rest of the world a contemptuous bunch of mindless sheep? You might have a free mind, but what good is that if like the rest of mankind you cant act freely?

Many people do indeed adopt this philosophy and fashion it into a soothing balm and superiority complex from which they derive pleasure, but then you could hardly declare that these people are any more free than the so called slaves of morality!

Have you never once been moved to tears by some act of kindness or love, or even a touching movie that you once saw? Have you never watched a mother on the news begging for the return of her kidnapped child, or weeping over her own murdered child's death? Did you not ask yourself in disbelief how in Gods name someone could possibly destroy a child that a poor mother loves just as deeply as your own mother loves you, and more importantly as deeply as you love your own mother?

And is that not what we mean by good and evil- love and hatred, or love and utter indifference?

Great debate you've started though bud!

Nothing has ever moved me emotionally. I once cried out of frustration when a squirrel I was trying to dissect and torture slipped from my grasp and disappeared into a nearby tree though.


--------------------
All of my posts are works of fiction, and any questions I might have are hypothetical.

Edited by Ganjustice (03/22/13 12:53 AM)

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17993012 -

Quote:
Nothing has ever moved me emotionally.



But then how can you debate morality if you only understand it in terms of logic and not emotion?

You've never loved anyone? You mother or father?


--------------------
"I'm every nightmare you ever had. I am your worst dreams come true. I am everything you ever were afraid of."

Pennywise the dancing clown


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: wolf8312]
    #17993043 -

wolf8312 said:
Quote:
Nothing has ever moved me emotionally.



But then how can you debate morality if you only understand it in terms of logic and not emotion?

You've never loved anyone? You mother or father?


wolf8312 said:
Quote:
Nothing has ever moved me emotionally.



But then how can you debate morality if you only understand it in terms of logic and not emotion?

You've never loved anyone? You mother or father?

Never had a mother or a father. I was raised by a colony of termites.


--------------------
All of my posts are works of fiction, and any questions I might have are hypothetical.

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17993088 -

Ganjustice said:
wolf8312 said:
Quote:
Nothing has ever moved me emotionally.



But then how can you debate morality if you only understand it in terms of logic and not emotion?

You've never loved anyone? You mother or father?


wolf8312 said:
Quote:
Nothing has ever moved me emotionally.



But then how can you debate morality if you only understand it in terms of logic and not emotion?

You've never loved anyone? You mother or father?

Never had a mother or a father. I was raised by a colony of termites.



I'm guessing that you still live with these termites though right?


--------------------
"I'm every nightmare you ever had. I am your worst dreams come true. I am everything you ever were afraid of."

Pennywise the dancing clown


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: wolf8312]
    #17994322 -

wolf8312 said:

Nietzschen nihilistic philosophy


Pretty sure the dude was an existentialist, although existentialism is kind of a sub-genre of nihilism. Like ok there is nothing so now I'm going to create my own something out of this nothing...just sayin


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Ganjustice]
    #17996547 -

Ganjustice said:
There is no universal moral code that we should all live by. There is no such thing as right and wrong, good and evil. There are no good people or bad people. It's all subjective. Your standard of morality is something you were taught, not a crucial part of your psyche that needs to be preserved and nurtured. Give up on those primitive ideals and truly  set your mind free.


How does morality being learned have anything at all to do with it's existence? You say 'your standard of morality is something you were taught', like for some reason that is proof of it's non-existence. That doesn't make any sense. That is like saying somebody is taught chemistry, but since that knowledge didn't already exist in their head when they were born, chemistry isn't real.

Why does morality being learned make it any less real? Besides stroking your ego and making it painfully obvious that you aren't as wise as you think you are, what was the point of this post OP? What point are you trying to make?

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: leon trout]
    #17996594 -

v

Edited by ADSUMONE (04/16/13 01:17 PM)

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: ADSUMONE]
    #17996679 -

You guys are right, OP might've said it in a shitty way, but I believe what he says.  In the end everything is the cause of everything else.  Nothing is inherently evil, with the exception of something that denies the laws of existence.  Anything that slows the evolution of consciousness and the expansion of the universe, to me would be the loose definition of "evil" if there is one.


--------------------
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an
invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, conn a ship, write a
sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the
dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve an
equation, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a
computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.
Specialization is for insects.- Robert A. Heinlein
Saint RedBow of the Shroomey Loomey-Patron Saint of Sandbaggin Sumbitchs

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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: Shroomey Toons]
    #17997120 -

Shroomey Toons said:
wolf8312 said:

Nietzschen nihilistic philosophy


Pretty sure the dude was an existentialist, although existentialism is kind of a sub-genre of nihilism. Like ok there is nothing so now I'm going to create my own something out of this nothing...just sayin


The OP's initial sentence was pretty nihilistic or rather morally relativistic, as it pertained to the belief that good and evil were mere constructs of the mind. 

Existentialism I think is more about how all roads lead to death. As everything you do, say, and remember will we wiped out by death, one comes to the bleak conclusion that life is ultimately pointless.This realization though -that big picture wise life is a meaningless joke- does tend to make one look about for what else is meaningless...

Nihilism and moral relativism would actually IMO be the sub genre and side effect of existentialism. For me it kind of goes in order- existentialism first, then relativism and then finally nihilism, if that makes any sense! But you are right and I too believe they are all one and the same thing essentially all tied together.

Its also heavily tied up in religion and the ideas that if there is no god or higher authority then humans themselves can decide what is good and evil.One has to admit its a pretty logical perception giving that we are animals who actively evolved by way of evil.

That said there's no need to get up on a high horse just because ones stumbled over Nietzsche for the first time! I'm sure there are plenty of people here too who have been through this phrase, and countless more who will grow out of it eventually! Cut and paste job!


--------------------
"I'm every nightmare you ever had. I am your worst dreams come true. I am everything you ever were afraid of."

Pennywise the dancing clown


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Re: Even such open-minded folks as yourselves have trouble grasping this undeniable fact. [Re: wolf8312]
    #17997218 -

I wasn't talking about the the OP, I was referring to Nietzsche.

Yes your right when I was a young man of 19, Nietzsche was a great 'phrase'. Also your confusing Existentialism with Absurdism.

Ok I'll get off my high horse now.


--------------------

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